Patriots 2023 Season

[Goldstar88]

Part of me wonders if Kraft needs to go to. The guy hates change, and needs familiarity. Why not go outside the organization for a head coach and GM? Also, Kraft is the one who hamstrung Belichick with a budget, and never let Bill forget about the one time he let Bill go over the budget a few years ago.

That year Bob gave Bill his checkbook was a disaster, though. Basically set the money on fire. Jonnu Smith and Nelson Agholor signings in particular. 

Smith had almost as many receptions this year in Atlanta as he did in the 2 years in NE. He had more yards and more TD's.  Perhaps the problem in NE was coaching and not Smith.

He’s a mediocre player at best. Even if Smith put up 580yards/3TD’s like he did this year; it would still have been poor production considering what they were paying him.

[celticsclay]

Part of me wonders if Kraft needs to go to. The guy hates change, and needs familiarity. Why not go outside the organization for a head coach and GM? Also, Kraft is the one who hamstrung Belichick with a budget, and never let Bill forget about the one time he let Bill go over the budget a few years ago.

That year Bob gave Bill his checkbook was a disaster, though. Basically set the money on fire. Jonnu Smith and Nelson Agholor signings in particular. 

Smith had almost as many receptions this year in Atlanta as he did in the 2 years in NE. He had more yards and more TD's.  Perhaps the problem in NE was coaching and not Smith.

He’s a mediocre player at best. Even if Smith put up 580yards/3TD’s like he did this year; it would still have been poor production considering what they were paying him.

Yeah the smith contract was a disaster even if he performed a little better in Atlanta. Never thought someone would try to imply
It was anything but awful.

[Moranis]

Part of me wonders if Kraft needs to go to. The guy hates change, and needs familiarity. Why not go outside the organization for a head coach and GM? Also, Kraft is the one who hamstrung Belichick with a budget, and never let Bill forget about the one time he let Bill go over the budget a few years ago.

That year Bob gave Bill his checkbook was a disaster, though. Basically set the money on fire. Jonnu Smith and Nelson Agholor signings in particular. 

Smith had almost as many receptions this year in Atlanta as he did in the 2 years in NE. He had more yards and more TD's.  Perhaps the problem in NE was coaching and not Smith.

He’s a mediocre player at best. Even if Smith put up 580yards/3TD’s like he did this year; it would still have been poor production considering what they were paying him.

that is fair. He is mediocre, but he wasn't even that in NE.  He was appreciably worse.

[SHAQATTACK]

From afar a non Pats fan ,  they need a clean slate and maybe get better planners in the the FO . Tom and Bill era is not likely to repeat for a very long time.  After colts moved to Indy I was devastated.  Took a long time to get the right people in place.  I think they are knockin* on the door again this year.

[Goldstar88]

 

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

[green_bballers13]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

[Phantom255x]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

Sorry but Kraft is also to blame for that whole debacle. He's the freakin' owner. If he really wanted Brady, he'd let it happen. Otherwise, Kraft should also be blamed for giving Belichick this much power to begin with.

Kraft is gonna be spotlighted hard this offseason. The spending, free agency and drafting decisions, the coaching personnel, all of that is gonna be heavily scrutinized and now there's no Brady and Belichick around to shield him. They need to make some major moves just to get buzz back because there honestly isn't a lot of that lately with the Patriots.

[SparzWizard]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

Sorry but Kraft is also to blame for that whole debacle. He's the freakin' owner. If he really wanted Brady, he'd let it happen. Otherwise, Kraft should also be blamed for giving Belichick this much power to begin with.

Kraft is gonna be spotlighted hard this offseason. The spending, free agency and drafting decisions, the coaching personnel, all of that is gonna be heavily scrutinized and now there's no Brady and Belichick around to shield him. They need to make some major moves just to get buzz back because there honestly isn't a lot of that lately with the Patriots.

It's time to get rid of Robert Kraft too if nothing gets done. Sell the team.

[green_bballers13]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

Sorry but Kraft is also to blame for that whole debacle. He's the freakin' owner. If he really wanted Brady, he'd let it happen. Otherwise, Kraft should also be blamed for giving Belichick this much power to begin with.

Kraft is gonna be spotlighted hard this offseason. The spending, free agency and drafting decisions, the coaching personnel, all of that is gonna be heavily scrutinized and now there's no Brady and Belichick around to shield him. They need to make some major moves just to get buzz back because there honestly isn't a lot of that lately with the Patriots.

I think only Jerry Jones is as involved as Bob Kraft. So the GM is responsible for the team in 30 out of 32 markets? It has often been said that great owners let the football people make decisions. Sure, Kraft could have trumped Belichick here, but I don't think that was likely.

[Vermont Green]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

I agree.  I find it entirely believable that Belichick told Kraft that he didn't think Brady could play anymore.  Whether Kraft could have or should have not listened to Belichick is something entirely different.  That is likely what Bill told Kraft and it turned out to be very wrong.  Kraft now is holding that against Belichick, and letting it be known to the world.

[johnnygreen]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

I agree.  I find it entirely believable that Belichick told Kraft that he didn't think Brady could play anymore.  Whether Kraft could have or should have not listened to Belichick is something entirely different.  That is likely what Bill told Kraft and it turned out to be very wrong.  Kraft now is holding that against Belichick, and letting it be known to the world.

Or did Kraft ask Bill if he thought Brady could play at an elite level for the entirety of the contract, as most likely, it would have been negotiated by Brady's agent to be fully guaranteed.

