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Author Topic: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)  (Read 3640 times)

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Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« on: December 24, 2021, 02:40:33 PM »

Offline Ed Monix

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Celtics: Simmons

76ers: Smart, Williams III, Nesmith, Hernangomez, multiple Celtics 1st round picks (protected)

—————————

IMO, it’s becoming more and more clearer, that the Celtics roster is lacking a pass first playmaker.

I first thought, I wonder who could the Celtics realistically pick up, that was elite in this category? I was astounded that there is next to no one available (without giving up Tatum or Brown).

So I was back to Ben Simmons, again.

Is Simmons very flawed, yes. Is he worth his contract right now? No. But that doesn’t mean he can’t be a huge upgrade for a very flawed roster.

Given that the 76ers are slowly regressing to a sub .500 team, in a season which is wide open, Morey and 76ers ownership would be foolish not to trade Simmons this season. But for whom? CJ McCollum has a collapsed lung and isn’t a huge upgrade over Seth Curry or Tyrese Maxey. Damian Lillard would require a large returning package and he’s looked like a shell of his former self for some time now.The Sacramento Kings may make De’Aaron Fox available, but they too, would expect an unrealistic return from the 76ers and again, is Fox a big upgrade over score first guards, Curry & Maxey?

A Boston Celtics trade package wouldn’t be perfect for 76ers, but caters to many roster weaknesses. Smart can start next to any of their score first guards and provide defensive versatility. Robert Williams can start next to Embiid or provide rim protection in his constant absences. Nesmith is a wildcard who can provide jump shooting now and perhaps develop into a future starter.


76ers

Embiid
Williams III
Harris
Smart
Curry

Maxey, Green, Thybulle, Niang, Drummond, Nesmith

—————————

Does this trade cripple the Celtics depth? Yes of course, but role players are replaceable, and our chances at making a deep run in the playoffs this season are very slim at best.

In this scenario, the Celtics can either use Schroder as a 6th man, in the hope he takes a discount to come back for another season. This would be because current contenders are lacking cap room to sign him, or perhaps the Celtics move him to New Orleans, with Trey Murphy III coming back in return.

Celtics

Horford
Tatum
Brown
Richardson
Simmons

Schroder (or Murphy III), Williams, Prichard, Langford, Freedom, Parker

* Trade obviously can’t be made until late January due to Smart & Williams III contract extensions.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2021, 03:29:47 PM by Ed Monix »
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #1 on: December 24, 2021, 03:52:19 PM »

Offline Rosco917

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Sometimes I'm not even sure Simmons has a hunger to play basketball anymore.

But hypothetically let's just say he does, I find him intriguing playing along side the J's...I always have. The Celtics get crazy switchable on defense. He's 6-10. He's a much better playmaker and passer than Smart, and he won't take ill-advised shots either. The J's would pay attention to him, being he's a three time all-star PG. I could see the ball popping around, but that leaves the 35 year old Horford as our main center, besides Freedom.

Is Smart and Williams an over-pay?   
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #2 on: December 24, 2021, 04:18:01 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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Quote from: Ed Monix on December 24, 2021, 02:40:33 PM
Horford
Tatum
Brown
Richardson
Simmons
Just because Philly was using Simmons on the ball, it doesn't mean he's actually a Point Guard. All it means is he was clearing the paint for Embiid. If we somehow manage to put Simmons alongside the Jays (which I don't think we will), I'd use him at the 4 alongside Horford. He'd be our primary ball handler in the open court. I bet he'd play mostly off the ball in the half court. Imagine Simmons filling Bam's shoes in Miami: a)he provides secondary play making in the half court, b) he sets picks on the perimeter and then rolls hard to the basket. Can't do the latter in Philly cause he's sharing the floor with a dominant low post scorer in Embiid.

PG: Pritchard (great shooter with deep range, perfect fit next to Simmons on the offensive side of the ball)
SG: Brown
SF: Tatum
PF: Simmons
C: Horford

I'd love to watch this team play, but it's probably a pipe dream.
« Last Edit: December 24, 2021, 04:37:13 PM by Jvalin »
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #3 on: December 24, 2021, 04:20:44 PM »

Offline Walker Wiggle

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This is really where having Udoka as your head coach comes in handy. Udoka was an assistant under Brett Brown and, I assume, should be able to tell the front office honestly about whether or not he thinks he can manage Simmons and what kind of teammate he would be.

