Defensive Player of the Year

[Big333223]

Celtics have the best defense in the league, Marcus Smart is the leader on that end and maybe the most versatile defender in the NBA. But I've also seen seen a lot of buzz for Robert Williams so maybe you think it should be him.

Or am I being a homer and it should go to someone not on the Celtics.

I'm going Smart.

[Jvalin]

For what it's worth:

Defensive Estimated Plus/Minus
1. Draymond Green: +4.7
2. Gary Payton II: +3.6
3. Matisse Thybulle: +3.2
3. Derrick White: +3.2
3. Bam Adebayo: +3.2
6. Jarrett Allen: +3.1
7. Rudy Gobert: +2.9
(...)
Marcus Smart: +2.7
(...)
Robert Williams: +2.3
Al Horford: +2.2


Defensive Box Plus/Minus
1. Jokic: 4.5
2. Giannis: 3.6
3. Thybulle: 3.3
4. Robert Williams: 3.0
5. Horford: 2.7
(...)
14. Smart: 1.8
(...)
Derrick White: 0.6


Defensive RAPTOR
1. Gobert: +6.8
2. Jokic: +5.4
3. Caruso: +5.1
4. Thybulle: +4.2
5. Adebayo: +4.0
5. Jarrett Allen: +4.0
5. Draymond Green: +4.0
5. Gary Payton II: +4.0
9. Al Horford: +3.9
(...)
12. Derrick White: +3.3
(...)
16. Robert Williams: +2.8
(...)
44. Marcus Smart: +1.8


Defensive LEBRON
1. Al Horford: 3.61
2. Rudy Gobert: 3.55
3. Draymond Green: 3.36
(...)
Robert Williams: 2.16
(...)
Marcus Smart 1.12
(...)
Derrick White: 0.77


BLK%
1. Jaren Jackson Jr: 7.4
2. Mitchell Robinson: 6.8
2. Robert Williams: 6.8
4. Mo Bamba: 5.9
4. Rudy Gobert: 5.9
(...)
9. Horford: 4.3


STL%
1. Matisse Thybulle: 3.4
2. De'Anthony Melton: 3.3
3. Dejounte Murray: 2.8
(...)
9. Marcus Smart: 2.6

[Who]

I think Boston is a team with many good to high level defenders rather than a team defense run by a DPOY candidate. I see Boston's #1 ranked defense more team based than say it was in 2008 with KG clearly leading the way.

[hpantazo]

I think Boston is a team with many good to high level defenders rather than a team defense run by a DPOY candidate. I see Boston's #1 ranked defense more team based than say it was in 2008 with KG clearly leading the way.

It is totally team based, but that should not take away from individual players' accomplishments at all. Not any more than having several stars on your team takes away from a player receiving MVP votes.

[GreenlyGreeny]

Take Marcus, Time Lord or Horford away, just one of them, and we are probably no longer number one on defense. That said, Marcus is clearly the defensive heart and soul, the undisputed defensive leader according to Time Lord, and the biggest drop is probably taking him away, although we are blessed to have White now in the event Smart is out for a short period.

Gobert tends to win this thing, but Utah is struggling some. I’d have said Dray is a contender again had GSW stayed right behind the Suns, but they are sinking. Kawhi was injured all year. This could be Marcus’ year, but I suspect Giannis will win it instead (superstar bias), especially if the Bucks close this year strongly.

Working strongly against Marcus is Bigs Bias: Only bigs have won it since Gary Payton in 1995-1996, and the only other guard to win it in the past 35 years is MJ in ‘87-88 (in the early years of the award, it was won by guards more frequently than bigs so Michael Cooper in ‘86-87, Alvin Robertson in ‘85-86, and Moncrief won the first two awards ever between ‘82-84).

[hpantazo]

Yeah, I mean, for a clear cut example of Smart's importance, just look at our defense in the past 2 years when Kemba was starting.

[Big333223]

Working strongly against Marcus is Bigs Bias: Only bigs have won it since Gary Payton in 1995-1996, and the only other guard to win it in the past 35 years is MJ in ‘87-88 (in the early years of the award, it was won by guards more frequently than bigs so Michael Cooper in ‘86-87, Alvin Robertson in ‘85-86, and Moncrief won the first two awards ever between ‘82-84).

One good thing is that I've been hearing about this a lot recently. It feels like it's become part of the narrative and people might be inclined to vote for Smart as a way of bucking that trend.

