Don’t Do It, Brad

[RJ87]

I hope there's some very open communication between Brad and JB.

His agent is Kanye, so my guess is that Brad doesn't have a great feel about how he operates.

How things have changed. Remember when Jaylen was his own agent and would hire industry specific consultants when negotiating contracts? Now it's Kanye - you've got to be kidding me.

Kanye's not his agent though. Donda Sports handles his marketing and branding. Not his actual NBA business.

It’s just as bad, though. Maybe worse. Wouldn’t be surprised if they are telling him that he needs his own team, in a bigger market as it will be better for his brand.

Sure. They could also just be advising him on growing his Jui7e brand and helping him land more media opportunities. Just pointing out that Donda sports does not handle his basketball and there'd be no reason for the team to engage with them around trade talks.

The pessimistic speculation around Jaylen is starting to get weird.

All we can do is try and read the tea leaves. From a business standpoint, it makes sense for any player to want to be “The Man” on a team if they are trying to build their brand/business. I also don’t recall many (if any) instances where JB had mentioned that he loves being in Boston.

"“I’ve been in Boston for five years, and I’m a Bostonian now in a sense,” Brown told reporters Saturday. “It’s a major time of my life I’ve spent in Boston now. I’m trying to be a part of the solutions and not the problems here, and trying to see where I can help out because it takes a community, and I’m trying to be a part of this community."

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2020/12/12/jaylen-brown-bostonian-of-year-celtics/

That took all of 5 seconds to google search.

There are no tea leaves. I don't believe that Jaylen is disgruntled because of a liked tweet or that he took a picture with Kyrie. There's been zero reports that he told management he's not resigning in 2 years - that's all made up conjecture by posters here. Even if he did want out, he's 2 years out from free agency. There's no way to predict what the free agency market looks like. Which teams have cap space? Are those rosters he's going to want to join? Is he going to get to free agency and realize that leaving a contender that can pay him the most money and has a coach he advocated for hiring isn't the best basketball decision?

Which part of that quote states that he loves being in Boston? He’s been in Boston for 5 years( well 7 considering the quote is from 2020) and he considers himself a Bostonian at this point. That doesn’t at all mean that he loves being in Boston in 2022. It could also take me 5 seconds to find a more recent quote like, “That trade talk was loud, and most of it came from Boston fans,” Brown told Yahoo Sports or when Brown Likes” on Twitter, as of Monday afternoon, included a tweet Sunday from user @BantonioClown that reads: “Jaylen Brown is so disrespected by Celtics fans.”

All we can do is speculate and I hope that I’m wrong in thinking that he doesn’t want to be in Boston long term. If your Brad, I don’t see why you would want to entertain these trade talks if JB wants to be here. Neither Stevens or anyone else from the Celtics have come out to say that the trade talks are untrue or said that JB is unavailable.

The idea that Brad will or can only trade Jaylen because it's an indication that Jaylen wants out is fundamentally flawed. At the end of the day, it's on Brad to build this team into a championship winner. He has to make the hard decisions. Even if I don't care for him, Kevin Durant is considered a top 3 player in the league. On paper, it's a huge upgrade. If Brad isn't willing to explore deals like this, he should step down because he's not doing his job - whether Jaylen is committed or not.

It's not as if the Celtics are actively shopping Jaylen to any team that will listen. This was a singular instance of a trade offer. It doesn't have to be as fatalistic as "Brad offered him, he's gone!" and quite as simple as Brad exploring the possibility of getting the team closer to a title.

It’s really not, though. This is what Danny Ainge thought about JB and I tend to agree with him. If JB wants to be in Boston he should be untouchable coming off a finals birth where he was the best player.

Former Celtics big man Kendrick Perkins recalled a phone call he had with Ainge last year amid those trade talks.

"I remember last year around this time when teams were calling about James Harden and Houston actually wanted Jaylen Brown," Perkins said Friday on Celtics Pregame Live. "I was on the phone with Danny Ainge for an hour, and I remember how our conversation went. He was like, 'Hey, Perk, would you trade Jaylen Brown for James Harden?' And I was like, 'Danny, you know how I feel about Jaylen Brown, but I would trade him for James Harden.' He was like, ' Are you kidding me? He's not going anywhere. He's not even 25 and he keeps getting better.'

