Grant Williams: all hope lost?

[BudweiserCeltic]

I'm in the "all hope lost" camp. At this level atheletic skills matter more than work ethic and basketball IQ. He should be moving on but he's cheap and there are a lot of bench seats to fill. Better him than a Jabari Parker.

That's the problem, he's not cheap... maybe somewhat acceptable next season all told, but beyond that he's expensive weight.

1st round rookie contracts are not cheap, unless the player is actually useful and has big potential.

[Rosco917]

Grant is a typical NBA tweener.

He should have full-time residence at the very end of most NBA benches. Unfortunately the Celtics bench is so weak he's forced to be a 7th or 8th option.

This is certainly not his fault...he tries.

[Celtics4ever]

Like so many NBA players, he would be viewed differently if he had a consistent 3-point shot.  The entire league is skewed this way; I see guys who don't belong in the NBA but are here due to 3-point shooting.  If I'm Grant, I'm in the gym putting up 1000 shots a day in the off-season.

I think he can shoot, pretty decent.  I mean 37% is not bad.   

 It is the other areas of the game, rebounding, defense that he struggles in.   He is a block waiting to happen in the post.

He doesn't have a position and is not a position less player, that is his problem in the nutshell.    The versatility is not there.

[PhoSita]

Let's look around the league and try to find a player who compares favorably to Grant .... what's the blueprint for Grant finding success at this level?

The names that typically come to mind are guys like PJ Tucker or Boris Diaw.

Trouble is Grant hasn't shown himself to be a consistent (or willing) enough outside shooter, nor is he really quick enough, to be a full time perimeter player.  On the other hand, he isn't nearly as big (thick) as a guy like Diaw, which limits his ability to be a playmaker or scorer inside.

I think Grant would need to become a much better shooter, or else turn into a much nastier / more physical defender, in order to find niche in the current NBA.

[Surferdad]

Like so many NBA players, he would be viewed differently if he had a consistent 3-point shot.  The entire league is skewed this way; I see guys who don't belong in the NBA but are here due to 3-point shooting.  If I'm Grant, I'm in the gym putting up 1000 shots a day in the off-season.

I think he can shoot, pretty decent.  I mean 37% is not bad.   

 It is the other areas of the game, rebounding, defense that he struggles in.   He is a block waiting to happen in the post.

He doesn't have a position and is not a position less player, that is his problem in the nutshell.    The versatility is not there.

I don't disagree.  It's just that in today's NBA, you get a chance if you can consistently hit the 3-pointer, regardless of lack of other skills.  This is why I say the league is "skewed".

[Celtics4ever]

I think Grant would need to become a much better shooter, or else turn into a much nastier / more physical defender, in order to find niche in the current NBA.

Which is still possible, he just needs to embrace his strengths, though not likely.

[Neurotic Guy]

I think Grant would need to become a much better shooter, or else turn into a much nastier / more physical defender, in order to find niche in the current NBA.

Which is still possible, he just needs to embrace his strengths, though not likely.

I think these comments are the most logical. 

All hope is not lost if the hope is for him become a solid, consistent, contributing role player on a good team.  He's 22!   I wouldn't bet on it, but he has time to grow as a player and he's had some positive moments as a very young guy.   

[gouki88]

I'm in the "all hope lost" camp. At this level atheletic skills matter more than work ethic and basketball IQ. He should be moving on but he's cheap and there are a lot of bench seats to fill. Better him than a Jabari Parker.

That's the problem, he's not cheap... maybe somewhat acceptable next season all told, but beyond that he's expensive weight.

1st round rookie contracts are not cheap, unless the player is actually useful and has big potential.

Next season he earns $2,617,800, with only 3 guys on the roster scheduled to earn less than him. That's pretty cheap

[KG Living Legend]

 All hope was lost when we drafted the 6'5" Center/PF with a horrible vertical jump and pathetic standing vertical. 

 Grant was another reason Danny had to go.

[nickagneta]

I think way too many people hate his measurables so hate him.

He is a tough defender that hasn't learned to use his best athletic attribute yet...his strength. If he can keep a 3 point percentage over 38% and learns to push people around a bit more on defense, he will make a fine #9-#11 player on this roster.

He has a high BBIQ and is IRL very intelligent. He is a above average passer. Laterally he is quicker than given credit for. I don't see him as a finished piece at 22. If he puts in the work, he would make a good bench piece for years to come

[Big333223]

Let's look around the league and try to find a player who compares favorably to Grant .... what's the blueprint for Grant finding success at this level?