[Kernewek]

Working strongly against Marcus is Bigs Bias: Only bigs have won it since Gary Payton in 1995-1996, and the only other guard to win it in the past 35 years is MJ in ‘87-88 (in the early years of the award, it was won by guards more frequently than bigs so Michael Cooper in ‘86-87, Alvin Robertson in ‘85-86, and Moncrief won the first two awards ever between ‘82-84).

One good thing is that I've been hearing about this a lot recently. It feels like it's become part of the narrative and people might be inclined to vote for Smart as a way of bucking that trend.

Possibly, but Smart isn't really on Payton's level from a narrative perspective - the game is different enough that I don't feel like comparing them with metrics (which aren't great for defense anyway) is quite as valuable. Smart's probably my favourite player on the C's, but he's not The Glove.

[Roy H.]

Let Marcus use hand-checking and then see how dominant he is!

Looking at the entire season, our defense gives up 5.0 points fewer per 100 possessions than the average NBA defense.  How does that stack up historically?  I know that our 2008 team gave up 8.6 points / 100 possessions fewer than league average.

I think the arguments for Smart / Timelord really hinge upon whether people see one of them as the best defender on an elite defense (last 30 games) versus the best defender on a really good defense (season overall)

[GreenlyGreeny]

Working strongly against Marcus is Bigs Bias: Only bigs have won it since Gary Payton in 1995-1996, and the only other guard to win it in the past 35 years is MJ in ‘87-88 (in the early years of the award, it was won by guards more frequently than bigs so Michael Cooper in ‘86-87, Alvin Robertson in ‘85-86, and Moncrief won the first two awards ever between ‘82-84).

One good thing is that I've been hearing about this a lot recently. It feels like it's become part of the narrative and people might be inclined to vote for Smart as a way of bucking that trend.

Possibly, but Smart isn't really on Payton's level from a narrative perspective - the game is different enough that I don't feel like comparing them with metrics (which aren't great for defense anyway) is quite as valuable. Smart's probably my favourite player on the C's, but he's not The Glove.

Right, but who is? Smart is possibly the best defensive guard of the Curry Era, perhaps even the post-handchecking era altogether. This season he is between Prime Glove and Prime Tony Allen. That dominant. People are sick of Gobert winning it.

[Kernewek]

Both good points! And, according to Rotowire, he's now the odds-on favourite to win the award:
https://www.rotowire.com/betting/nba/defensive-player-odds.php

I hope he does get the award: it certainly helps that the C's have absolutely turned it around on the back of the defense.

[Big333223]

Both good points! And, according to Rotowire, he's now the odds-on favourite to win the award:
https://www.rotowire.com/betting/nba/defensive-player-odds.php

I hope he does get the award: it certainly helps that the C's have absolutely turned it around on the back of the defense.

Love it. And I'd love the confidence it would give to Smart and this team.

[mobilija]

What if the Celtics continue to swoon, esp defensively, in the regular season while TimeLord is out? Does that make a stronger case that TimeLord is integral to the Celtics top defense and he should be DPOY?

[Goldstar88]

I love Smart and It’d be awesome if he won DPOY, but this talk about him being able to guard 5’s “well” I’m not buying. Sure if a big puts the ball on the court for more than a dribble or two Smart can slap it away, but let’s be honest, he’s not stopping guys like Jokic, Embiid, Durant, Giannis, Towns, Bam,  once they get the ball on the block. Tatum and Timelord are more capable of covering 1-5 than Smart is.


“Let’s think about it,” Smart said. “As a guard, especially on the team that switches a lot, especially on the No. 1 defensive team, you are worried about every single player. And here’s the thing: When you see Defensive Player of the Year, that means he can guard all five spots. “Nothing against Rudy, but Rudy can’t guard all five spots. I can guard all five spots and I have been doing it. I’ve done it very well.”  – via Tim Bontemps @ ESPN

[Surferdad]

I love Smart and It’d be awesome if he won DPOY, but this talk about him being able to guard 5’s “well” I’m not buying. Sure if a big puts the ball on the court for more than a dribble or two Smart can slap it away, but let’s be honest, he’s not stopping guys like Jokic, Embiid, Durant, Giannis, Towns, Bam,  once they get the ball on the block. Tatum and Timelord are more capable of covering 1-5 than Smart is.


“Let’s think about it,” Smart said. “As a guard, especially on the team that switches a lot, especially on the No. 1 defensive team, you are worried about every single player. And here’s the thing: When you see Defensive Player of the Year, that means he can guard all five spots. “Nothing against Rudy, but Rudy can’t guard all five spots. I can guard all five spots and I have been doing it. I’ve done it very well.”  – via Tim Bontemps @ ESPN

True, but Smart is strong enough to often keep them off the block.  Watch him battle down low.