Author Topic: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here  (Read 9627 times)

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Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #30 on: March 24, 2021, 03:01:52 AM »

Offline Muzzy66

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Reports that come out 2 or 3 days before the deadline are being leaked by some team. It's safe to assume the leaks happen because they're perceived as being beneficial to that particular team. Clearly, floating Smart's name out there doesn't benefit Boston at this point. So it stands to reason that these other teams are using Smart's name as leverage in trade negotiations.

That is just generic speculation, and you could use that exact same speculation in response to ANY trade rumour ever made.  I'm not sure how it does anything to reduce the likelihood of Smart being included in this deal.   

It's not unreasonable at all to think Smart would only be traded when part of a package for an All-Star caliber player.

Why is that not unreasonable? 

Marcus Smart has one elite level skill and that's defense.  He has a second above-average skill and that's play-making.  He has some added intangibles because of his personality / passion.  But beyond those factors he's average or below-average at absolutely everything.  He's not a good ball handler, he's not a great rebounder, he's a mediocre finisher, he's a historically bad shooter, and he brings a high-risk / high-reward play style that loses the team as many games as it wins them.

You really think that Danny wouldn't trade the player I just described unless it's in return for an All-Star?  Why, because he has "heart"?  Do you not recall this is the same Danny who traded Pierce and Garnett to Brooklyn?  Avery Bradley to Detroit?  Rajon Rondo to Dallas?  The same Danny Ainge who traded Isaiah Thomas to Cleveland after he made some of the biggest sacrifices humanly possible for the Celtics just prior?

If there is one thing we should know VERY well by now it's that when it comes to trades Danny Ainge is a businessman above all.  If he thinks giving up Smart will make the team significantly better, then he'll trade him. Every. Single. Time.

How many of those do you really trust?   I am just saying, do you think that Waters and Edwards could step up and suddenly become solid NBA rotation players?

I trust Kemba as my starter, I trust Pritchard (already) as a backup, and I'm OK with Teague as a desperation 3rd string backup.  That's good enough for me.


Do folks really think Smart is the problem?

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/celtics-record-without-grant-williams-2021  6-2

I think it is the mediocre bench players more than Smart.   Using Grant as an example.

https://www.statmuse.com/nba/ask/celtics-record-without-marcus-smart-2021  10-9

Trouble is Smart is one of the few that we feel is expendable  that has some value.   You could not get a bag of beans for some of our other guys off the bench.

I don't think Smart is the problem, no.  But I do think he contributes to it at times. 

More importantly though, I think the team desperately needs to add more scoring and depth, and I think that (as you said) out of all the guys on the roster who have some semblance of value Smart is the most expendable. 

* We cannot afford to lose a key scorer (unless we bring back a better one) so Kemba is a no-go
* Tatum and Brown are too critical to the team both now and in the future
* Robert Williams and Pritchard are productive, have upside, and are on bargain contracts so they make no sense to trade
* I don't like the idea of moving TT because I don't like giving up the frontcourt depth (Theis is too inconsistent and Williams still needs time)

Hence it kinda comes down to Smart. 

If the Celtic's issues could be fixed to a large degree WITHOUT giving up Smart then I would be all for it. But I don't see any scenario on the horizon right now in which that happens...so I think sending Smart out pretty much a necessity if Danny is going to even begin to fix these issues. 

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #31 on: March 24, 2021, 07:03:28 AM »

Offline Kernewek

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Reports that come out 2 or 3 days before the deadline are being leaked by some team. It's safe to assume the leaks happen because they're perceived as being beneficial to that particular team. Clearly, floating Smart's name out there doesn't benefit Boston at this point. So it stands to reason that these other teams are using Smart's name as leverage in trade negotiations.

That is just generic speculation, and you could use that exact same speculation in response to ANY trade rumour ever made.  I'm not sure how it does anything to reduce the likelihood of Smart being included in this deal.   
It's not so much generic speculation as it is having a grasp on how the game is played. I'd say Jiri might be incorrect on his assessment of the benefits however -- reporters floating that Marcus Smart is desirable certainly benefits the Celtics as a lever to drive up the asking price.

You say Ainge isn't sentimental, which is true, but more than that he's also a guy who wants to get maximum value out of every trade. Ainge won't trade Smart unless he sees the C's winning the trade, so I would be entirely unsurprised to see Smart on the roster after the trade deadline.

"...unceasingly we are bombarded with pseudo-realities manufactured by very sophisticated people using very sophisticated electronic mechanisms. I do not distrust their motives; I distrust their power. They have a lot of it."

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #32 on: March 24, 2021, 07:23:43 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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More importantly though, I think the team desperately needs to add more scoring and depth, and I think that (as you said) out of all the guys on the roster who have some semblance of value Smart is the most expendable.

* We cannot afford to lose a key scorer (unless we bring back a better one) so Kemba is a no-go
* Tatum and Brown are too critical to the team both now and in the future
* Robert Williams and Pritchard are productive, have upside, and are on bargain contracts so they make no sense to trade
* I don't like the idea of moving TT because I don't like giving up the frontcourt depth (Theis is too inconsistent and Williams still needs time)

Hence it kinda comes down to Smart. 

Smart then is not the problem but the solution if you trade him.

I agree with most of your points.    I would rather part with Kemba myself as I think Smart is important to our identity but no one wants gimpy knees

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #33 on: March 25, 2021, 07:42:31 AM »

Offline TheReaLPuba

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Losing more key defensive players is not going to help this team.

