White vs Richardson

[Goldstar88]

I said it at deadline the loss of Schro and Josh means the Jays need to be even better efficient  scorers. Starting to feel it was a bad trade deadline right now.

Looks like you were right. If either of them has an off game against a team that is .500 or better, C’s are going to struggle offensively. Richardson or Schroder were both capable of giving you 20 off the bench. Also, over the last 7 games (Since the trade deadline) C’s have given up an average of 102 pts per game. 7 games before they were giving up an average of 96...

[todd_days_41]

I said it at deadline the loss of Schro and Josh means the Jays need to be even better efficient  scorers. Starting to feel it was a bad trade deadline right now.

Not 'right now'.... It was a more-than-bad trade deadline the second it happened.

The "D" I gave Stevens was being too kind. Both of the bigger trades were bad deals -- plain and simple.

[jambr380]

How is this a thread? White is clearly the superior player and has superior impact on the court. C’s got a good one in White

Now, how much will we miss those picks? That is the more interesting question imo.

 11pts, 1reb, 0ast, shooting 4-10 from the field and 1-5 from 3pt, that’s how. I know, I know it’s 1 game...but the C’s could have used Richardson’s shooting off the bench. Pritchard is probably the biggest threat offensively for the C’s reserves at this point.

it's not one game though.  since the first game he played for the C's, his offense (scoring) has dropped off.

You know for all the grousing done over White's shooting threes, for the year he's hitting at 31%....meanwhile our star of stars, Jayson Tatum, is hitting at 32.9% after today's showing. No one seems to complain about that.

Personally, I think both might end up having terrible years shooting the three, like lots of players, but will bounce back next year.

The trade doesn't HAVE to pay amazing immediate benefits, so long as next year and beyond it does. I'll judge the trade then

Yea people always talking about the potential downside to this. There is upside too.

I think we bought high.  To some extent, that means that unless White meets expectations, the trade was a failure.  He needs to progress, not only playing up to his contract, but exceeding the play of Richardson + #1 + swap rights.

You can see the flashes of excellence, but we paid for more than flashes.  White needs to play at the level of a good starter for the trade to make sense.

I honestly thought we were getting somebody at Smart's level, and he was supposed to make Smart [somewhat] expendable should a great deal come along. I am willing to give White the benefit of an offseason, but it appears right now that Smart is clearly on a different tier and I really hope we don't trade him.

Problem is, if we trade White, we already gave up a 1st and Langford in the deal. So any additional assets we trade along with him will really add up. We kind-of need it to work out with him.

[moiso]

I said it at deadline the loss of Schro and Josh means the Jays need to be even better efficient  scorers. Starting to feel it was a bad trade deadline right now.

Good luck to Tatum being more efficient if his shot selection is like it was against the Pacers.  He was driving me nuts seemingly taking the most difficult shot available on many possessions.

[ozgod]

How is this a thread? White is clearly the superior player and has superior impact on the court. C’s got a good one in White

Now, how much will we miss those picks? That is the more interesting question imo.

 11pts, 1reb, 0ast, shooting 4-10 from the field and 1-5 from 3pt, that’s how. I know, I know it’s 1 game...but the C’s could have used Richardson’s shooting off the bench. Pritchard is probably the biggest threat offensively for the C’s reserves at this point.

it's not one game though.  since the first game he played for the C's, his offense (scoring) has dropped off.

You know for all the grousing done over White's shooting threes, for the year he's hitting at 31%....meanwhile our star of stars, Jayson Tatum, is hitting at 32.9% after today's showing. No one seems to complain about that.

Personally, I think both might end up having terrible years shooting the three, like lots of players, but will bounce back next year.

The trade doesn't HAVE to pay amazing immediate benefits, so long as next year and beyond it does. I'll judge the trade then

Good old CelticsStrong...imagine starting a new job at a new company and being judged as being good or useless your first couple of weeks 

Sports fans live in the now though, so it's understandable that people would want to throw him under the bus after a couple mediocre performances. Personally I prefer to give them a bit of time to gel with their new teammates, just the same as I would want to be judged on my full body of work over a reasonable period of time. Maybe  by the mid March we can decide if we should throw White on the scrapheap or not 

[slamtheking]

How is this a thread? White is clearly the superior player and has superior impact on the court. C’s got a good one in White

Now, how much will we miss those picks? That is the more interesting question imo.

 11pts, 1reb, 0ast, shooting 4-10 from the field and 1-5 from 3pt, that’s how. I know, I know it’s 1 game...but the C’s could have used Richardson’s shooting off the bench. Pritchard is probably the biggest threat offensively for the C’s reserves at this point.

it's not one game though.  since the first game he played for the C's, his offense (scoring) has dropped off.

You know for all the grousing done over White's shooting threes, for the year he's hitting at 31%....meanwhile our star of stars, Jayson Tatum, is hitting at 32.9% after today's showing. No one seems to complain about that.

Personally, I think both might end up having terrible years shooting the three, like lots of players, but will bounce back next year.

The trade doesn't HAVE to pay amazing immediate benefits, so long as next year and beyond it does. I'll judge the trade then

Good old CelticsStrong...imagine starting a new job at a new company and being judged as being good or useless your first couple of weeks 

Sports fans live in the now though, so it's understandable that people would want to throw him under the bus after a couple mediocre performances. Personally I prefer to give them a bit of time to gel with their new teammates, just the same as I would want to be judged on my full body of work over a reasonable period of time. Maybe  by the mid March we can decide if we should throw White on the scrapheap or not 

if the point of bringing in that new employee was a partcular skillset and the ability to hit the ground running (this is how I interpret how many meant the phrase 'fit' when mentioning why White was a great pickup) and they aren't showing that skillset AND the people the newbie replaced were providing better results, then yeah, the newbie is going to rightfully be judged.