That's a prerequisite. I agree that Simmons has the perfect skillset to play with this team (especially if you replace Smart with a better shooter at SG). But you've got to be 100 percent confident the team can manage him as a teammate, and Udoka is probably as well equipped as anyone to answer that question.
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #4 on: December 24, 2021, 04:33:37 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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past the point where I see Simmons as any sort of positive addition to this team.  way too much baggage.  would have to show he's committed to playing hard, playing every game and improving his skills - especially shooting -- for me to have any interest in him
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #5 on: December 24, 2021, 05:04:07 PM »

Offline Jvalin

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Quote from: slamtheking on December 24, 2021, 04:33:37 PM
past the point where I see Simmons as any sort of positive addition to this team.  way too much baggage.  would have to show he's committed to playing hard, playing every game and improving his skills - especially shooting -- for me to have any interest in him
If the bolded part happens, why would Philly trade him?

Trades involve risks. If you aren't willing to take risks, you will never finalize a trade (sort of what Danny was doing during his last seasons).
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #6 on: December 25, 2021, 01:23:31 PM »

Offline michigan adam

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Quote from: Rosco917 on December 24, 2021, 03:52:19 PM
Sometimes I'm not even sure Simmons has a hunger to play basketball anymore.

But hypothetically let's just say he does, I find him intriguing playing along side the J's...I always have. The Celtics get crazy switchable on defense. He's 6-10. He's a much better playmaker and passer than Smart, and he won't take ill-advised shots either. The J's would pay attention to him, being he's a three time all-star PG. I could see the ball popping around, but that leaves the 35 year old Horford as our main center, besides Freedom.

Is Smart and Williams an over-pay?

I'd be ok with this trade if the picks went the other way. Rw3 and smart are worth more than Simmons at this point.
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #7 on: December 26, 2021, 11:17:38 PM »

Offline CBS_Take a Report

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As far as I’m concerned, Ben Simmons is not that coveted of an asset otherwise he would’ve already been moved given his demands. And while I think his trade value will increase come trade deadline, I don’t think it will reach the level Daryl Morey places on him.

Why couldn’t we alter the package to the following:

Smart/Richardson/Hernangomez/Williams III

For

Simmons/Niang (Lawrence MA kid comes home)

Schroder
Brown
Tatum
Simmons
Horford

That’s a very competitive starting 5.

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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #8 on: December 27, 2021, 02:03:24 AM »

Offline slamtheking

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Quote from: Jvalin on December 24, 2021, 05:04:07 PM
Quote from: slamtheking on December 24, 2021, 04:33:37 PM
past the point where I see Simmons as any sort of positive addition to this team.  way too much baggage.  would have to show he's committed to playing hard, playing every game and improving his skills - especially shooting -- for me to have any interest in him
If the bolded part happens, why would Philly trade him?

Trades involve risks. If you aren't willing to take risks, you will never finalize a trade (sort of what Danny was doing during his last seasons).
1) If (big IF) Simmons were to come back and play, it'd most likely be to establish himself as a player that could make a difference for the right team -- not Philly but another team -- to help grease the wheels on a deal.  He's made it clear he wants out so that's why Philly would deal him.  Get something for him rather than tie up a lot of money on a player that's refusing to play for them.  They may not be cutting him a check but he's still taking up a lot of room against their cap.
2) Simmons is an unreasonable risk in my viewpoint.  trades can involve some degree of risk but a smart GM takes minimal risks.  Simmons is a huge risk.  Risks are (A) There's no guarantee he agrees to play for the team acquiring him so now that team is stuck like Philly is currently, (B) Simmons skills could have seriously eroded with his time away from the game so any hopes of him being an impactful player are shot, (C) his skills may not have totally eroded but he could be the player we all saw melt under the pressure in last year's playoffs so he's now a high-paid player that's a liability at the end of games.
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #9 on: December 27, 2021, 07:26:20 AM »

Offline boscel33

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I'd rather try for KAT!