"And then all of a sudden, Danny didn't make the trade, [Jaylen] made the All-Star team, had a breakout year, and now he just keeps getting better. Jaylen Brown is a true professional, he works hard, and people say he's under-appreciated, but I would say people appreciate him now."

While there's no denying Harden's status as one of the NBA's elite players, Brown only continues to improve with each season. He took another leap in 2020-21 with a career-high 24.7 points per game and 48.4 shooting percentage.

With Brown blossoming into one of the NBA's best, don't expect him to be involved in trade rumors any time soon. Sports Illustrated's Chris Mannix added that the Celtics -- now led in the front office by former head coach Brad Stevens -- aren't interested in shopping their prized wing.

"Boston's willingness to move Jaylen Brown has diminished significantly by the year, where once he would've been the centerpiece in say an Anthony Davis deal, now he's closing in on virtually untouchable status," Mannix said. "And that's a credit to Jaylen Brown's work ethic."[/b]

That was Danny. That's how he felt. And if Danny had the chance to get KD or his white whale, Anthony Davis, he would've driven Jaylen to the airport himself.

The case can be made that Danny's unwillingness to make bigger moves towards the end his tenure led to the issues that held this team back during the 2020-21 season. Brad has shown he has a completely different approach in how he values assets and team building. 

Again, there is a distinct difference between shopping Jaylen to multiple teams and offering him in a deal for a player of Durant's caliber. Jaylen could very well be nearly untouchable except for certain players. I personally think Durant is a malcontent and wouldn't trade for him at all, but I'd have no issue trading Jaylen for another major player.

Danny had the chance to land Harden who was coming off a 34.3pt/7.6reb/6.6ast season and won the MVP the year before. He was KD’s caliber at that time. Danny Still said no due to his age and potential fit. These are the same issues with Durant only worse as he’s older and often malcontent. If JB wants to be in Boston and Brad trades him for a 34 year old KD, that’s a huge mistake.

I'm not sure what you're arguing with me about at this point. I've already said I don't support the deal. But its not up to me or you if this deal happens. Brad's the GM and he has to make calls based on the bigger picture. And remember, Brad doesn't act singularly. If this offer was legit, that means he and ownership agreed that this was a  deal that could put us closer to a title and was worth pursuing. Doesn't mean JB is available to the other 28 teams.

I'm arguing that the only reason the Celtics management should consider trading JB is if they feel he doesn't want to be in Boston going forward. Like DA, I view JB as untouchable. He was the best player for the Celtics in the finals. You don't trade that guy if he wants to be here.

I've never seen a Danny or Brad say X player is untouchable. There have been throwaway "sourced" quotes in articles, but no member of our front office really comments on trade talks at all. I don't expect that to suddenly change.

I think it's a bit naive to believe DA thought JB was untouchable. 1.) who knows how honest Kendrick Perkins was being about that conversation. Perk's a media member now and he talks out of his butt a lot these days. Everything he says should be taken with a massive grain of salt. 2.) DA traded franchise favorites in Paul Pierce, Kevin Garnett, and Isaiah Thomas. And did it rather shrewdly. He understood that the fans would be mad in the short term, but the bigger picture and a chance at a championship was more important. We know he would've trade either of the Jays in an Anthony Davis deal. To think he wouldn't have offered JB if a big name became available that was a fit is... a leap for me. Let's say Giannis didn't sign the supermax and asked out of Milwaukee, DA would've offered JB in a heartbeat.

I don't think DA would've given him away and I don't believe Brad is actively shopping him to teams (which would be the indicator to me that JB wants out) but if a player becomes available that the team deems worthy of pursuing, Jaylen will and should be on the table.

[Kernewek]

This whole Durant-Brown rumor seems made up by bored sportswriters hoping for a few clicks.

I don't think that Woj and Shams care that much about clicks at this point.  Their reputation is more important.

I don't think that anything was made up here.  If Shams is reporting that JB was offered in a deal, I think that JB was offered in a deal.  I don't think that there's anything shocking about that.

I don't think the exchange was made up - but it might not be fresh, because there may not have been much to it.

I think that's a fair way to look at it.  Woj says the teams have been in regular contact over the past month, but who knows what that means?

