Should Toni Kukoč Be In the Hall of Fame?

[GreenlyGreeny]

Should Toni Kukoč Be In the Hall of Fame? Why or why not?

Here is why I say no: Kukoč averaged 11.6 points, 4.2 rebounds and 3.7 assists across 13 NBA seasons — 14.1 points, 4.8 rebounds and 4.2 assists in seven with the Bulls, playing much of that time alongside Pippen and Jordan…are those really HOF numbers?

Frankly, he’s the least deserving HOFer in any of the major sports IMHO. It is almost like a scenario where the NFL decides to make Wes Welker a HOFer in 15 years because Brady and Gronk are not enough for that era. His selection hugely diminishes the accomplishment for future HOFers…can we recall HOF selections under any circumstance? Can a petition start so we can kick Toni out of the HOF promptly? 🤣

[BudweiserCeltic]

If it's based on his NBA career, then no... don't know what other accolades he has outside of the NBA.

[buzz4209]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toni_Kuko%C4%8D

It's not just the NBA hall, and Toni is clearly one of those guys who sacrificed personal stats for team play.

On teams where he wasn't with Jordan he was the clear #1 option and very successful.

[Rosco917]

The next question...should Eric Montross be in the Hall? Hey, don't forget about A C Earl.

[chicagoceltic]

I voted yes as it is not the NBA Hall of Fame. His career in Europe needs to be considered.

3× NBA champion (1996–1998)
FIBA World Championship MVP (1990)
FIBA EuroBasket MVP (1991)
3× EuroLeague champion (1989–1991)
3× EuroLeague Final Four MVP (1990, 1991, 1993)
NBA Sixth Man of the Year (1996)
FIBA's 50 Greatest Players (1991)
5× Euroscar Player of the Year (1990, 1991, 1994, 1996, 1998)
4× Mister Europa Player of the Year (1990–1992, 1996)
EuroLeague Finals Top Scorer (1990)
FIBA European Selection (1991)
50 Greatest EuroLeague Contributors (2008)
Italian League champion (1992)
Italian Cup winner (1993)
4× Yugoslav League champion (1988–1991)
2× Yugoslav Cup winner (1990, 1991)
NBA All-Rookie Second Team (1994)
3× Croatian Sportsman of the Year (1989–1991)
Franjo Bučar State Award for Sport (1992)
FIBA Under-19 World Cup MVP (1987)
FIBA Under-18 EuroBasket MVP (1986)

[Who]

Yes. He was a trailblazer. One of the early Euros to the NBA to find success in the league (paving the way for future Euros). Massively successful European career before being in the NBA. Good success in the NBA in terms of team accomplishments (part of one of the greatest teams of all time) and individual accomplishments (6MOY).

This term sub All-Star for top 50 guys in the league. That is probably where Kukoc was for most of his prime. He could have had more individual success elsewhere if he was starting and playing 35mpg. Something more similar to Detlef Schrempf who got an All-Star nod once or twice. Kukoc similar level player. Sacrificed that for being apart of those great Bulls teams.

[Birdman]

NBA career, no….overseas career yes..

[Donoghus]

It's not the NBA Hall of Fame.

[PAOBoston]

Absolutely 100%. Need to take into consideration Euro/International career and impact as well. One of the first great Euros from the Balkans to come out of Yugoslavia to NBA (played together with Petrovic/Divac/Radja).

[RockinRyA]

Should Toni Kukoč Be In the Hall of Fame? Why or why not?

Here is why I say no: Kukoč averaged 11.6 points, 4.2 rebounds and 3.7 assists across 13 NBA seasons — 14.1 points, 4.8 rebounds and 4.2 assists in seven with the Bulls, playing much of that time alongside Pippen and Jordan…are those really HOF numbers?

Frankly, he’s the least deserving HOFer in any of the major sports IMHO. It is almost like a scenario where the NFL decides to make Wes Welker a HOFer in 15 years because Brady and Gronk are not enough for that era. His selection hugely diminishes the accomplishment for future HOFers…can we recall HOF selections under any circumstance? Can a petition start so we can kick Toni out of the HOF promptly? 🤣

Its not nba hall of fame. Its basketball gall of fame.

[Neurotic Guy]

I know practically nothing about Euro-International leagues but if people are using his European career as a measure of his worthiness to enter the HOF then are there career Euros/Int who should be in the Hall?

