Fair Marcus Smart discussion

[td450]

Said this in another thread today but...

Teague has left. Fournier is being added and will play significantly more, and Langford is going to play a few minutes. That forces a significant net need for minutes at the guard spot. Marcus's minutes are going to start going down. His role is going to shrink. That's before Langford is given a full rotation spot, looking more at Nesmith, before expanding Pritchard's role.

If we ever get a real power forward, things get much worse as Jaylen starts to take more guard minutes. If this roster starts to solidify, he's going to be an angry dude.

[nickagneta]

Here is my fair Smart discussion.

I wasn't a Smart fan for many years. I thought his defense fantastic but he gave it all back on offense being a bad shooter and scorer. And not just bad, like historically bad given the minutes played and shots taken. His first 4 years he had shooting splits of about 36/29/75 with a TS% of 48% on 9 shots a game.

I also hated his immaturity and just dumb emotional off court stuff that caused him to miss games and threw the team into turmoil.

Then the 2018-19 season happened and I started coming around to liking Smart because, even though he still made offensive decisions that were bad, he at least became serviceable on that end. And, he had his best defensive year.

Then last year, I think he plateaued. He took some minor step backs in shooting and defense(he was still he league's best defensive guard though) but his really bad offensive decision making returned with a vengeance. He decided he was a way better passer than he is and his passing got way too cute, causing unnecessary turnovers or bad offensive possessions. And, he thought he was a much better shooter than he is and decided to increase the number of shots taken a game. Mostly bad shots

This year, that trend has continued and he has taken another step backwards on both ends of the court. Defensively, he clearly takes stretches of the game off and isn't fully engaged. His shot decision making and actual efficiency appear to be returning to pre 2018-19 levels, while he is still taking almost 11 shots per game. His passing is still too cute and though his turnover rate is low, it could be lower if he didn't have one turnover per game due to just trying to be a flashy passer.

I am afraid Smart probably peaked. I am not a fan of his this year at all. I don't think he has the ability to reign in his terrible offensive decision making. And to be clear, I don't think this is a Brad problem. I don't think any coach could reel him in. And his defense has notably slipped.

I don't want Smart to be in Boston long term. Ainge should trade him this off-season or next trade deadline and get something for him because I think re-signing him at a number Smart would want would be a terrible decision, both on the court and on the financial end of things.

Last night's performance was quintessential Marcus Smart. Some great defense, boneheaded decisions, some clutch plays, awful shooting and emotional outbursts that hurt the team. I mean, when he started to bark at Kemba for calling him out for possibly the stupidest basketball play in years and it visibly angered Kemba, well, that's embarrassing. You really have to have done something wrong to p!ss off Kemba. The guy is a walking beacon of  positivity.

Sorry, Marcus, I think your welcome here in Boston has been worn out. You need to go while the team can still get some value from trading you.

[liam]

Here is my fair Smart discussion.

I wasn't a Smart fan for many years. I thought his defense fantastic but he gave it all back on offense being a bad shooter and scorer. And not just bad, like historically bad given the minutes played and shots taken. His first 4 years he had shooting splits of about 36/29/75 with a TS% of 48% on 9 shots a game.

I also hated his immaturity and just dumb emotional off court stuff that caused him to miss games and threw the team into turmoil.

Then the 2018-19 season happened and I started coming around to liking Smart because, even though he still made offensive decisions that were bad, he at least became serviceable on that end. And, he had his best defensive year.

Then last year, I think he plateaued. He took some minor step backs in shooting and defense(he was still he league's best defensive guard though) but his really bad offensive decision making returned with a vengeance. He decided he was a way better passer than he is and his passing got way too cute, causing unnecessary turnovers or bad offensive possessions. And, he thought he was a much better shooter than he is and decided to increase the number of shots taken a game. Mostly bad shots

This year, that trend has continued and he has taken another step backwards on both ends of the court. Defensively, he clearly takes stretches of the game off and isn't fully engaged. His shot decision making and actual efficiency appear to be returning to pre 2018-19 levels, while he is still taking almost 11 shots per game. His passing is still too cute and though his turnover rate is low, it could be lower if he didn't have one turnover per game due to just trying to be a flashy passer.

I am afraid Smart probably peaked. I am not a fan of his this year at all. I don't think he has the ability to reign in his terrible offensive decision making. And to be clear, I don't think this is a Brad problem. I don't think any coach could reel him in. And his defense has notably slipped.