I think that the simplest explanation is probably the closest to the truth:  Brad gave Brooklyn an offer that was close to his best offer.  I'm sure there was some wiggle room, but not a ton.  Brooklyn came back with an asking price that Brad thought was ridiculous.  So, nothing got done, and nothing will get done without one side making a pretty large move.

And, sometimes large moves in negotiating position happen.  Sometimes those moves are prompted by deadlines, sometimes by one side reconsidering their position, etc.  But, sometimes there's just no middle ground.

My hope is that if Jaylen wants to be here, there's no trade.  And, if JB doesn't want to be here, then we look elsewhere as opposed to a ridiculous offer that includes Smart, Grant, and multiple firsts.

I think it's really telling what we hear (and what we don't hear) in this clip, right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-D9-5JBeyY

It more or less confirms that Shams is just carrying water for someone in Brooklyn: (quotes from closed captions excuse the formatting)

Q: Windhorse came out today and said hey there is no active conversations happening with the nets right now and I think you reported a week ago that the nets were ready to go to the season with  kyrie and kevin durant both of whom have already asked for a trade where are we with the kevin durant situation?

A: You know i think a trade is going to take time to develop um you know i think there was as i reported this morning there were there was an offer made there was a rejection of that offer and there were was a counter of what you know possibly it could take to go get a guy like kevin durant and so you know yes boston is a serious threat to go get kevin durant because they have the pieces you know when you look around the roster danny ainge brought a lot of these guys in they have the pieces that it takes to go get kevin durant probably more so than any other team you know 

we talk about miami we talk about toronto we talk about uh phoenix phoenix is all but eliminated uh from everything i'm told and just looking at the roster from going to get kevin durant because they're not able to use deandre ayton even as a trade chip anymore they have  really mchill bridges cam johnson and a bunch of draft picks but brooklyn has made it clear we want all-star caliber players

then you look at toronto youknow maybe you have something around pascal siakam or OG Anouby  but brooklyn is insistent on wanting scottie barnes and as of right now toronto's not winning with scotty barnes

then miami miami does have bam adebayo who would be very very appealing in a trade for kevin durant but brooklyn can't add bam adebayo because both bam and ben simmons are on designated rookie max extension so when you sign that five-year rookie max extension you can't have two of those guys on the same team together so brooklyn would have to then find a trade for ben simmons out bring bam in it's just complicated ....

Sorry for inflicting this washy nonsense on you, but we can clearly see

A: he's carrying water for BKN - the entire 'reporting' here is just listing players that Brooklyn would like to get back/see as fair value for KD.
B: that this is old, because he definitely dodges that part of the question re: Windhorst's reporting.

yes they're [Brooklyn] having conversations i don't think it's anything that's imminent i don't think this is something that that you know we need to keep an
eye on as far as actually a deal going down in the next week or two again these things can all change really quickly trade talks can move from you know
pretty standstill as it is right now to heating up in in a matter of moments but  right now this is to me going to take some time to develop.

I clearly don't hold a high opinion of the guy - he's a gussied up access merchant who can't string two sentences together and basically the closest thing to a useful idiot the NBA has had since Woj started slowing down - but when he breaks confirmed news, he does it very quickly. Anything regarding 'rumours' or 'discussions', though, and he's very rarely worth paying attention to.

[Roy H.]

I think it's really telling what we hear (and what we don't hear) in this clip, right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-D9-5JBeyY

My God, what is the Pat McAfee show?  I haven't been exposed to this one yet.  Out of all the shows, why is Shams booked on there? 

Can they bring back the Sports Reporters?  I used to love that show when I was younger.  Nuanced, reasonable, quiet discussion.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

I think it's really telling what we hear (and what we don't hear) in this clip, right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-D9-5JBeyY

My God, what is the Pat McAfee show?  I haven't been exposed to this one yet.  Out of all the shows, why is Shams booked on there? 

Can they bring back the Sports Reporters?  I used to love that show when I was younger.  Nuanced, reasonable, quiet discussion.

Funny you mention this show, as I was just thinking about it a couple days ago. Always enjoyed it.

[Kernewek]

I think it's really telling what we hear (and what we don't hear) in this clip, right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-D9-5JBeyY

My God, what is the Pat McAfee show?  I haven't been exposed to this one yet.  Out of all the shows, why is Shams booked on there? 

