Bench Smart / Marcus Calls Out The Jays

[Indocelts]

If Boston is going to keep starting 2 bigs, then Schroder needs to be the other guy on the floor with Brown and Tatum.  The team needs an actual playmaker on the floor and Smart just isn't good in that role.  I do think the team would be better off with Schroder, Smart, Brown, Tatum, and Horford starting though.  That has always been the lineup that makes the most sense to me.  Trim up the rotation for a few games (play like 9 guys) and really hunker down and see what the team can do.

I agree, the playmaking and penetration Schroder provides is crucial if we continue starting two bigs.

Penetration.

The most important skill that our PG must have with our current offensive scheme.

Schroder has it. Smart doesn't.

[Celtics2021]

The Celtics are 20 points per 100 possessions better when Smart is on the court compared to off it.
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203935

The Celtics are 9 points better when Tatum is on the court than off (and are a net negative in either case).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1628369

The Celtics are 6 points better with Schroder on the court (but again, are a net negative).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203471

Smart isn't the problem.  He does make winning plays.  He doesn't make many winning shots.  I'd argue Tatum's play has been more of the problem, and I don't get the Schroder love, but whatever.  But the real problem is this guy:
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1626196


I liked the move over the summer, but it is not working out with him yet.

EDITED due to bad links.

How dare you bring facts into this. Don’t you know Smart shouldn’t call out what everyone knows that Tatum and Brown are ball hogs. Selfish ball hogs. Everyone says it. I am glad Smart finally put these two selfish ball hogs on blast.

Yeah, What's Smart doing? ZERO assists. ZERO!

Zero assists doesn't mean he didn't pass, you know.

[Roy H.]

The Celtics are 20 points per 100 possessions better when Smart is on the court compared to off it.
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203935

The Celtics are 9 points better when Tatum is on the court than off (and are a net negative in either case).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1628369

The Celtics are 6 points better with Schroder on the court (but again, are a net negative).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203471

Smart isn't the problem.  He does make winning plays.  He doesn't make many winning shots.  I'd argue Tatum's play has been more of the problem, and I don't get the Schroder love, but whatever.  But the real problem is this guy:
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1626196


I liked the move over the summer, but it is not working out with him yet.

EDITED due to bad links.

How dare you bring facts into this. Don’t you know Smart shouldn’t call out what everyone knows that Tatum and Brown are ball hogs. Selfish ball hogs. Everyone says it. I am glad Smart finally put these two selfish ball hogs on blast.

Yeah, What's Smart doing? ZERO assists. ZERO!

Zero assists doesn't mean he didn't pass, you know.

It means not one of his passes resulted in a bucket, though.   Every player that played more than two minutes had an assist other than our starting point guard.

[liam]

The Celtics are 20 points per 100 possessions better when Smart is on the court compared to off it.
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203935

The Celtics are 9 points better when Tatum is on the court than off (and are a net negative in either case).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1628369

The Celtics are 6 points better with Schroder on the court (but again, are a net negative).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203471

Smart isn't the problem.  He does make winning plays.  He doesn't make many winning shots.  I'd argue Tatum's play has been more of the problem, and I don't get the Schroder love, but whatever.  But the real problem is this guy:
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1626196


I liked the move over the summer, but it is not working out with him yet.

EDITED due to bad links.

How dare you bring facts into this. Don’t you know Smart shouldn’t call out what everyone knows that Tatum and Brown are ball hogs. Selfish ball hogs. Everyone says it. I am glad Smart finally put these two selfish ball hogs on blast.

Yeah, What's Smart doing? ZERO assists. ZERO!

Zero assists doesn't mean he didn't pass, you know.

Yeah, but it means he assisted on zero baskets and he's our starting point guard and we were shooting 60% from 3 for half the game.

[Celtics2021]

The Celtics are 20 points per 100 possessions better when Smart is on the court compared to off it.
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203935

The Celtics are 9 points better when Tatum is on the court than off (and are a net negative in either case).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1628369

The Celtics are 6 points better with Schroder on the court (but again, are a net negative).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203471

Smart isn't the problem.  He does make winning plays.  He doesn't make many winning shots.  I'd argue Tatum's play has been more of the problem, and I don't get the Schroder love, but whatever.  But the real problem is this guy:
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1626196


I liked the move over the summer, but it is not working out with him yet.

EDITED due to bad links.

How dare you bring facts into this. Don’t you know Smart shouldn’t call out what everyone knows that Tatum and Brown are ball hogs. Selfish ball hogs. Everyone says it. I am glad Smart finally put these two selfish ball hogs on blast.

Yeah, What's Smart doing? ZERO assists. ZERO!