I don't want Smart to be in Boston long term. Ainge should trade him this off-season or next trade deadline and get something for him because I think re-signing him at a number Smart would want would be a terrible decision, both on the court and on the financial end of things.

Last night's performance was quintessential Marcus Smart. Some great defense, boneheaded decisions, some clutch plays, awful shooting and emotional outbursts that hurt the team. I mean, when he started to bark at Kemba for calling him out for possibly the stupidest basketball play in years and it visibly angered Kemba, well, that's embarrassing. You really have to have done something wrong to p!ss off Kemba. The guy is a walking beacon of  positivity.

Sorry, Marcus, I think your welcome here in Boston has been worn out. You need to go while the team can still get some value from trading you.

I agree with everything you said but would add that the one thing Brad can control is Smart's minutes.

[nickagneta]

Here is my fair Smart discussion.

I wasn't a Smart fan for many years. I thought his defense fantastic but he gave it all back on offense being a bad shooter and scorer. And not just bad, like historically bad given the minutes played and shots taken. His first 4 years he had shooting splits of about 36/29/75 with a TS% of 48% on 9 shots a game.

I also hated his immaturity and just dumb emotional off court stuff that caused him to miss games and threw the team into turmoil.

Then the 2018-19 season happened and I started coming around to liking Smart because, even though he still made offensive decisions that were bad, he at least became serviceable on that end. And, he had his best defensive year.

Then last year, I think he plateaued. He took some minor step backs in shooting and defense(he was still he league's best defensive guard though) but his really bad offensive decision making returned with a vengeance. He decided he was a way better passer than he is and his passing got way too cute, causing unnecessary turnovers or bad offensive possessions. And, he thought he was a much better shooter than he is and decided to increase the number of shots taken a game. Mostly bad shots

This year, that trend has continued and he has taken another step backwards on both ends of the court. Defensively, he clearly takes stretches of the game off and isn't fully engaged. His shot decision making and actual efficiency appear to be returning to pre 2018-19 levels, while he is still taking almost 11 shots per game. His passing is still too cute and though his turnover rate is low, it could be lower if he didn't have one turnover per game due to just trying to be a flashy passer.

I am afraid Smart probably peaked. I am not a fan of his this year at all. I don't think he has the ability to reign in his terrible offensive decision making. And to be clear, I don't think this is a Brad problem. I don't think any coach could reel him in. And his defense has notably slipped.

I don't want Smart to be in Boston long term. Ainge should trade him this off-season or next trade deadline and get something for him because I think re-signing him at a number Smart would want would be a terrible decision, both on the court and on the financial end of things.

Last night's performance was quintessential Marcus Smart. Some great defense, boneheaded decisions, some clutch plays, awful shooting and emotional outbursts that hurt the team. I mean, when he started to bark at Kemba for calling him out for possibly the stupidest basketball play in years and it visibly angered Kemba, well, that's embarrassing. You really have to have done something wrong to p!ss off Kemba. The guy is a walking beacon of  positivity.

Sorry, Marcus, I think your welcome here in Boston has been worn out. You need to go while the team can still get some value from trading you.

I agree with everything you said but would add that the one thing Brad can control is Smart's minutes.

True. But I think almost every coach out there would be too enticed by his defensive presence and would put up with what he does offensively. He is an amazing defensive player and quarterback. One of the best in the league.

I just don't think any coach would limit his minutes because of his offense. And I don't see Smart changing. He is hard headed and  is what he is at this point.

My guess is other coaches would try to put him out there with their best ball handlers and playmakers to limit his touches. Like I bet either LA team, the Nets, Dallas, Atlanta, Golden State and teams like that would love to have Smart and play him major minutes alongside their best playmakers. That would mitigate the situation some, I think.

[liam]

Here is my fair Smart discussion.

I wasn't a Smart fan for many years. I thought his defense fantastic but he gave it all back on offense being a bad shooter and scorer. And not just bad, like historically bad given the minutes played and shots taken. His first 4 years he had shooting splits of about 36/29/75 with a TS% of 48% on 9 shots a game.

I also hated his immaturity and just dumb emotional off court stuff that caused him to miss games and threw the team into turmoil.

Then the 2018-19 season happened and I started coming around to liking Smart because, even though he still made offensive decisions that were bad, he at least became serviceable on that end. And, he had his best defensive year.

