Ian Thompsen: C’s are “self-obssessed”

[Ed Monix]

Former SI and NBA writer Ian Thompsen went on the Celtics Beat Podcast on CLNS Media and doubled down on what many have been saying about the Celtics. They are playing a selfish, individual brand of basketball.

“That’s who these guys are as individuals. They’re self-obsessed,” Thompsen told hosts Adam Kaufman and Evan Valenti. “They just don’t see the bigger picture. It doesn’t mean they can’t, they’re just immature as basketball players and as a team. This is like middle school kind of stuff, where you’re worried about your own game first. They should be way past that, but they aren’t.”

Boston only tallied 13 assists on 35 made baskets in their loss to the Suns. It was the least amount of assists they have notched in a game all season. Jayson Tatum and Dennis Schroder dominated the ball, combining for 39 of the Celtics’ 90 points.

This isn’t a new issue, either. Head coach Ime Udoka has spoken out about the Celtics’ inability to play as a team in the past. Most notably, he called out his starters after the team’s loss to the San Antonio Spurs on November 26:

“It’s habits that we need to break,” said Udoka. “Not trying to go isolation. We got Marcus, Jaylen, Jayson, and Dennis starting. They need to learn to play together, not try to just get baskets for themselves.”

Thompsen acknowledged Udoka has done a good job holding his players accountable, and he’s doing it in a constructive way.

“He (Udoka) isn’t yelling about it,” Thompsen said. “He’s just saying what the facts are, and it’s being done with respect. And I bet a lot of fans wish he would yell because they’re all yelling at the TV watching the game.  I think he has a much better chance of reaching them if he says, ‘look, we’re all in this together’… And develop that kind of partnership.”

“If these guys are going into games looking to get themselves started, which we all know is true watching, then it just shows how far they have to go to develop it. It’s not going to happen quickly.”

Source: CLNS Media

[hpantazo]

Former SI and NBA writer Ian Thompsen went on the Celtics Beat Podcast on CLNS Media and doubled down on what many have been saying about the Celtics. They are playing a selfish, individual brand of basketball.

“That’s who these guys are as individuals. They’re self-obsessed,” Thompsen told hosts Adam Kaufman and Evan Valenti. “They just don’t see the bigger picture. It doesn’t mean they can’t, they’re just immature as basketball players and as a team. This is like middle school kind of stuff, where you’re worried about your own game first. They should be way past that, but they aren’t.”

Boston only tallied 13 assists on 35 made baskets in their loss to the Suns. It was the least amount of assists they have notched in a game all season. Jayson Tatum and Dennis Schroder dominated the ball, combining for 39 of the Celtics’ 90 points.

This isn’t a new issue, either. Head coach Ime Udoka has spoken out about the Celtics’ inability to play as a team in the past. Most notably, he called out his starters after the team’s loss to the San Antonio Spurs on November 26:

“It’s habits that we need to break,” said Udoka. “Not trying to go isolation. We got Marcus, Jaylen, Jayson, and Dennis starting. They need to learn to play together, not try to just get baskets for themselves.”

Thompsen acknowledged Udoka has done a good job holding his players accountable, and he’s doing it in a constructive way.

“He (Udoka) isn’t yelling about it,” Thompsen said. “He’s just saying what the facts are, and it’s being done with respect. And I bet a lot of fans wish he would yell because they’re all yelling at the TV watching the game.  I think he has a much better chance of reaching them if he says, ‘look, we’re all in this together’… And develop that kind of partnership.”

“If these guys are going into games looking to get themselves started, which we all know is true watching, then it just shows how far they have to go to develop it. It’s not going to happen quickly.”

Source: CLNS Media

That's the problem right there, and has been for years now. It wasn't Hayward or Kyrie or Kemba, it's Tatum, Brown and Smart not wanting to share the ball and each looking out for themselves first and foremost. Kyrie saw that and checked out, and so did Hayward, and even Ainge and Brad Stevens.

[Ogaju]

Yaaaaaaaaawwwwwwwwwwwwwwwn

We have been saying this for more than a couple of years. Enough of the ‘problems’. It is time for solutions.