One of Bill's greatest assets was being a shield to Kraft's budget. It makes zero sense that Bill would have a self mandated budget, as it's not his money. As Felger would say, the cap is cr@p, so the budget had nothing to do with the cap.

[green_bballers13]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

I agree.  I find it entirely believable that Belichick told Kraft that he didn't think Brady could play anymore.  Whether Kraft could have or should have not listened to Belichick is something entirely different.  That is likely what Bill told Kraft and it turned out to be very wrong.  Kraft now is holding that against Belichick, and letting it be known to the world.

Or did Kraft ask Bill if he thought Brady could play at an elite level for the entirety of the contract, as most likely, it would have been negotiated by Brady's agent to be fully guaranteed.

One of Bill's greatest assets was being a shield to Kraft's budget. It makes zero sense that Bill would have a self mandated budget, as it's not his money. As Felger would say, the cap is cr@p, so the budget had nothing to do with the cap.

Either way, Bill was wrong. Tom was good enough to win a SB, as evidenced by the SB he won.

Bill, on the other hand, went 7-9, 10-7, 8-9, and 4-13 without Tom.

Bob would have been better off not listening to (or firing) Bill, even if Brady retired after two years.

[Neurotic Guy]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

I agree.  I find it entirely believable that Belichick told Kraft that he didn't think Brady could play anymore.  Whether Kraft could have or should have not listened to Belichick is something entirely different.  That is likely what Bill told Kraft and it turned out to be very wrong.  Kraft now is holding that against Belichick, and letting it be known to the world.

Or did Kraft ask Bill if he thought Brady could play at an elite level for the entirety of the contract, as most likely, it would have been negotiated by Brady's agent to be fully guaranteed.

One of Bill's greatest assets was being a shield to Kraft's budget. It makes zero sense that Bill would have a self mandated budget, as it's not his money. As Felger would say, the cap is cr@p, so the budget had nothing to do with the cap.

Either way, Bill was wrong. Tom was good enough to win a SB, as evidenced by the SB he won.

Bill, on the other hand, went 7-9, 10-7, 8-9, and 4-13 without Tom.

Bob would have been better off not listening to (or firing) Bill, even if Brady retired after two years.

It will be interesting for the ultimate argument if BB  goes and wins a SB with a talented team. 

[celticsclay]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

I agree.  I find it entirely believable that Belichick told Kraft that he didn't think Brady could play anymore.  Whether Kraft could have or should have not listened to Belichick is something entirely different.  That is likely what Bill told Kraft and it turned out to be very wrong.  Kraft now is holding that against Belichick, and letting it be known to the world.

Or did Kraft ask Bill if he thought Brady could play at an elite level for the entirety of the contract, as most likely, it would have been negotiated by Brady's agent to be fully guaranteed.

One of Bill's greatest assets was being a shield to Kraft's budget. It makes zero sense that Bill would have a self mandated budget, as it's not his money. As Felger would say, the cap is cr@p, so the budget had nothing to do with the cap.

Either way, Bill was wrong. Tom was good enough to win a SB, as evidenced by the SB he won.

Bill, on the other hand, went 7-9, 10-7, 8-9, and 4-13 without Tom.

Bob would have been better off not listening to (or firing) Bill, even if Brady retired after two years.

How much of a difference would it have made? I don’t think we win a Super Bowl with this pats roster in those two years with Brady. Maybe if Gronk, playoff Lenny and other vets all flocked here it would be possible? But that Tampa bay team has a ton of talent.

[green_bballers13]

While Robert Kraft played a hand in the star quarterback’s New England exit, the owner reportedly took aim at Bill Belichick after Brady won it all immediately after leaving the Patriots.

“Bill had told me he couldn’t play anymore, and then he goes out and wins the (expletive) Super Bowl,” Kraft said privately, according to ESPN’s Seth Wickersham and Wright Thompson.

After the 2019 season, the Patriots (GM Bill) offered Tom 2 years at $25m per season, but was structured as a one year deal. The offer was BS for the greatest QB of all time. They effectively low-balled him so that he would move on. I'm convinced that Bill thought Tom was done.

Maybe Tom was convinced that Bill was done....

I agree.  I find it entirely believable that Belichick told Kraft that he didn't think Brady could play anymore.  Whether Kraft could have or should have not listened to Belichick is something entirely different.  That is likely what Bill told Kraft and it turned out to be very wrong.  Kraft now is holding that against Belichick, and letting it be known to the world.

Or did Kraft ask Bill if he thought Brady could play at an elite level for the entirety of the contract, as most likely, it would have been negotiated by Brady's agent to be fully guaranteed.

One of Bill's greatest assets was being a shield to Kraft's budget. It makes zero sense that Bill would have a self mandated budget, as it's not his money. As Felger would say, the cap is cr@p, so the budget had nothing to do with the cap.

Either way, Bill was wrong. Tom was good enough to win a SB, as evidenced by the SB he won.

Bill, on the other hand, went 7-9, 10-7, 8-9, and 4-13 without Tom.

Bob would have been better off not listening to (or firing) Bill, even if Brady retired after two years.

How much of a difference would it have made? I don’t think we win a Super Bowl with this pats roster in those two years with Brady. Maybe if Gronk, playoff Lenny and other vets all flocked here it would be possible? But that Tampa bay team has a ton of talent.

If the Patriots drafted decent offensive linemen (not even WRs or TEs), they could have continued to contend. Brady won SBs with less than stellar targets early in his career. I think they could have gotten the band back together to compete for two more years. Either way, we wouldn't have to see Brady win a SB somewhere else, eliminating the dumb debate about Brady v. Belichick. There could have been a clean ending to both of their runs in NE.