Then last year, I think he plateaued. He took some minor step backs in shooting and defense(he was still he league's best defensive guard though) but his really bad offensive decision making returned with a vengeance. He decided he was a way better passer than he is and his passing got way too cute, causing unnecessary turnovers or bad offensive possessions. And, he thought he was a much better shooter than he is and decided to increase the number of shots taken a game. Mostly bad shots

This year, that trend has continued and he has taken another step backwards on both ends of the court. Defensively, he clearly takes stretches of the game off and isn't fully engaged. His shot decision making and actual efficiency appear to be returning to pre 2018-19 levels, while he is still taking almost 11 shots per game. His passing is still too cute and though his turnover rate is low, it could be lower if he didn't have one turnover per game due to just trying to be a flashy passer.

I am afraid Smart probably peaked. I am not a fan of his this year at all. I don't think he has the ability to reign in his terrible offensive decision making. And to be clear, I don't think this is a Brad problem. I don't think any coach could reel him in. And his defense has notably slipped.

I don't want Smart to be in Boston long term. Ainge should trade him this off-season or next trade deadline and get something for him because I think re-signing him at a number Smart would want would be a terrible decision, both on the court and on the financial end of things.

Last night's performance was quintessential Marcus Smart. Some great defense, boneheaded decisions, some clutch plays, awful shooting and emotional outbursts that hurt the team. I mean, when he started to bark at Kemba for calling him out for possibly the stupidest basketball play in years and it visibly angered Kemba, well, that's embarrassing. You really have to have done something wrong to p!ss off Kemba. The guy is a walking beacon of  positivity.

Sorry, Marcus, I think your welcome here in Boston has been worn out. You need to go while the team can still get some value from trading you.

I agree with everything you said but would add that the one thing Brad can control is Smart's minutes.

True. But I think almost every coach out there would be too enticed by his defensive presence and would put up with what he does offensively. He is an amazing defensive player and quarterback. One of the best in the league.

I just don't think any coach would limit his minutes because of his offense. And I don't see Smart changing. He is hard headed and  is what he is at this point.

My guess is other coaches would try to put him out there with their best ball handlers and playmakers to limit his touches. Like I bet either LA team, the Nets, Dallas, Atlanta, Golden State and teams like that would love to have Smart and play him major minutes alongside their best playmakers. That would mitigate the situation some, I think.

You're right. OKC gives Dort a free hand and he's a worse offensive player than Smart.

[gouki88]

Here is my fair Smart discussion.

I wasn't a Smart fan for many years. I thought his defense fantastic but he gave it all back on offense being a bad shooter and scorer. And not just bad, like historically bad given the minutes played and shots taken. His first 4 years he had shooting splits of about 36/29/75 with a TS% of 48% on 9 shots a game.

I also hated his immaturity and just dumb emotional off court stuff that caused him to miss games and threw the team into turmoil.

Then the 2018-19 season happened and I started coming around to liking Smart because, even though he still made offensive decisions that were bad, he at least became serviceable on that end. And, he had his best defensive year.

Then last year, I think he plateaued. He took some minor step backs in shooting and defense(he was still he league's best defensive guard though) but his really bad offensive decision making returned with a vengeance. He decided he was a way better passer than he is and his passing got way too cute, causing unnecessary turnovers or bad offensive possessions. And, he thought he was a much better shooter than he is and decided to increase the number of shots taken a game. Mostly bad shots

This year, that trend has continued and he has taken another step backwards on both ends of the court. Defensively, he clearly takes stretches of the game off and isn't fully engaged. His shot decision making and actual efficiency appear to be returning to pre 2018-19 levels, while he is still taking almost 11 shots per game. His passing is still too cute and though his turnover rate is low, it could be lower if he didn't have one turnover per game due to just trying to be a flashy passer.

I am afraid Smart probably peaked. I am not a fan of his this year at all. I don't think he has the ability to reign in his terrible offensive decision making. And to be clear, I don't think this is a Brad problem. I don't think any coach could reel him in. And his defense has notably slipped.

I don't want Smart to be in Boston long term. Ainge should trade him this off-season or next trade deadline and get something for him because I think re-signing him at a number Smart would want would be a terrible decision, both on the court and on the financial end of things.

Last night's performance was quintessential Marcus Smart. Some great defense, boneheaded decisions, some clutch plays, awful shooting and emotional outbursts that hurt the team. I mean, when he started to bark at Kemba for calling him out for possibly the stupidest basketball play in years and it visibly angered Kemba, well, that's embarrassing. You really have to have done something wrong to p!ss off Kemba. The guy is a walking beacon of  positivity.