[Somebody]

I wish Jose Mourinho had the Boston media covering him, imagine the lengths that they would go to in order to protect a coach who's actually good

[ozgod]

Former SI and NBA writer Ian Thompsen went on the Celtics Beat Podcast on CLNS Media and doubled down on what many have been saying about the Celtics. They are playing a selfish, individual brand of basketball.

“That’s who these guys are as individuals. They’re self-obsessed,” Thompsen told hosts Adam Kaufman and Evan Valenti. “They just don’t see the bigger picture. It doesn’t mean they can’t, they’re just immature as basketball players and as a team. This is like middle school kind of stuff, where you’re worried about your own game first. They should be way past that, but they aren’t.”

Boston only tallied 13 assists on 35 made baskets in their loss to the Suns. It was the least amount of assists they have notched in a game all season. Jayson Tatum and Dennis Schroder dominated the ball, combining for 39 of the Celtics’ 90 points.

This isn’t a new issue, either. Head coach Ime Udoka has spoken out about the Celtics’ inability to play as a team in the past. Most notably, he called out his starters after the team’s loss to the San Antonio Spurs on November 26:

“It’s habits that we need to break,” said Udoka. “Not trying to go isolation. We got Marcus, Jaylen, Jayson, and Dennis starting. They need to learn to play together, not try to just get baskets for themselves.”

Thompsen acknowledged Udoka has done a good job holding his players accountable, and he’s doing it in a constructive way.

“He (Udoka) isn’t yelling about it,” Thompsen said. “He’s just saying what the facts are, and it’s being done with respect. And I bet a lot of fans wish he would yell because they’re all yelling at the TV watching the game.  I think he has a much better chance of reaching them if he says, ‘look, we’re all in this together’… And develop that kind of partnership.”

“If these guys are going into games looking to get themselves started, which we all know is true watching, then it just shows how far they have to go to develop it. It’s not going to happen quickly.”

Source: CLNS Media

Like most things, there's no one simple cause. You look at the assist numbers are say "gee these guys just don't pass the ball". And you look at the Pass Tracking stats on NBA.com, we're 21st in the league in assists. Same for potential assists, which is defined as an assist that would have led to a possession event (e.g. a shot, a foul, or a turnover). We're also ranked 21.



Then you look at our shooting %. This screenshot I did is sorted by wide open 3s because it was to answer @rockandroll's question about how bad our shooting is but you can also see the stats for 2FGs that are open). We're in the bottom 6 when it comes to making wide open 3s:



We can't even shoot the ball from the perimeter when we're open, which, with our drive and kick offense, really hurts us. That's where a lot of these potential assist numbers have gone to. To record an assist you need the player you are passing to to make the shot. And we have the wrong type of players shooting - our best 3FG shooters aren't shooting the ball as much as others:



Definitely the mentality of the players probably feeds into it, but if you keep drawing two and giving it up and your teammates keep bricking it then I'm sure it gets frustrating and you need a lot of discipline to keep doing that when they keep missing.

That potential assist number has definitely trended on the lower side...it was in the 50s in October. I would be interested to see it on a per game basis but it's quite time consuming to do it one by one. I'm sure there's a correlation between it and our shooting %...when people are making shots the ball just flows better. If someone wanted to make the effort the passing stats can be found here:

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/passing/?sort=POTENTIAL_AST&dir=1&Season=2021-22&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Month=3

[todd_days_41]

Here’s another recent bit of media about the state of the Cs, including quotes from Zach Lowe, Bobby Marks, and Jake Fischer:

https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-celtics/2021/12/11/nba-insiders-celtics-trade-rumors-brad-stevens-jaylen-brown/?amp=1

[Celtics2021]

NBA writers were chomping at the bit the second Jaylen Brown was hurt for a brutal 5-game West Coast trip.  The articles were practically going to write themselves.

[pokeKingCurtis]

NBA writers were chomping at the bit the second Jaylen Brown was hurt for a brutal 5-game West Coast trip.  The articles were practically going to write themselves.

Good call

[Rosco917]

Give a man-child that has struggled his entire life 20 million a year, blindly hand a billion dollar franchise over to them and provide no discipline or direction.

Yeah, the results are predictable. 
 

[Roy H.]

We’re asking the most undisciplined player on the team not only to be a starter, but our starting point guard. 

Marcus just isn’t a great fit alongside the Jays.

[Kuberski33]

Give a man-child that has struggled his entire life 20 million a year, blindly hand a billion dollar franchise over to them and provide no discipline or direction.

