Fire Joe! ... or critique Joe ... or defend Joe... or worry about Joe's coaching

[green_bballers13]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

I was told the only thing that matters is winning in the playoffs. Unfortunately Steph Curry got us that year. Ime doesn't get a moral victory.

[Goldstar88]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

That group was making it to ECF regularly with Brad. The talent was already there. Udoka is a good defensive coach, but he?s not good on the offensive side. Rockets are coming back down to earth. Just like last year.

[Roy H.]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

That group was making it to ECF regularly with Brad. The talent was already there. Udoka is a good defensive coach, but he?s not good on the offensive side. Rockets are coming back down to earth. Just like last year.

And then they played .500 basketball and lost 1-4 in the first round.  Ime turned that team into a finalist that had a Net Rtg that Brad never hit.

Acting like Ime wasn't a good coach who elevated this team makes people look stupid.

[SparzWizard]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

I was told the only thing that matters is winning in the playoffs. Unfortunately Steph Curry got us that year. Ime doesn't get a moral victory.

It's not shocking when after being down 0-3 in the ECF to the 8-seeded Heat and in during the offseason you traded for Jrue Holiday and Kristaps Porzingis and suddenly the Celtics started playing well again. Couple that with injuries from the playing field and Denver getting beat early it was Boston's playoffs to lose

I'll take a Celtics title whatever means necessary any day of the week but that does not excuse Joe's incompetency.

[Goldstar88]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

I was told the only thing that matters is winning in the playoffs. Unfortunately Steph Curry got us that year. Ime doesn't get a moral victory.

Miami nearly got them that year. If Butler made that last shot during game 7, instead of hitting the front rim, Boston doesn?t advance. Ime was thoroughly out coached by Spo that entire series, but fortunately for us, Celtics had more talent.  Also, Udoka was terrible in the Finals.

[green_bballers13]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

I was told the only thing that matters is winning in the playoffs. Unfortunately Steph Curry got us that year. Ime doesn't get a moral victory.

Miami nearly got them that year. If Butler made that last shot during game 7, instead of hitting the front rim, Boston doesn?t advance. Ime was thoroughly out coached by Spo that entire series, but fortunately for us, Celtics had more talent.  Also, Udoka was terrible in the Finals.

Again, no one is saying that Joe is great. I just think the Ime fanboy stuff is strange. Ime had a smaller impact on this team and got beat in the Finals. We don?t need to rewrite history to overstate Ime?s accomplishments and downplay Joe?s.

[Roy H.]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

I was told the only thing that matters is winning in the playoffs. Unfortunately Steph Curry got us that year. Ime doesn't get a moral victory.

Miami nearly got them that year. If Butler made that last shot during game 7, instead of hitting the front rim, Boston doesn?t advance. Ime was thoroughly out coached by Spo that entire series, but fortunately for us, Celtics had more talent.  Also, Udoka was terrible in the Finals.

Again, no one is saying that Joe is great. I just think the Ime fanboy stuff is strange. Ime had a smaller impact on this team and got beat in the Finals. We don?t need to rewrite history to overstate Ime?s accomplishments and downplay Joe?s.

But you're the only one rewriting history, so...?

[green_bballers13]

The Celtics had playoff success under Brad. They didn?t win a championship until last year under Joe.

Ime was good, but he needed to beat GS.

[tenn_smoothie]

I'm not sure how Ime Udoka became idolized. He was a relatively obscure assistant until his name was floated for the Celtics. Yes, he was involved in USA basketball, coached for Pop, and played in the league. Guys like KD (who were never coming to Boston) got along with him.

He came in and lost a championship for the Celtics.
Joe came in and won a championship for the Celtics.

I think the Ime love is weird. He harassed a young woman in the organization. Cya Ime!

lol.  Taking a .500 team from the year before to the Finals is "losing a championship".

I was told the only thing that matters is winning in the playoffs. Unfortunately Steph Curry got us that year. Ime doesn't get a moral victory.

It's not shocking when after being down 0-3 in the ECF to the 8-seeded Heat and in during the offseason you traded for Jrue Holiday and Kristaps Porzingis and suddenly the Celtics started playing well again. Couple that with injuries from the playing field and Denver getting beat early it was Boston's playoffs to lose

I'll take a Celtics title whatever means necessary any day of the week but that does not excuse Joe's incompetency.