Can they bring back the Sports Reporters?  I used to love that show when I was younger.  Nuanced, reasonable, quiet discussion.

Based on some cursory googling he's a retired punter and a barstool alum. I don't recommend watching it on normal speed, but nearly all sports talk anything is dangerous for your IQ in more than tiny doses.

edit: apparently The Sports Reporters are still going as a podcast (something I didn't know until just now)

[Celtics2021]

I think it's really telling what we hear (and what we don't hear) in this clip, right?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-D9-5JBeyY

My God, what is the Pat McAfee show?  I haven't been exposed to this one yet.  Out of all the shows, why is Shams booked on there? 

Can they bring back the Sports Reporters?  I used to love that show when I was younger.  Nuanced, reasonable, quiet discussion.

How did you miss Pat McAfee? I’ve never listened to it, because I like my brain, but I’m 98% sure it’s the one where Aaron Rodgers went on last year and accidentally admitted he wasn’t vaxxed.

[Roy H.]

edit: apparently The Sports Reporters are still going as a podcast (something I didn't know until just now)

What?!  Lupica, Albom and Ryan have a podcast?

Checking quickly, it looks like their last broadcast was in March.

I'm not much into podcasts, so I miss out on a lot of bad discussion, I suspect.  And maybe a bit of good stuff, as well.

How did you miss Pat McAfee?

Ha.  I had no idea he was a thing.  I knew about the Aaron Rodgers story generally, but definitely didn't do a deep dive.

[Vermont Green]

The summary of what Shams said is that Durant still wants to be traded but Kyrie does not.

This makes no sense.  I thought Durant wanted to be traded because Kyrie was not given an extension and was going to leave?  If Kyrie is staying, why exactly does Durant want to be traded?  I know that Shams is supposed to be well connected and all of that but I am not finding any of this all that convincing. 

[RJ87]

The summary of what Shams said is that Durant still wants to be traded but Kyrie does not.

This makes no sense.  I thought Durant wanted to be traded because Kyrie was not given an extension and was going to leave?  If Kyrie is staying, why exactly does Durant want to be traded?  I know that Shams is supposed to be well connected and all of that but I am not finding any of this all that convincing.

Does Durant even know why he wants to be traded?

[Donoghus]

The summary of what Shams said is that Durant still wants to be traded but Kyrie does not.

This makes no sense.  I thought Durant wanted to be traded because Kyrie was not given an extension and was going to leave?  If Kyrie is staying, why exactly does Durant want to be traded?  I know that Shams is supposed to be well connected and all of that but I am not finding any of this all that convincing.

Does Durant even know why he wants to be traded?

If I had to guess, he's had enough of the nutty professor's antics and isn't exactly thrilled the prospect of playing with Simmons either.

[Bobshot]

I read all this NY media stuff on the internet, and I think the Celtics should just walk away.
The Nets won't get a better offer than Brown for Durant unless other teams dig too deeply into their core.
Adding Smart to any package with Brown sounds like a reluctance to trade with the Celtics--and the anticipated media outrage in NY?
I doubt any contending team can beat the Celtics offer unless they weaken themselves overall--something the Celtics must avoid.
After all, they are a solid backup to Horford/Williams from being the top contender again.

[SHAQATTACK]

The summary of what Shams said is that Durant still wants to be traded but Kyrie does not.

This makes no sense.  I thought Durant wanted to be traded because Kyrie was not given an extension and was going to leave?  If Kyrie is staying, why exactly does Durant want to be traded?  I know that Shams is supposed to be well connected and all of that but I am not finding any of this all that convincing.

Does Durant even know why he wants to be traded?

If I had to guess, he's had enough of the nutty professor's antics and isn't exactly thrilled the prospect of playing with Simmons either.

Bingo…..he is thinking one thing and say n another ( not publicly wanting to throw them under the bus ) , he knows the reality of the situation  .  Common sense dictates there is no quick fix to accommodate his narrow window . He needs another contender to land on NOW or just wilt away over the next 4 years in Brooklyn

[RJ87]

The summary of what Shams said is that Durant still wants to be traded but Kyrie does not.