This team has all the offense it could ever need.

Defense is sorely lacking.

As well as leadership.

When the going gets bad there's no one the team can turn to just to keep them together.

They just end up playing individual basketball way too much.

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #34 on: March 25, 2021, 07:54:22 AM »

Offline boscel33

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I was never a fan of Smart.  Probably because I wanted either Gordon or Randle that year and we took Smart with Randle going with the next pick.  I'm just not a fan of his game and part of that is his shot selection, but another big part is his flopping.  The NBA is fast becoming Italian Soccer and he's a big part of it.
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Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #35 on: March 25, 2021, 08:11:08 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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Mark Murphy: Maybe the biggest winner here is Marcus Smart. According to a source, Ainge had assured his guard that he wasn’t being offered around – that his name was being brought up strictly by interested teams.
15 mins ago – via Twitter Murf56


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Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #36 on: March 25, 2021, 08:29:41 PM »

Offline Celtics2021

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Disagree, and he's not getting traded for Evan Fournier (expiring) or Aaron Gordon.

He's a playoff experienced, 2x 1st All Defense, 27yo leader, who defends multiple positions.

He hasn't long been back from missing significant time, and the team hasn't had much consistency with player availability.

If anyone is getting traded it's Theis/Thompson.

I bet you a TP hat you're wrong, and that if the trade does happen it's Smart that goes out.

Ooh, can I get in on this TP bet?  Smart is not getting traded in an Aaron Gordon, Evan Fournier deal.

Can I get a TP?

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #37 on: March 25, 2021, 08:35:50 PM »

Offline Goldstar88

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Mark Murphy: Maybe the biggest winner here is Marcus Smart. According to a source, Ainge had assured his guard that he wasn’t being offered around – that his name was being brought up strictly by interested teams.
15 mins ago – via Twitter Murf56


Danny and Brad love Smart. He’s here for the long haul.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #38 on: March 25, 2021, 08:42:13 PM »

Offline gouki88

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Mark Murphy: Maybe the biggest winner here is Marcus Smart. According to a source, Ainge had assured his guard that he wasn’t being offered around – that his name was being brought up strictly by interested teams.
15 mins ago – via Twitter Murf56
Makes sense, DA seems to love him. Hopefully his name appearing in rumours is why he was playing like garbage
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Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #39 on: March 26, 2021, 04:18:40 AM »

Offline DocomoCelts

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It would be some irony if Smart eventually left for a better deal elsewhere and left Danny with nothing.

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #40 on: March 26, 2021, 07:41:22 AM »

Offline PAOBoston

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Mark Murphy: Maybe the biggest winner here is Marcus Smart. According to a source, Ainge had assured his guard that he wasn’t being offered around – that his name was being brought up strictly by interested teams.
15 mins ago – via Twitter Murf56


Danny and Brad love Smart. He’s here for the long haul.
Can’t wait until the Cs give him $20 mil per in his next contract to show his true worth to the franchise.

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #41 on: March 26, 2021, 07:47:01 AM »

Offline NKY fan

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Mark Murphy: Maybe the biggest winner here is Marcus Smart. According to a source, Ainge had assured his guard that he wasn’t being offered around – that his name was being brought up strictly by interested teams.
15 mins ago – via Twitter Murf56


Danny and Brad love Smart. He’s here for the long haul.
Can’t wait until the Cs give him $20 mil per in his next contract to show his true worth to the franchise.
Yea treat Smart as a one year rental next season. It’s like paying 2 second rounders for Fournier .

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #42 on: March 26, 2021, 07:50:17 AM »

Offline NKY fan

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It would be some irony if Smart eventually left for a better deal elsewhere and left Danny with nothing.
This is the irony of how nba works and why franchises like the Celtics that always do the right thing to do given cap constraints will never win anything. Yes there will be constantly GMs that overpay and eventually screw up their own franchise but that doesn’t bring the Celtics any closer to a title given that a new super team or two form each year

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #43 on: March 26, 2021, 08:30:53 AM »

Offline Goldstar88

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Mark Murphy: Maybe the biggest winner here is Marcus Smart. According to a source, Ainge had assured his guard that he wasn’t being offered around – that his name was being brought up strictly by interested teams.
15 mins ago – via Twitter Murf56


Danny and Brad love Smart. He’s here for the long haul.
Can’t wait until the Cs give him $20 mil per in his next contract to show his true worth to the franchise.

Unless he goes crazy next year and averages 15ppg, 6apg, 5reb while shooting 38% from 3pt, no one is paying him $20m per season.
Quoting Nick from the now locked Ime thread:
Quote
At some point you have to blame the performance on the court on the players on the court. Every loss is not the coach's fault and every win isn't because of the players.

Re: It Sure Feels Like Smart Is Done Here
« Reply #44 on: March 26, 2021, 08:32:31 AM »

Offline PAOBoston

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Mark Murphy: Maybe the biggest winner here is Marcus Smart. According to a source, Ainge had assured his guard that he wasn’t being offered around – that his name was being brought up strictly by interested teams.
15 mins ago – via Twitter Murf56


Danny and Brad love Smart. He’s here for the long haul.
Can’t wait until the Cs give him $20 mil per in his next contract to show his true worth to the franchise.

Unless he goes crazy next year and averages 15ppg, 6apg, 5reb while shooting 38% from 3pt, no one is paying him $20m per season.
To me, Smart is barely worth $10 mil per. But the Cs will overpay to keep him. They are obsessed with him.