Danny Stepping Down / Brad To Lead Front Office / New Coach

[blink]

Wow, what a last few hours.  I liked both Brad and Danny in their roles.  A lot of things happened that were pretty much out of their control.  I guess all the Brad haters are feeling great about this, but I think it is a net loss for the Celtics.  We lose one of the better coaches in the NBA and 'promote' him to the FO.  We had one of the better GMs in the league and he is gone.  Now it is a complete crap shoot if Brad is able to do well in the FO role, and we lose a top 5 coach.  I know there is a lot going on behind the scenes that we might learn more about as time goes on but....on the surface and overall I say this is not a good day as a C's fan.
Hope we can pivot out of it.  I hope they get a coach that can work well with Tatum and Brown.

[kraidstar]

Tony Massarotti just said Ainge recently bought property in Utah. Interesting.

Feel bad for Ainge. He did an otherworldly job rebuilding after the KG era. But the Hayward injury really, really torpedoed the team. And he likely gets credit for at least one more title if not for the league protecting the Lakers and LeBron.

Can he get a job anywhere else? He certainly knows the job. But the SJWs are out for blood ever since Kyrie opened his yap, and he might be a target for canceling now.

Hayward was totally not Danny's fault, but Danny did trade for Irving, which in retrospect was a horrible decision, and continues to be horrible because of Kyrie's smearing of Boston.

What was weird about that trade is early on in his tenure there were stories about how he had a brain doctor on staff who looked at personalities and how players were mentally "built" and worked hard to combine the right kind of players with certain characteristics. 

Whether this brain doctor was still on staff at the time of the trade is beyond the point but needless to say Ainge was into that kind of analysis.  How he decided that Kyrie was a good fit here is really odd.

My guess?  He assumed that there was little risk, because it was extremely unlikely that Kyrie would walk in his first two years.  Worst realistic scenario, we sign him to a five year deal and trade him at some point thereafter.

Oops.

I think Ainge was expecting that Kyrie would enjoy being "the man" on his own team, and then would recruit other players to come join him.  He was banking on the cache that Kyrie had with other players around the league. 


Unfortunately, Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability to recruit others and wrong about Kyrie wanting to do it in Boston.

Agree with part 1. Disagree with part 2. There was an unwritten agreement that Ainge reneged on.

Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability (and desire) to recruit other vets. Kyrie was wrong about Ainge's willingness to follow through. When Kyrie realized Ainge wasn't trading youth for his vet buddies he bolted to a team who would.

I could see this happening. I still think something happened behind the scenes that we don't know about. This was the scenario I have pictured, where Danny promised Kyrie he would have input on team building, but when Kyrie approached him with ideas, Danny wouldn't listen. Maybe Danny had an attitude of I'll pick the players, and you dribble, which could be why Kyrie has such a hatred toward the team.

We literally couldn't trade for Davis until the offseason that Kyrie left. Who else would we have traded for exactly? Davis was always the plan. If Kyrie doesn't lose his mind maybe AD agrees to come here.

But Kyrie had his own agenda and went back on his word. He REALLY screwed us over.

[Roy H.]

Tony Massarotti just said Ainge recently bought property in Utah. Interesting.

Feel bad for Ainge. He did an otherworldly job rebuilding after the KG era. But the Hayward injury really, really torpedoed the team. And he likely gets credit for at least one more title if not for the league protecting the Lakers and LeBron.

Can he get a job anywhere else? He certainly knows the job. But the SJWs are out for blood ever since Kyrie opened his yap, and he might be a target for canceling now.

Hayward was totally not Danny's fault, but Danny did trade for Irving, which in retrospect was a horrible decision, and continues to be horrible because of Kyrie's smearing of Boston.

What was weird about that trade is early on in his tenure there were stories about how he had a brain doctor on staff who looked at personalities and how players were mentally "built" and worked hard to combine the right kind of players with certain characteristics. 

Whether this brain doctor was still on staff at the time of the trade is beyond the point but needless to say Ainge was into that kind of analysis.  How he decided that Kyrie was a good fit here is really odd.

My guess?  He assumed that there was little risk, because it was extremely unlikely that Kyrie would walk in his first two years.  Worst realistic scenario, we sign him to a five year deal and trade him at some point thereafter.

Oops.

I think Ainge was expecting that Kyrie would enjoy being "the man" on his own team, and then would recruit other players to come join him.  He was banking on the cache that Kyrie had with other players around the league. 