Very good summary. Celts won in spite of Mazzulla last season. Even after the title, I have remained critical of him.
His bad offensive philosophy, which he has taken to extremes this year, along with his incompetent game management, lack of holding players accountable for poor effort and his overall stubborn attitude has caused this team to regress. I thought Ime's weakness was a stagnant offensive scheme that ground to a halt in the finals, but he would not tolerate the lackadaisical defense this team plays much of the time.

[tenn_smoothie]

I've been critical of Joe quite a bit.  Praised him last season but this season more critical of him.

I thought Joe did a great job against the Knicks.  The game plan was solid.  Gave the ball to Tatum and attacked KAT in PnR.  The rotations were very unusual but it worked.  Double big lineups with Kornet and Queta and playing Tatum for very long stretches outside of his normal rotation.  This is how I expect the playoffs to look - better planning, more refined play.  It of course helped that the 3's were going in.

Exactly. Tatum played out of his mind in the 3d quarter, hitting a few horrible attempts that he usually misses. A game like that just encourages more bad shot selection. He continues to be a ball stopper on offense. A combo of good ball movement comes around to him and stops dead, descending into him holding and then dribbling the air out only to fling up a side-step fallaway 3 or miss a wild drive to the basket.

When the Celts are hitting 40+% of their 3's, of course they look good. The problem is that no team is going to consistently do that, especially at 50 attempts per game and there is very little offensive strategy to go to when the shots aren't falling, other than to occasionally throw it in to Porzingis.

[green_bballers13]

Tenn, didn?t the Celtics win the championship last year shooting from deep? They just pounded the Knicks at home- it?s going to be ok.

[Vermont Green]

Tenn, didn?t the Celtics win the championship last year shooting from deep? They just pounded the Knicks at home- it?s going to be ok.

Only 39 3PA vs NYK.  I think the season average is around 50 still. That seems closer to the sweet spot to me.  They are adjusting, evolving.  Teams were overplaying the 3 so they are finding other ways.  Repeating is tough. People lose site of that and seem to kind of just expect them to win every on the way to another title. Every loss, Mazzulla was out coached.

[green_bballers13]

Tenn, didn?t the Celtics win the championship last year shooting from deep? They just pounded the Knicks at home- it?s going to be ok.

Only 39 3PA vs NYK.  I think the season average is around 50 still. That seems closer to the sweet spot to me.  They are adjusting, evolving.  Teams were overplaying the 3 so they are finding other ways.  Repeating is tough. People lose site of that and seem to kind of just expect them to win every on the way to another title. Every loss, Mazzulla was out coached.

I think the only basketball hot take that drives me nuts is: Ime>Joe

Based on what?

PS: also, Luka=MVP, even though he only plays offense

[Neurotic Guy]

I've been critical of Joe quite a bit.  Praised him last season but this season more critical of him.

I thought Joe did a great job against the Knicks.  The game plan was solid.  Gave the ball to Tatum and attacked KAT in PnR.  The rotations were very unusual but it worked.  Double big lineups with Kornet and Queta and playing Tatum for very long stretches outside of his normal rotation.  This is how I expect the playoffs to look - better planning, more refined play.  It of course helped that the 3's were going in.

Exactly. Tatum played out of his mind in the 3d quarter, hitting a few horrible attempts that he usually misses. A game like that just encourages more bad shot selection. He continues to be a ball stopper on offense. A combo of good ball movement comes around to him and stops dead, descending into him holding and then dribbling the air out only to fling up a side-step fallaway 3 or miss a wild drive to the basket.

When the Celts are hitting 40+% of their 3's, of course they look good. The problem is that no team is going to consistently do that, especially at 50 attempts per game and there is very little offensive strategy to go to when the shots aren't falling, other than to occasionally throw it in to Porzingis.

I agree.  This team does not need to be a three mentality team. When the shots go, they win. When they don?t, it?s going to be rough.  Among the problem with three-mindset is that when the shots aren?t falling you always believe they?ll start to fall if you keep shooting.  If you?re Steph Curry,  I?m ok with that, but this is not a team of Steph Currys.  This team can win without 50 threes a night.  And I think they?ll lose if that?s what they keep doing.

[Silas]

Easy win against the Heat and only shot 32% from 3....