Unlike Arvydas Sabonis, Kukoc pretty much played his entire prime in the NBA.   Does being the best in a worse league (though I don't know how much worse) really hold that much weight?  How many very good NBA players would have been Euro all-stars had they played in Europe in the 80's/90's?

[Kernewek]

I know practically nothing about Euro-International leagues but if people are using his European career as a measure of his worthiness to enter the HOF then are there career Euros/Int who should be in the Hall?

Unlike Arvydas Sabonis, Kukoc pretty much played his entire prime in the NBA.   Does being the best in a worse league (though I don't know how much worse) really hold that much weight?  How many very good NBA players would have been Euro all-stars had they played in Europe in the 80's/90's?

Tricky to say. I think it’s much more a case of guys who maybe aren’t hall of fame on their nba credentials supplementing it with stellar play elsewhere - call it Ginobili syndrome.

Or if Rudy Fernandez had propelled Spain to two or three gold medals after giving up on the NBA after the lockout.

On the coaching side, I can see an argument for Željko Obradović or David Blatt. Harder to think of players.

[Moranis]

I know practically nothing about Euro-International leagues but if people are using his European career as a measure of his worthiness to enter the HOF then are there career Euros/Int who should be in the Hall?

Unlike Arvydas Sabonis, Kukoc pretty much played his entire prime in the NBA.   Does being the best in a worse league (though I don't know how much worse) really hold that much weight?  How many very good NBA players would have been Euro all-stars had they played in Europe in the 80's/90's?

That is where it is tricky because as you point out Kukoc's entire prime was in the NBA (he was 25 as a rookie).  He did have a pretty great start to his career in Europe, but I do wonder if that is more of a real NBA talent dominating high school rather than Kukoc just being that good.  I mean Kukoc came off the bench more than he started in the NBA and that wasn't just because he was playing with MJ and Pippen, as he had more seasons without those 2 then with them (especially MJ).  The Bulls were 13-37 with Kukoc as the lead dog and he went for essentially 19/7/5 with awful shooting efficiency in that 99 Bulls season.  He was still just 30 then.  11.5/4/4 with poor efficiency for his career spanning 13 years and his entire athletic prime.  I just have a hard time putting him in the HOF even with the superb start to his career in the Yugoslavian and then Italian leagues.

[GreenlyGreeny]

So if say Marcus Smart had spent his teens and early 20s in two Euro leagues dominating the competition with 20+ PPG and then spent seven seasons with the Celtics averaging 14.1 points, 4.8 rebounds and 4.2 assists, that would make him a HOFer? I love Marcus, but no way is he a HOFer simply because he’s capable of being dominant in Europe (like so many other borderline NBA all-stars/all-defenders).

Obviously understand it is the basketball HOF, but that doesn’t put Christian Laettner in it, does it? Unlike Toni, Laettner actually made an NBA all-star appearance (and the same age when Toni was 6MOY)…Ultimately, a dude who started the NBA at 25 and never made it to a single all-star game is not a HOFer (nor is Laettner, who dominated stiffer competition in his late teens/early 20s than Toni did in Europe). Heck, Toni did not even make the FIBA HOF until 2017, so how much weight does that really carry?

His appearance in the basketball HOF greatly diminishes the caliber of the institution. Yes, it’s not the NBA HOF, but the NBA is King. Unless you absolutely humiliate Team USA as your country’s best player in your prime (see Sabonis, Arvydas, 1988 Olympics, who was never even given the choice to play in the NBA until past his prime; Argentina in 2004 had Ginobili, whose NBA career warrants the HOF that aside), really do not see competition overseas being a substitute for NBA experience as it relates to the basketball HOF. That’s what the FIBA HOF and College Basketball HOF are for…

[gouki88]

So if say Marcus Smart had spent his teens and early 20s in two Euro leagues dominating the competition with 20+ PPG and then spent seven seasons with the Celtics averaging 14.1 points, 4.8 rebounds and 4.2 assists, that would make him a HOFer? I love Marcus, but no way is he a HOFer simply because he’s capable of being dominant in Europe (like so many other borderline NBA all-stars/all-defenders).

Is Marcus Smart paving the way for future generations to do what was previously unthinkable? No, because he'd be just another American basketballer lighting it up in Europe (which, frankly, I don't think he would given how hard it is to score in top Euro leagues). Kukoc was also massively important in Olympic basketball and Yugoslav basketball with Petrovic and Radja