Yeah, the results are predictable. 
 

And your options are that or watch them walk and watch your team fall to the Lottery with no guarantee of escaping in the short term.  Such is what today's NBA is all about.

[KG Living Legend]

 Remember when Ime was literally making fun of Brad at the press conference about how terrible of a passing team we are?

 Not so funny now is it Ime. I feel like a basketball genius. Been saying for years we need an elite level passer.

 Chris Paul Lamelo Ball would transform this team overnight. Kyle Anderson Scottie Barnes please just get someone in here who's first priority is passing! It's contagious!!!

[Roy H.]

 Remember when Ime was literally making fun of Brad at the press conference about his terrible of a passing team we are?

 Not so funny now is it Ime. I feel like a basketball genius. Been saying for years we need an elite level passer.

 Chris Paul Lamelo Ball would transform this team overnight. Kyle Anderson Scottie Barnes please just get someone in here who's first priority is passing! It's contagious!!!

Gordon Hayward would look great here.

[kraidstar]

Former SI and NBA writer Ian Thompsen went on the Celtics Beat Podcast on CLNS Media and doubled down on what many have been saying about the Celtics. They are playing a selfish, individual brand of basketball.

“That’s who these guys are as individuals. They’re self-obsessed,” Thompsen told hosts Adam Kaufman and Evan Valenti. “They just don’t see the bigger picture. It doesn’t mean they can’t, they’re just immature as basketball players and as a team. This is like middle school kind of stuff, where you’re worried about your own game first. They should be way past that, but they aren’t.”

Boston only tallied 13 assists on 35 made baskets in their loss to the Suns. It was the least amount of assists they have notched in a game all season. Jayson Tatum and Dennis Schroder dominated the ball, combining for 39 of the Celtics’ 90 points.

This isn’t a new issue, either. Head coach Ime Udoka has spoken out about the Celtics’ inability to play as a team in the past. Most notably, he called out his starters after the team’s loss to the San Antonio Spurs on November 26:

“It’s habits that we need to break,” said Udoka. “Not trying to go isolation. We got Marcus, Jaylen, Jayson, and Dennis starting. They need to learn to play together, not try to just get baskets for themselves.”

Thompsen acknowledged Udoka has done a good job holding his players accountable, and he’s doing it in a constructive way.

“He (Udoka) isn’t yelling about it,” Thompsen said. “He’s just saying what the facts are, and it’s being done with respect. And I bet a lot of fans wish he would yell because they’re all yelling at the TV watching the game.  I think he has a much better chance of reaching them if he says, ‘look, we’re all in this together’… And develop that kind of partnership.”

“If these guys are going into games looking to get themselves started, which we all know is true watching, then it just shows how far they have to go to develop it. It’s not going to happen quickly.”

Source: CLNS Media

Like most things, there's no one simple cause. You look at the assist numbers are say "gee these guys just don't pass the ball". And you look at the Pass Tracking stats on NBA.com, we're 21st in the league in assists. Same for potential assists, which is defined as an assist that would have led to a possession event (e.g. a shot, a foul, or a turnover). We're also ranked 21.



Then you look at our shooting %. This screenshot I did is sorted by wide open 3s because it was to answer @rockandroll's question about how bad our shooting is but you can also see the stats for 2FGs that are open). We're in the bottom 6 when it comes to making wide open 3s:



We can't even shoot the ball from the perimeter when we're open, which, with our drive and kick offense, really hurts us. That's where a lot of these potential assist numbers have gone to. To record an assist you need the player you are passing to to make the shot. And we have the wrong type of players shooting - our best 3FG shooters aren't shooting the ball as much as others:



Definitely the mentality of the players probably feeds into it, but if you keep drawing two and giving it up and your teammates keep bricking it then I'm sure it gets frustrating and you need a lot of discipline to keep doing that when they keep missing.

That potential assist number has definitely trended on the lower side...it was in the 50s in October. I would be interested to see it on a per game basis but it's quite time consuming to do it one by one. I'm sure there's a correlation between it and our shooting %...when people are making shots the ball just flows better. If someone wanted to make the effort the passing stats can be found here:

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/passing/?sort=POTENTIAL_AST&dir=1&Season=2021-22&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Month=3

Strongly disagree. This mentality has a trickle down effect on every single play.

