GOAT: Jordan or James?

[tenn_smoothie]

GOAT ranking:

Russ
Magic
Bird
Jordan

Russ had Wilt,

Magic had Bird

Who did MJ have? Len Bias was going to be the one….

Excellent comments. Jordan played in a watered down league.
I doubt the 90's Bulls group would have ever even seen the finals if they had played during the 80's.
They did not have multiple Hall of Fame players like the Celtics, Lakers or the '83 Sixers.
Plus they would have had to deal with the Bucks and Pistons during the Eastern Conference playoffs.

[Erik]

It’s Jordan #1, and then for #2 we need to clarify what’s your definition of GOAT.

Unmatched in everything Basketball, work ethic and killer instinct. He would have dominated any era or chosen profession. Sometimes the stars just align on a human being between genes and upbringing.

Anyone who watched Jordan play knows LeBron isn’t even close. And for all of you Russ #1, swap Eras and think about who would benefit. Imagine Michael Jordan back then.

[Surferdad]

A GOAT thread goes up about once a year on this forum. It is not a question that has a real answer, rather it is entirely informed opinion which is fine, and fun. I'm 64 so have been watching NBA since the late 1960's. Here's my top-10:

GOAT: For many years I had Russell alone at the top due to the chips. Then I evolved my thinking to putting Jordan and Russell at the top together and everybody else is below that.

The top spot is shared so there's no number 2 on my list.

At number 3, I put Kareem Abdul-Jabbar because he's the greatest scorer of all time and perfected a shot that couldn't be stopped (the sky hook).

Number 4 is also shared, between Bird and Magic.  I can't say one is better than the other, but neither should be higher than Kareem.

No #5 on my list since the #4 spot is shared.

At number 6 I put LeBron.

Things get real tough at this point. Spots 7 through 10 are Wilt, Kobe, Olajuwon, Duncan in no particular order.

(Odd that Karl Malone doesn't get props on this thread.)

I don't think Shaq or Curry are in the top 10.  Steph might get there someday which would definitely knock Shaq out of the top-10.  Shaq was NOT the most physically dominant player of all time. That label goes to Wilt.

[SHAQATTACK]

James = GRAT 

[GreenShooter]

One spent his entire career (Wash doesn't really count, past his prime) with one team while the other ran around trying to assemble a super teams. This isn't even close.

[Roy H.]

Jordan was so much more mentally tough than Lebron. 

[Celtics4ever]

Agree, LeBron is bigger and stronger, both can jump, Jordan has more competitive drive and mental toughness.

[bricone29]

Larry Bird

[liam]

Larry Bird

Ditto.

[KG Living Legend]

Agree, LeBron is bigger and stronger, both can jump, Jordan has more competitive drive and mental toughness.

 Does anyone want to bring PEDs in this topic? Lebron is Sammy Sosa times marc Mcguire.  Lebron is the king of Steroids in basketball.

Was Larry on Roids? Magic? JORDAN was ripped but skinny. Lebron has been losing his hairline since 25 years old.

[tenn_smoothie]

Jordan was so much more mentally tough than Lebron.

So are a lot of players.

My disgust with Lebron started when he abandoned Cleveland after losing to the Celtics twice in three years in the Eastern playoffs.
So he gathers up some buddies for his cowardly move to Miami and finally gets past Boston in 2011.

After the series clinching game, Lebron would not leave the court. He starts with his fake, phony crying act, kissing the floor and acting like he had just climbed Mount Everest. Then he wanders around looking for any camera to stick his face in front of in order to repeat his performance.

I'm not sure what being an elite athlete has to do with real knowledge of social and political issues and then qualifies said athlete to spout ignorant, uninformed statements that are only made to further personal agendas.

[PAOBoston]

There is no such thing is all time GOAT. It’s hard to compare players from different generations. Lebron is the Best of this generation and it isn’t really close in my book. Jordan was the best of his generation.

[Dchuck]

I love guys who have that "killer mentality"...Jordan, Kobe, Bird, etc.  I never got/get that from Lebron.

If it's a tie game, Lebron is good.  But being down by one with the last shot is a different story.

Jordan, Kobe, Bird, Magic, etc wanted that shot.  They were ok with taking the last shot down by one and living with the result.  Lebron "aint about that". 

Even though it was in the all star game (2012), I'll never forget Kobe, even Carmelo, blasting Lebron at the end of the game because Lebron passed up 2 game winning shots.  You can see Kobe visibly scolding Lebron that he wouldn't take the shot.  I know its one possession, in a meaningless game, but it sums everything up for me.

Btw, I believe Jordan to be the Goat.  Complete package, with an unmatched drive.

[Surferdad]

I love guys who have that "killer mentality"...Jordan, Kobe, Bird, etc.  I never got/get that from Lebron.

If it's a tie game, Lebron is good.  But being down by one with the last shot is a different story.

Jordan, Kobe, Bird, Magic, etc wanted that shot.  They were ok with taking the last shot down by one and living with the result.  Lebron "aint about that". 

Even though it was in the all star game (2012), I'll never forget Kobe, even Carmelo, blasting Lebron at the end of the game because Lebron passed up 2 game winning shots.  You can see Kobe visibly scolding Lebron that he wouldn't take the shot.  I know its one possession, in a meaningless game, but it sums everything up for me.

Btw, I believe Jordan to be the Goat.  Complete package, with an unmatched drive.

Great post, TP. This strengthens my top-10 order (see about 10 posts up) where I put LeBron at #6. It's going to be very hard for him to move up further in my mind.

[Chef Parish]

Larry Bird

Ditto.

Agreed