This makes no sense.  I thought Durant wanted to be traded because Kyrie was not given an extension and was going to leave?  If Kyrie is staying, why exactly does Durant want to be traded?  I know that Shams is supposed to be well connected and all of that but I am not finding any of this all that convincing.

Does Durant even know why he wants to be traded?

If I had to guess, he's had enough of the nutty professor's antics and isn't exactly thrilled the prospect of playing with Simmons either.

Bingo…..he is thinking one thing and say n another ( not publicly wanting to throw them under the bus ) , he knows the reality of the situation  .  Common sense dictates there is no quick fix to accommodate his narrow window . He needs another contender to land on NOW or just wilt away over the next 4 years in Brooklyn

The funny thing is Brooklyn can be pretty good next season. They added Royce O'Neal who is a good perimeter defender and they're getting Ben Simmons back. That already improves their defense. Then, Joe Harris will be back so they add even more shooting with Curry and Mills. Kyrie is playing for his next contract, so he might show up.

In reality, it's probably the best situation for him considering any team that trades for him will have be giving up good pieces in the deal.

[Vermont Green]

The summary of what Shams said is that Durant still wants to be traded but Kyrie does not.

This makes no sense.  I thought Durant wanted to be traded because Kyrie was not given an extension and was going to leave?  If Kyrie is staying, why exactly does Durant want to be traded?  I know that Shams is supposed to be well connected and all of that but I am not finding any of this all that convincing.

Does Durant even know why he wants to be traded?

If I had to guess, he's had enough of the nutty professor's antics and isn't exactly thrilled the prospect of playing with Simmons either.

Bingo…..he is thinking one thing and say n another ( not publicly wanting to throw them under the bus ) , he knows the reality of the situation  .  Common sense dictates there is no quick fix to accommodate his narrow window . He needs another contender to land on NOW or just wilt away over the next 4 years in Brooklyn

The funny thing is Brooklyn can be pretty good next season. They added Royce O'Neal who is a good perimeter defender and they're getting Ben Simmons back. That already improves their defense. Then, Joe Harris will be back so they add even more shooting with Curry and Mills. Kyrie is playing for his next contract, so he might show up.

In reality, it's probably the best situation for him considering any team that trades for him will have be giving up good pieces in the deal.

It is unclear to me exactly what BNK has to work with.  I guess the starters might be:

Kyrie
Harris
Durant
Simmons
Claxton

With ONeale, Curry, Mills, Warren, Thomas

Lots of playmakers and scoring but not enough blue collar size, or so it seems to me.  They need some vet bigs.  There is no one to do the dirty work.

[RJ87]

The summary of what Shams said is that Durant still wants to be traded but Kyrie does not.

This makes no sense.  I thought Durant wanted to be traded because Kyrie was not given an extension and was going to leave?  If Kyrie is staying, why exactly does Durant want to be traded?  I know that Shams is supposed to be well connected and all of that but I am not finding any of this all that convincing.

Does Durant even know why he wants to be traded?

If I had to guess, he's had enough of the nutty professor's antics and isn't exactly thrilled the prospect of playing with Simmons either.

Bingo…..he is thinking one thing and say n another ( not publicly wanting to throw them under the bus ) , he knows the reality of the situation  .  Common sense dictates there is no quick fix to accommodate his narrow window . He needs another contender to land on NOW or just wilt away over the next 4 years in Brooklyn

The funny thing is Brooklyn can be pretty good next season. They added Royce O'Neal who is a good perimeter defender and they're getting Ben Simmons back. That already improves their defense. Then, Joe Harris will be back so they add even more shooting with Curry and Mills. Kyrie is playing for his next contract, so he might show up.

In reality, it's probably the best situation for him considering any team that trades for him will have be giving up good pieces in the deal.

It is unclear to me exactly what BNK has to work with.  I guess the starters might be:

Kyrie
Harris
Durant
Simmons
Claxton

With ONeale, Curry, Mills, Warren, Thomas

Lots of playmakers and scoring but not enough blue collar size, or so it seems to me.  They need some vet bigs.  There is no one to do the dirty work.

There's still some interesting bigs on the market - Dwight, Whiteside, Cauley-Stein. Even Boogie.

They could shore up the big rotation but if Durant is intent on bailing, why add to the tax bill?