When Tatum has the ball he is trying to score every time. He passes mostly out of desperation, and generates poor shots as a result. Guys don't move off the ball. Why should they? but that hurts shot generation too. On the off chance they see the ball the role players play iso too. And why not? It's the only way they'll be able to get stats to continue their careers.

Opposing defenses know how predictable Tatum et al are. The Celtics hate passing. It is a dream come true for other teams. Players of Tatum and brown's ability should be eviscerating other teams. You know those plays where our guys are behind on D, looking like fools because the pass is always one step ahead? That's what we should be doing.

It doesn't matter who we bring in as long as Tatum, Brown, and Smart are running the show.

[Rosco917]

Former SI and NBA writer Ian Thompsen went on the Celtics Beat Podcast on CLNS Media and doubled down on what many have been saying about the Celtics. They are playing a selfish, individual brand of basketball.

“That’s who these guys are as individuals. They’re self-obsessed,” Thompsen told hosts Adam Kaufman and Evan Valenti. “They just don’t see the bigger picture. It doesn’t mean they can’t, they’re just immature as basketball players and as a team. This is like middle school kind of stuff, where you’re worried about your own game first. They should be way past that, but they aren’t.”

Boston only tallied 13 assists on 35 made baskets in their loss to the Suns. It was the least amount of assists they have notched in a game all season. Jayson Tatum and Dennis Schroder dominated the ball, combining for 39 of the Celtics’ 90 points.

This isn’t a new issue, either. Head coach Ime Udoka has spoken out about the Celtics’ inability to play as a team in the past. Most notably, he called out his starters after the team’s loss to the San Antonio Spurs on November 26:

“It’s habits that we need to break,” said Udoka. “Not trying to go isolation. We got Marcus, Jaylen, Jayson, and Dennis starting. They need to learn to play together, not try to just get baskets for themselves.”

Thompsen acknowledged Udoka has done a good job holding his players accountable, and he’s doing it in a constructive way.

“He (Udoka) isn’t yelling about it,” Thompsen said. “He’s just saying what the facts are, and it’s being done with respect. And I bet a lot of fans wish he would yell because they’re all yelling at the TV watching the game.  I think he has a much better chance of reaching them if he says, ‘look, we’re all in this together’… And develop that kind of partnership.”

“If these guys are going into games looking to get themselves started, which we all know is true watching, then it just shows how far they have to go to develop it. It’s not going to happen quickly.”

Source: CLNS Media

Like most things, there's no one simple cause. You look at the assist numbers are say "gee these guys just don't pass the ball". And you look at the Pass Tracking stats on NBA.com, we're 21st in the league in assists. Same for potential assists, which is defined as an assist that would have led to a possession event (e.g. a shot, a foul, or a turnover). We're also ranked 21.



Then you look at our shooting %. This screenshot I did is sorted by wide open 3s because it was to answer @rockandroll's question about how bad our shooting is but you can also see the stats for 2FGs that are open). We're in the bottom 6 when it comes to making wide open 3s:



We can't even shoot the ball from the perimeter when we're open, which, with our drive and kick offense, really hurts us. That's where a lot of these potential assist numbers have gone to. To record an assist you need the player you are passing to to make the shot. And we have the wrong type of players shooting - our best 3FG shooters aren't shooting the ball as much as others:



Definitely the mentality of the players probably feeds into it, but if you keep drawing two and giving it up and your teammates keep bricking it then I'm sure it gets frustrating and you need a lot of discipline to keep doing that when they keep missing.

That potential assist number has definitely trended on the lower side...it was in the 50s in October. I would be interested to see it on a per game basis but it's quite time consuming to do it one by one. I'm sure there's a correlation between it and our shooting %...when people are making shots the ball just flows better. If someone wanted to make the effort the passing stats can be found here:

https://www.nba.com/stats/teams/passing/?sort=POTENTIAL_AST&dir=1&Season=2021-22&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&Month=3

They're missing shots because they seldom get a chance to succeed in realtime action. They'll hit the same shot at high percentage in practice when adrenaline is low and they're uncovered. Lesser players will never grow and gain confidence if they're not involved, and it eventually effects team defense. Quick, accurate ball movement KILLS opposing teams defense. It's called BUILDING a team.