White's not crap.  he just hasn't shown he's worth what we paid for him.  I was originally ok with JRich and either Romeo or a first but now I'm not seeing anyone worth more than just JRich.

[Roy H.]

How is this a thread? White is clearly the superior player and has superior impact on the court. C’s got a good one in White

Now, how much will we miss those picks? That is the more interesting question imo.

 11pts, 1reb, 0ast, shooting 4-10 from the field and 1-5 from 3pt, that’s how. I know, I know it’s 1 game...but the C’s could have used Richardson’s shooting off the bench. Pritchard is probably the biggest threat offensively for the C’s reserves at this point.

it's not one game though.  since the first game he played for the C's, his offense (scoring) has dropped off.

You know for all the grousing done over White's shooting threes, for the year he's hitting at 31%....meanwhile our star of stars, Jayson Tatum, is hitting at 32.9% after today's showing. No one seems to complain about that.

Personally, I think both might end up having terrible years shooting the three, like lots of players, but will bounce back next year.

The trade doesn't HAVE to pay amazing immediate benefits, so long as next year and beyond it does. I'll judge the trade then

Good old CelticsStrong...imagine starting a new job at a new company and being judged as being good or useless your first couple of weeks 

Sports fans live in the now though, so it's understandable that people would want to throw him under the bus after a couple mediocre performances. Personally I prefer to give them a bit of time to gel with their new teammates, just the same as I would want to be judged on my full body of work over a reasonable period of time. Maybe  by the mid March we can decide if we should throw White on the scrapheap or not 

if the point of bringing in that new employee was a partcular skillset and the ability to hit the ground running (this is how I interpret how many meant the phrase 'fit' when mentioning why White was a great pickup) and they aren't showing that skillset AND the people the newbie replaced were providing better results, then yeah, the newbie is going to rightfully be judged.

White's not crap.  he just hasn't shown he's worth what we paid for him.  I was originally ok with JRich and either Romeo or a first but now I'm not seeing anyone worth more than just JRich.

I like his "fit".  I like what he's shown in terms of passing, driving and defense.  So, I think he is showing the skillset that he was asked to show.  He just has really, really sucked at shooting, which hurts because it's a skill that our team is awful at.

But, I have no doubt that he'll improve over his current 25% 3PT shooting in Boston.  We can probably project him around 34% going forward, roughly what he's been in San Antonio.  That's not good, but it's also not God awful like we're seeing now.

[PhoSita]

defense +
ballhandling +
play style +
chemistry +
overall fit +
long term contract +

I'm not worried about the shooting, I have confidence he'll come along at least as a spot up shooter.

[Roy H.]

defense +
ballhandling +
play style +
chemistry +
overall fit +
long term contract +

I'm not worried about the shooting, I have confidence he'll come along at least as a spot up shooter.

The one area above that I'm not sure about is the contract.  I hate spending $18+ million on a guy who projects as a bench player right now.

[todd_days_41]

defense +

Is White truly a better defender? Hasn't looked like it to me -- certainly not last night -- and it didn't look like it in the 7-8 games I saw him play as a Spur.

long term contract +

Negative -- he's overpaid. Pop dumped him for a reason, after realizing the mistake he'd made in the offseason.

chemistry +

What evidence do we have that White has good chemistry with this team, or that Richardson didn't? The whole talk track around White is intangible stuff, which equates to a shaky story.

play style +

Why was Richardson not a fit from a style perspective? Why is White better?

overall fit +

Again, disagree here. They have a really good combo guard who defends well, shoots a floater well, passes well, struggles from three, and plays hard for like $17M per for the next 3-4 years. His name is Marcus Smart. Why do we need another other for the same money but not nearly as good?

Cs diversity of skills is an issue. They need players who are complimentary, not duplicative.

I'd also point out that chemistry, play style and overall fit are pretty fluffy boxes to check in general, not the most tangible comparisons to say the least...

[Goldstar88]

defense +
ballhandling +
play style +
chemistry +
overall fit +
long term contract +

I'm not worried about the shooting, I have confidence he'll come along at least as a spot up shooter.

The one area above that I'm not sure about is the contract.  I hate spending $18+ million on a guy who projects as a bench player right now.

$18m/year for 10.9pts, 3ast, 3.4 rebs while averaging 26.1mpg is going to be a hard pill to swallow. Even if he gets back to his career 44% FG and 34% from 3pt, I’m not sure he’s worth the money.

[wdleehi]

On the flip side, he helps with future trade value.   He is worth more then Richardson and he can replace Smart if Smart is needed for a bigger move.

[droopdog7]

I think the passing/playmaking ability of White WAY outweigh J Rich's inflated 3% shooting.  I mean, by a country mile.  Add it that he's a much more disruptive defender and I'm not sure how this thread has gone so long.

[Roy H.]

On the flip side, he helps with future trade value.   He is worth more then Richardson and he can replace Smart if Smart is needed for a bigger move.

That bolded part is why I'm most on board with this trade.  I'm hoping that either Smart or White can be traded for a final piece that puts us over the top.

[MickaelPietrus]

OP is right. We will miss Jrich's shooting and the fact that we gave up a 1st and a swap in the process is ridiculous. Unfortunately there's some lunatics out there who don't know much basketball and thought White was incredibly better just because the Celtics had to be right lol