Zero assists doesn't mean he didn't pass, you know.

Yeah, but it means he assisted on zero baskets and he's our starting point guard and we were shooting 60% from 3 for half the game.

It's funny that argument -- he was the starting PG and we were shooting 60% from 3 for half the game -- but you wanted him to do something different that half?

[Roy H.]

The Celtics are 20 points per 100 possessions better when Smart is on the court compared to off it.
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203935

The Celtics are 9 points better when Tatum is on the court than off (and are a net negative in either case).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1628369

The Celtics are 6 points better with Schroder on the court (but again, are a net negative).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203471

Smart isn't the problem.  He does make winning plays.  He doesn't make many winning shots.  I'd argue Tatum's play has been more of the problem, and I don't get the Schroder love, but whatever.  But the real problem is this guy:
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1626196


I liked the move over the summer, but it is not working out with him yet.

EDITED due to bad links.

How dare you bring facts into this. Don’t you know Smart shouldn’t call out what everyone knows that Tatum and Brown are ball hogs. Selfish ball hogs. Everyone says it. I am glad Smart finally put these two selfish ball hogs on blast.

Yeah, What's Smart doing? ZERO assists. ZERO!

Zero assists doesn't mean he didn't pass, you know.

Yeah, but it means he assisted on zero baskets and he's our starting point guard and we were shooting 60% from 3 for half the game.

It's funny that argument -- he was the starting PG and we were shooting 60% from 3 for half the game -- but you wanted him to do something different that half?

Probably.  Marcus was -6 in the first quarter; we were +7 with him sitting.  “Something different” probably would have helped the team.

[liam]

The Celtics are 20 points per 100 possessions better when Smart is on the court compared to off it.
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203935

The Celtics are 9 points better when Tatum is on the court than off (and are a net negative in either case).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1628369

The Celtics are 6 points better with Schroder on the court (but again, are a net negative).
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=203471

Smart isn't the problem.  He does make winning plays.  He doesn't make many winning shots.  I'd argue Tatum's play has been more of the problem, and I don't get the Schroder love, but whatever.  But the real problem is this guy:
https://www.nba.com/stats/vs/advanced/#!?TeamID=1610612738&VsPlayerID=1626196


I liked the move over the summer, but it is not working out with him yet.

EDITED due to bad links.

How dare you bring facts into this. Don’t you know Smart shouldn’t call out what everyone knows that Tatum and Brown are ball hogs. Selfish ball hogs. Everyone says it. I am glad Smart finally put these two selfish ball hogs on blast.

Yeah, What's Smart doing? ZERO assists. ZERO!

Zero assists doesn't mean he didn't pass, you know.

Yeah, but it means he assisted on zero baskets and he's our starting point guard and we were shooting 60% from 3 for half the game.

It's funny that argument -- he was the starting PG and we were shooting 60% from 3 for half the game -- but you wanted him to do something different that half?

He had zero assists during that. The shooting wasn't going to last but Smart had no assists during that run. A good lob to TIMELORD is money in the bank. A good point guard would get 2 or 3 assists from that a game alone.

[nickagneta]

The ball hog and guy that won't pass the ball, Jaylen Brown, had 3 assists in the first half including a beautiful lob to Timelord and a great over the defense, full court pass to Al Horford for the lay in.

But the guy complaining about Jaylen not passing had zero assists the whole game.

Strange that.

[Celtics4ever]

I am alone but I almost like Brown more than Tatum, he plays on both ends.

[Celtics2021]

I am alone but I almost like Brown more than Tatum, he plays on both ends.

You are not alone, even as I defend Marcus in this thread.  Although I wonder what Brown looks like without Tatum, and think I might not like it.

[Ogaju]

I am alone but I almost like Brown more than Tatum, he plays on both ends.

nick says hi.

[blink]

Play the Jay's together more and play them in the pnr together. If either gets blitzed as the ball handler on the pnr, the first wide open outlet will be the other Jay, a top notch shooter/scorer. When you are running Tatum on pnr  with Smart or Richardson, you don't want Tatum's first outlet to be Smart or Richardson or anyone else running the pnr with him while the other Jay sits in the opposite corner as a decoy. A decoy, I must admit, that no longer draws any gravity after seeing for years in Steven's system that that decoy never gets the ball. So that defender cheats in and mucks things up on the Celtics

I think it's easy to see the CS are at their best when both Jay's are on the floor. And the Jay's don't even play in unison or in any pnr  plays together. Draw up plays for the Jay's in a pnr or in a three man weave with Horford and I think the results could be amazing. But we just aren't seeing that.

I think the team could survive both Jay's being off the floor together for a minute or 2 each half if it meant them playing together 2-4 minutes more per game and playing in unison to a devastating effect.