Unfortunately, Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability to recruit others and wrong about Kyrie wanting to do it in Boston.

Agree with part 1. Disagree with part 2. There was an unwritten agreement that Ainge reneged on.

Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability (and desire) to recruit other vets. Kyrie was wrong about Ainge's willingness to follow through. When Kyrie realized Ainge wasn't trading youth for his vet buddies he bolted to a team who would.

That seems a bit revisionist.  Danny was actively trying to land Anthony Davis to put alongside three other max players.

[PhoSita]

You know in some ways it's validating to see that the coach and the GM found the last few years as exhausting and frustrating as the fan base has.

[kraidstar]

Wow, what a last few hours.  I liked both Brad and Danny in their roles.  A lot of things happened that were pretty much out of their control.  I guess all the Brad haters are feeling great about this, but I think it is a net loss for the Celtics.  We lose one of the better coaches in the NBA and 'promote' him to the FO.  We had one of the better GMs in the league and he is gone.  Now it is a complete crap shoot if Brad is able to do well in the FO role, and we lose a top 5 coach.  I know there is a lot going on behind the scenes that we might learn more about as time goes on but....on the surface and overall I say this is not a good day as a C's fan.
Hope we can pivot out of it.  I hope they get a coach that can work well with Tatum and Brown.

Brad was clearly burnt out, maybe Ainge too.

A lot of that was due to unfortunate events/injuries that led us to this point.

Feel really bad they have had to manage these lazy, listless players though. The effort was terrible this year. they looked like they were hung over half the time. I still can't believe the players didn't stand up for themselves at all when Kyrie was disrespecting the city and the organization. What a bunch of coddled beta-males .The way they slobbered over Kyrie after game 5 was disgusting. We need a coach who will bring a massive attitude adjustment.

Otherwise I won't be supporting this team anymore.

[86MaxwellSmart]

Really classy way to fire both guys....Seriously, The team needs a new voice, I remember even Doc saying this when he left.

Maybe that's why they brought in Evan Turner, if this was a long term plan.

[Yuckabuck33]

Where does this idea come from that Danny was this cutthroat negotiator and Brad can't do it? By all accounts, Ainge was not a dirty negotiator but just very firm about what he was willing to do and some GMs thought he was inflexible. The Nets trades and the Tatum pick were shrewd but not nasty or cutthroat.

[Rondo9]

You know in some ways it's validating to see that the coach and the GM found the last few years as exhausting and frustrating as the fan base has.

Well COVID compounded some things.......

[gift]

Tony Massarotti just said Ainge recently bought property in Utah. Interesting.

Feel bad for Ainge. He did an otherworldly job rebuilding after the KG era. But the Hayward injury really, really torpedoed the team. And he likely gets credit for at least one more title if not for the league protecting the Lakers and LeBron.

Can he get a job anywhere else? He certainly knows the job. But the SJWs are out for blood ever since Kyrie opened his yap, and he might be a target for canceling now.

Hayward was totally not Danny's fault, but Danny did trade for Irving, which in retrospect was a horrible decision, and continues to be horrible because of Kyrie's smearing of Boston.

What was weird about that trade is early on in his tenure there were stories about how he had a brain doctor on staff who looked at personalities and how players were mentally "built" and worked hard to combine the right kind of players with certain characteristics. 

Whether this brain doctor was still on staff at the time of the trade is beyond the point but needless to say Ainge was into that kind of analysis.  How he decided that Kyrie was a good fit here is really odd.

My guess?  He assumed that there was little risk, because it was extremely unlikely that Kyrie would walk in his first two years.  Worst realistic scenario, we sign him to a five year deal and trade him at some point thereafter.

Oops.

I think Ainge was expecting that Kyrie would enjoy being "the man" on his own team, and then would recruit other players to come join him.  He was banking on the cache that Kyrie had with other players around the league. 


Unfortunately, Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability to recruit others and wrong about Kyrie wanting to do it in Boston.

Agree with part 1. Disagree with part 2. There was an unwritten agreement that Ainge reneged on.

Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability (and desire) to recruit other vets. Kyrie was wrong about Ainge's willingness to follow through. When Kyrie realized Ainge wasn't trading youth for his vet buddies he bolted to a team who would.

I could see this happening. I still think something happened behind the scenes that we don't know about. This was the scenario I have pictured, where Danny promised Kyrie he would have input on team building, but when Kyrie approached him with ideas, Danny wouldn't listen. Maybe Danny had an attitude of I'll pick the players, and you dribble, which could be why Kyrie has such a hatred toward the team.