From an earlier post this year (Hardwood Houdini):

KAT and Layman to C's, RWill, Al, Schroeder, GWill, Romeo, 2022 1st, 2024 1st, and 2026 1st to T-Wolves

or

KAT and Layman to C's, RWill, Al, PP, Nesmith, GWill, 2022 1st, and 2024 1st, to T-Wolves

Like I've said before, I love JB, but KAT is the one guy I trade him for.  Getting KAT without giving up JB gives us the triple threat team seem to need.

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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #10 on: December 27, 2021, 07:43:07 AM »

Online Birdman

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I don’t think Simmons would fit along Tatum and brown very good
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C/PF-Horford, Baynes, Noel, Theis, Morris,
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PG- Irving, Rozier, Larkin
Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #11 on: December 27, 2021, 07:55:48 AM »

Offline moiso

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Quote from: Jvalin on December 24, 2021, 04:18:01 PM
Quote from: Ed Monix on December 24, 2021, 02:40:33 PM
Horford
Tatum
Brown
Richardson
Simmons
Just because Philly was using Simmons on the ball, it doesn't mean he's actually a Point Guard. All it means is he was clearing the paint for Embiid. If we somehow manage to put Simmons alongside the Jays (which I don't think we will), I'd use him at the 4 alongside Horford. He'd be our primary ball handler in the open court. I bet he'd play mostly off the ball in the half court. Imagine Simmons filling Bam's shoes in Miami: a)he provides secondary play making in the half court, b) he sets picks on the perimeter and then rolls hard to the basket. Can't do the latter in Philly cause he's sharing the floor with a dominant low post scorer in Embiid.

PG: Pritchard (great shooter with deep range, perfect fit next to Simmons on the offensive side of the ball)
SG: Brown
SF: Tatum
PF: Simmons
C: Horford

I'd love to watch this team play, but it's probably a pipe dream.
You are right in terms of fit but Simmons came into the league demanding to be a point guard and implied that there would be problems if he wasn't named starting point guard.  Well, he was named starting point guard for several years and there still were problems.  He's obviously a stubborn guy who thinks he calls all of the shots.  I don't think Simmons will suddenly decide he'd rather play like Draymond Green than Magic Johnson even if it's for the good of a team and it makes that team a contender.  It looks like his personal goals are most important to him.

And as to why the Sixers would trade him even if he improved his shooting- it's because the bridges are already burned.  He and Embiid will never trust each other.
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #12 on: December 27, 2021, 10:09:29 AM »

Offline showtime

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 Never happen! The only team that wants Marcus Smart iis the Celtics!
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #13 on: December 27, 2021, 10:14:06 AM »

Offline W8ting2McHale

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I don’t see Simmons playing center, small ball or otherwise. Not that I think it’s outside his skill set, but because I see him refusing to do it!

Anthony Davis and quite a few other Star big men have not wanted to play center. They were okay with forward, but not center. Why would Simmons? I don’t see him as a guy wanting to bang in the paint. At all. Sure, if you look at what he’s good at, his size and athletic ability, it seems like the perfect solution, but this is a guy that doesn’t even want to play traditional power forward.

He could be a Magic or Giannis type player if he wanted to be, but instead he wants to dictate how he plays. How is Ime going to change that? He can somehow change Simmons attitude? As a rookie coach? According to many on here he can’t even hold the Jay’s accountable for iso hero ball!

At this point Simmons is fool’s gold. Acquiring him would bankrupt this team.
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Re: Trade Idea: Celtics - 76ers (Here We Go Again)
« Reply #14 on: December 27, 2021, 12:23:30 PM »

Offline CBS_Take a Report

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Quote from: boscel33 on December 27, 2021, 07:26:20 AM
I'd rather try for KAT!

From an earlier post this year (Hardwood Houdini):

KAT and Layman to C's, RWill, Al, Schroeder, GWill, Romeo, 2022 1st, 2024 1st, and 2026 1st to T-Wolves

or

KAT and Layman to C's, RWill, Al, PP, Nesmith, GWill, 2022 1st, and 2024 1st, to T-Wolves

Like I've said before, I love JB, but KAT is the one guy I trade him for.  Getting KAT without giving up JB gives us the triple threat team seem to need.

So wouldn’t the Timberwolves. They are a young emerging team with a young nucleus. KAT is one of the best bigs in the league and is on their timeline. No chance they trade him now… especially with how quickly Anthony Edwards has made them competitive. They are adding not subtracting going fwd.
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