But hey, what do I know. I'm just an internet moron.

this is what I've been saying since the end of last season - the J's should be playing a 2-man game as the best offense we have.  both defenders cannot cheat off one to double the other.  similar to when Bird and Mchale played a 2-man game on offense in the 80's.  nothing the other team could really do about it.

Smart needs to come off the bench.  never considered him starter material and he hasn't proven me wrong this season.  start Schroder with Brown, Tatum and Horford.  5th starter will either be dependent on the matchup with the opposing team or someone will separate themselves from the pack during the season.  just not Smart.

Yes TPs to both of you.  We need JT and JB playing off each other.  If we want a guy to sit in the corner as a decoy, trade for someone ELSE that fits that role.  If we are going to suck this bad this year, it might as well be a year of a lot of learning by JT / JB in working together, pick and roles, two man games, screening one off the other.  they don't have to do it at the top of the key.  If there were some decent plays which had down screens or screens across the lane, it would get both of them open in the lane, probably increase ft attempts.  The Tatum iso play should be stripped from the playbook, get both JT and JB moving without the ball, make defenders make a choice which of the two they want to guard / double on, then we attack.

[Who]

Play the Jay's together more and play them in the pnr together. If either gets blitzed as the ball handler on the pnr, the first wide open outlet will be the other Jay, a top notch shooter/scorer. When you are running Tatum on pnr  with Smart or Richardson, you don't want Tatum's first outlet to be Smart or Richardson or anyone else running the pnr with him while the other Jay sits in the opposite corner as a decoy. A decoy, I must admit, that no longer draws any gravity after seeing for years in Steven's system that that decoy never gets the ball. So that defender cheats in and mucks things up on the Celtics

I think it's easy to see the CS are at their best when both Jay's are on the floor. And the Jay's don't even play in unison or in any pnr  plays together. Draw up plays for the Jay's in a pnr or in a three man weave with Horford and I think the results could be amazing. But we just aren't seeing that.

I think the team could survive both Jay's being off the floor together for a minute or 2 each half if it meant them playing together 2-4 minutes more per game and playing in unison to a devastating effect.

But hey, what do I know. I'm just an internet moron.

this is what I've been saying since the end of last season - the J's should be playing a 2-man game as the best offense we have.  both defenders cannot cheat off one to double the other.  similar to when Bird and Mchale played a 2-man game on offense in the 80's.  nothing the other team could really do about it.

Smart needs to come off the bench.  never considered him starter material and he hasn't proven me wrong this season.  start Schroder with Brown, Tatum and Horford.  5th starter will either be dependent on the matchup with the opposing team or someone will separate themselves from the pack during the season.  just not Smart.

Yes TPs to both of you.  We need JT and JB playing off each other.  If we want a guy to sit in the corner as a decoy, trade for someone ELSE that fits that role.  If we are going to suck this bad this year, it might as well be a year of a lot of learning by JT / JB in working together, pick and roles, two man games, screening one off the other.  they don't have to do it at the top of the key.  If there were some decent plays which had down screens or screens across the lane, it would get both of them open in the lane, probably increase ft attempts.  The Tatum iso play should be stripped from the playbook, get both JT and JB moving without the ball, make defenders make a choice which of the two they want to guard / double on, then we attack.

I don't know about Tatum & Jaylen in the PnR together.

That looks like an easy switch for the defense to me. They can get a more advantageous switch by running the PnR with a big man or a little guard where they have an easier matchup to attack. Running the PnR together keeps a normal defensive matchup on them.

I like having one on the strong side of the ball and one on the weak side. Not the corner but the wing. The reason is when the attacker on the strong side attacks the defense and forces the team D to collapse, he then swings the ball to the weak side ... what you want is one of your most dangerous attackers to be the one to attack that collapsed defense whether with his jump shot or a drive for a finish or a penetrative pass.

Pippen and Jordan did that very well for the Bulls. One would draw the defense on one side of the court and then move the ball to the other side of the court allowing the other to attack an exposed defense.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

I never liked the idea of Smart as starting point guard, mainly because he's not a point guard. He's also not a shooting guard, as he's aptly demonstrated so far this season. I think he should be coming off the bench as a defensive specialist who should limit himself to 3 or 4 three-point attempts per game (except for those rare occasions when he's on fire). Of the players on this roster, Schroder is (clearly, IMO) the best point guard (the only legit point guard, really).

[td450]

There is a lot of focus on what Marcus is doing (or not doing) on offense.

He just isn't cutting it on defense either. His defense was awful against the Bulls. I'll be watching carefully tonight, but I just haven't seen him play well on that end in any sustained way this year.