The names that typically come to mind are guys like PJ Tucker or Boris Diaw.

Trouble is Grant hasn't shown himself to be a consistent (or willing) enough outside shooter, nor is he really quick enough, to be a full time perimeter player.  On the other hand, he isn't nearly as big (thick) as a guy like Diaw, which limits his ability to be a playmaker or scorer inside.

I think Grant would need to become a much better shooter, or else turn into a much nastier / more physical defender, in order to find niche in the current NBA.

PJ Tucker is a good model for him. I also think about Leon Powe.

Both undersized but what they had that I haven't seen much from Grant was a willingness to get into the paint and move bodies around. He's hitting 3's well and he moves his feet well but he's gotta become a problem on the glass or he's not bringing enough value.

This is what was so encouraging about Jabari's minutes last year: his physicality. I have a feeling Jabari is going to be the backup 4 next season even with his defensive limitations because he's physical and can make things happen.

[Celtics2021]

Let's look around the league and try to find a player who compares favorably to Grant .... what's the blueprint for Grant finding success at this level?

The names that typically come to mind are guys like PJ Tucker or Boris Diaw.

Trouble is Grant hasn't shown himself to be a consistent (or willing) enough outside shooter, nor is he really quick enough, to be a full time perimeter player.  On the other hand, he isn't nearly as big (thick) as a guy like Diaw, which limits his ability to be a playmaker or scorer inside.

I think Grant would need to become a much better shooter, or else turn into a much nastier / more physical defender, in order to find niche in the current NBA.

PJ Tucker is a good model for him. I also think about Leon Powe.

Both undersized but what they had that I haven't seen much from Grant was a willingness to get into the paint and move bodies around. He's hitting 3's well and he moves his feet well but he's gotta become a problem on the glass or he's not bringing enough value.

This is what was so encouraging about Jabari's minutes last year: his physicality. I have a feeling Jabari is going to be the backup 4 next season even with his defensive limitations because he's physical and can make things happen.

While I agree Grant needs to work on his game near the glass, I would also note that he spent a lot more time guarding perimeter players, so when shots went up he was usually outside of the paint and not in prime rebounding position.  And on offense he floats around the 3-point line as well.  Parker occasionally guarded guys on the outside, but not very effectively, and also wound up nearer the basket on offense as well.

He needs to improve that skill, but even if he does, he’s not going to be someone who gobbles up rebounds unless Udoka asks him to fulfill a different role.

[Walker Wiggle]

Watching the Bucks tonight reminded me of how Grant was compared to PJ Tucker when he was drafted. What was Tucker at Grant’s age today? I wondered.

Tucker played his rookie year at age 21 and appeared in 17 games, scoring 11 FGs all year. He then played the next five seasons in Israel, the Ukraine, Greece, and Germany. His first season back he was 27, averaged 6.4 ppg and 4.6 rpg and shot 31% from 3.

Grant is slightly different than Tucker, but my point is not that Grant will ever become exactly the same player. My point is that it is absurd to make a conclusion on a guy’s career when he’s 22 years old.

Let these guys develop.

[Goldstar88]

I think way too many people hate his measurables so hate him.

He is a tough defender that hasn't learned to use his best only athletic attribute yet...his strength. If he can keep a 3 point percentage over 38% and learns to push people around a bit more on defense, he will make a fine #9-#11 player on this roster.

He has a high BBIQ and is IRL very intelligent. He is a above average passer. Laterally he is quicker than given credit for. I don't see him as a finished piece at 22. If he puts in the work, he would make a good bench piece for years to come

Fixed it. 

[gouki88]

Watching the Bucks tonight reminded me of how Grant was compared to PJ Tucker when he was drafted. What was Tucker at Grant’s age today? I wondered.

Tucker played his rookie year at age 21 and appeared in 17 games, scoring 11 FGs all year. He then played the next five seasons in Israel, the Ukraine, Greece, and Germany. His first season back he was 27, averaged 6.4 ppg and 4.6 rpg and shot 31% from 3.

Grant is slightly different than Tucker, but my point is not that Grant will ever become exactly the same player. My point is that it is absurd to make a conclusion on a guy’s career when he’s 22 years old.

Let these guys develop.

Bingo. In 2011 everyone would have taken Chuck Hayes over PJ Tucker, but lo and behold...