I just think Kyrie was going wherever his buddy was going. He folded under the pressure of Boston and went somewhere he could be more “happy”

I think Kyrie loves freedom and hates accountability. He saw an opportunity to escape accountability in Boston and go somewhere where he was more personally 'empowered' and could take off a week or two for his birthday or his dad's or sister's birthdays or whatever he needed.

[Ogaju]

Really classy way to fire both guys....Seriously, The team needs a new voice, I remember even Doc saying this when he left.

Maybe that's why they brought in Evan Turner, if this was a long term plan.

Evan Turner?....You want to see a riot?

[liam]

"Before hiring Stevens, league sources say Celtics ownership considered other internal candidates and even pondered pursuing Sam Presti, a native of Massachusetts who has run the Thunder since they were still the Sonics. Presti is a proven front-office boss who steered a small-market team to great success through savvy acquisitions and wise draft picks. Stevens has no front-office experience, and has only been in the NBA since 2013, when the Celtics plucked him out of Butler."


This would've been a good choice:

[hwangjini_1]

I can't see Choir Boy Brad being cut-throat and becoming a manipulating schemer like Danny had to dealing with other Teams or Players, he'll be soft there too. To me, it's all about Wic's Benjamin's why he's staying. He should be gone too. As I said before, Brad needs to go back to College where he has some influence. The Duke job does makes sense though. He should take a long Vacation till Duke comes a calling. IMO

Wyc has consistently shown that he willing to pay money when he thinks it benefits the team.

next, please provide the source of your statement, or it is little more than speculation and a hot take.

third, just how much money do you think Wyc "saves" by doing this? give us all the numbers please.

fourth, the-person-formally-known-as-CBS has long stated he HATED recruiting as a college coach. why would he step down in position to take on a duty he does not like? from the day of his hiring, people on this board have stated without support how Stevens is about to jump off the nba ship and return to college ball.

[Mahk E Mahk]

apologies in advance for the long post; hopefully some will find the perspective an interesting pov.

i watched the presser in its entirety, and came away with a completely different opinion of what transpired than what i initially thought.

background: i had the privilege of working in a c-level role with two different fortune 500 companies in my career and i’ve seen this type of organizational change up close several times. my $0.02, the change the c’s just announced was the result of an internal power play, which was won by brad. i’ve seen this play out many times and it usually takes one of two paths: 1) the ugly, ego-driven firefight that is tough to hide internally and externally, and 2) the professional, respectful, but material difference in vision that ends up with one person “winning” and the other agreeing to “retire.”

from what i witnessed, the c’s went through the latter. danny and brad’s awkward body language at the presser, brad’s quick promotion without ownership even considering a search, danny claiming health reasons and a desire to spend time with family (old standards for exiting execs) combined with his non-answer regarding future jobs all point to a decision forced on ownership to pick one of two diverging points of view and philosophies. like i said, i’ve seen this before and it goes down in similar fashion almost every time.

furthermore, the praise danny and brad heaped on each other during the presser was very awkward and came across as two guys who are both pros and will say the appropriate things at the right moment. it wasn’t completely genuine and was a bit forced. for a guy who allegedly made his own decision to retire to spend more time with family, danny didn’t seem very happy at the presser. this was a gentlemanly separation at the request of ownership. “here’s your exit package, danny, which is contingent on you playing the company guy bit on your way out.” danny gets a nice cash reward and the ability to spin it as his decision; the c’s get a fluid transition and little-to-no bad PR.

also, i’ve worked directly with guys like brad who seem to be very low key and demure but are surprisingly very savvy politically. it makes sense we heard rumors and read articles earlier in the season that brad would assume a greater role in personnel going forward. he was not happy with danny’s rosters and made it clear to wyc that he needed more control. as the team struggled to perform, ownership was forced to become more involved in these diverging philosophies and ultimately pick a side. what was announced today was the culmination of this battle being won by brad, which makes sense. ownership was forced to pick a horse for the long term and brad came out on top. i think the “aw shucks” indiana country boy schtick purposefully hides a very driven, savvy, ambitious personality. he didn’t get to where he is by chance. honestly, this viewpoint makes me even more confident in his ability to run basketball operations for the c’s.

like i said, simply my opinion based on what i’ve witnessed firsthand. granted, i could be completely wrong but all the signs do seem to point to a professional power play that didn’t go danny’s way.

[Ogaju]

Tony Massarotti just said Ainge recently bought property in Utah. Interesting.

Feel bad for Ainge. He did an otherworldly job rebuilding after the KG era. But the Hayward injury really, really torpedoed the team. And he likely gets credit for at least one more title if not for the league protecting the Lakers and LeBron.

Can he get a job anywhere else? He certainly knows the job. But the SJWs are out for blood ever since Kyrie opened his yap, and he might be a target for canceling now.

Hayward was totally not Danny's fault, but Danny did trade for Irving, which in retrospect was a horrible decision, and continues to be horrible because of Kyrie's smearing of Boston.

What was weird about that trade is early on in his tenure there were stories about how he had a brain doctor on staff who looked at personalities and how players were mentally "built" and worked hard to combine the right kind of players with certain characteristics. 

Whether this brain doctor was still on staff at the time of the trade is beyond the point but needless to say Ainge was into that kind of analysis.  How he decided that Kyrie was a good fit here is really odd.

My guess?  He assumed that there was little risk, because it was extremely unlikely that Kyrie would walk in his first two years.  Worst realistic scenario, we sign him to a five year deal and trade him at some point thereafter.

Oops.

I think Ainge was expecting that Kyrie would enjoy being "the man" on his own team, and then would recruit other players to come join him.  He was banking on the cache that Kyrie had with other players around the league. 


Unfortunately, Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability to recruit others and wrong about Kyrie wanting to do it in Boston.

Agree with part 1. Disagree with part 2. There was an unwritten agreement that Ainge reneged on.

Ainge was right about Kyrie's ability (and desire) to recruit other vets. Kyrie was wrong about Ainge's willingness to follow through. When Kyrie realized Ainge wasn't trading youth for his vet buddies he bolted to a team who would.

This is a very interesting take.

[PhoSita]

apologies in advance for the long post; hopefully some will find the perspective an interesting pov.

i watched the presser in its entirety, and came away with a completely different opinion of what transpired than what i initially thought.

background: i had the privilege of working in a c-level role with two different fortune 500 companies in my career and i’ve seen this type of organizational change up close several times. my $0.02, the change the c’s just announced was the result of an internal power play, which was won by brad. i’ve seen this play out many times and it usually takes one of two paths: 1) the ugly, ego-driven firefight that is tough to hide internally and externally, and 2) the professional, respectful, but material difference in vision that ends up with one person “winning” and the other agreeing to “retire.”

from what i witnessed, the c’s went through the latter. danny and brad’s awkward body language at the presser, brad’s quick promotion without ownership even considering a search, danny claiming health reasons and a desire to spend time with family (old standards for exiting execs) combined with his non-answer regarding future jobs all point to a decision forced on ownership to pick one of two diverging points of view and philosophies. like i said, i’ve seen this before and it goes down in similar fashion almost every time.

furthermore, the praise danny and brad heaped on each other during the presser was very awkward and came across as two guys who are both pros and will say the appropriate things at the right moment. it wasn’t completely genuine and was a bit forced. for a guy who allegedly made his own decision to retire to spend more time with family, danny didn’t seem very happy at the presser. this was a gentlemanly separation at the request of ownership. “here’s your exit package, danny, which is contingent on you playing the company guy bit on your way out.” danny gets a nice cash reward and the ability to spin it as his decision; the c’s get a fluid transition and little-to-no bad PR.

also, i’ve worked directly with guys like brad who seem to be very low key and demure but are surprisingly very savvy politically. it makes sense we heard rumors and read articles earlier in the season that brad would assume a greater role in personnel going forward. he was not happy with danny’s rosters and made it clear to wyc that he needed more control. as the team struggled to perform, ownership was forced to become more involved in these diverging philosophies and ultimately pick a side. what was announced today was the culmination of this battle being won by brad, which makes sense. ownership was forced to pick a horse for the long term and brad came out on top. i think the “aw shucks” indiana country boy schtick purposefully hides a very driven, savvy, ambitious personality. he didn’t get to where he is by chance. honestly, this viewpoint makes me even more confident in his ability to run basketball operations for the c’s.

like i said, simply my opinion based on what i’ve witnessed firsthand. granted, i could be completely wrong but all the signs do seem to point to a professional power play that didn’t go danny’s way.

appreciate this perspective, tp.

from the "Brad as Machiavelli" angle, the story mid-season about Indiana going hard after Brad could be seen as something Brad and his camp allowed to become a bit of a story in order to put pressure on ownership.