Sorry, Marcus, I think your welcome here in Boston has been worn out. You need to go while the team can still get some value from trading you.

I agree with everything you said but would add that the one thing Brad can control is Smart's minutes.

True. But I think almost every coach out there would be too enticed by his defensive presence and would put up with what he does offensively. He is an amazing defensive player and quarterback. One of the best in the league.

I just don't think any coach would limit his minutes because of his offense. And I don't see Smart changing. He is hard headed and  is what he is at this point.

My guess is other coaches would try to put him out there with their best ball handlers and playmakers to limit his touches. Like I bet either LA team, the Nets, Dallas, Atlanta, Golden State and teams like that would love to have Smart and play him major minutes alongside their best playmakers. That would mitigate the situation some, I think.

You're right. OKC gives Dort a free hand and he's a worse offensive player than Smart.

OKC are trying to lose, after all

[liam]

Here is my fair Smart discussion.

I wasn't a Smart fan for many years. I thought his defense fantastic but he gave it all back on offense being a bad shooter and scorer. And not just bad, like historically bad given the minutes played and shots taken. His first 4 years he had shooting splits of about 36/29/75 with a TS% of 48% on 9 shots a game.

I also hated his immaturity and just dumb emotional off court stuff that caused him to miss games and threw the team into turmoil.

Then the 2018-19 season happened and I started coming around to liking Smart because, even though he still made offensive decisions that were bad, he at least became serviceable on that end. And, he had his best defensive year.

Then last year, I think he plateaued. He took some minor step backs in shooting and defense(he was still he league's best defensive guard though) but his really bad offensive decision making returned with a vengeance. He decided he was a way better passer than he is and his passing got way too cute, causing unnecessary turnovers or bad offensive possessions. And, he thought he was a much better shooter than he is and decided to increase the number of shots taken a game. Mostly bad shots

This year, that trend has continued and he has taken another step backwards on both ends of the court. Defensively, he clearly takes stretches of the game off and isn't fully engaged. His shot decision making and actual efficiency appear to be returning to pre 2018-19 levels, while he is still taking almost 11 shots per game. His passing is still too cute and though his turnover rate is low, it could be lower if he didn't have one turnover per game due to just trying to be a flashy passer.

I am afraid Smart probably peaked. I am not a fan of his this year at all. I don't think he has the ability to reign in his terrible offensive decision making. And to be clear, I don't think this is a Brad problem. I don't think any coach could reel him in. And his defense has notably slipped.

I don't want Smart to be in Boston long term. Ainge should trade him this off-season or next trade deadline and get something for him because I think re-signing him at a number Smart would want would be a terrible decision, both on the court and on the financial end of things.

Last night's performance was quintessential Marcus Smart. Some great defense, boneheaded decisions, some clutch plays, awful shooting and emotional outbursts that hurt the team. I mean, when he started to bark at Kemba for calling him out for possibly the stupidest basketball play in years and it visibly angered Kemba, well, that's embarrassing. You really have to have done something wrong to p!ss off Kemba. The guy is a walking beacon of  positivity.

Sorry, Marcus, I think your welcome here in Boston has been worn out. You need to go while the team can still get some value from trading you.

I agree with everything you said but would add that the one thing Brad can control is Smart's minutes.

True. But I think almost every coach out there would be too enticed by his defensive presence and would put up with what he does offensively. He is an amazing defensive player and quarterback. One of the best in the league.

I just don't think any coach would limit his minutes because of his offense. And I don't see Smart changing. He is hard headed and  is what he is at this point.

My guess is other coaches would try to put him out there with their best ball handlers and playmakers to limit his touches. Like I bet either LA team, the Nets, Dallas, Atlanta, Golden State and teams like that would love to have Smart and play him major minutes alongside their best playmakers. That would mitigate the situation some, I think.

You're right. OKC gives Dort a free hand and he's a worse offensive player than Smart.

OKC are trying to lose, after all

They did last year in the playoffs too.

[Atzar]

I agree with everything you said but would add that the one thing Brad can control is Smart's minutes.

Where are you putting his minutes?  Kemba and JB can't play more than they already do.  I feel like Pritchard at ~20 minutes per game is already shouldering about as much burden as I want to put on him at this stage in his career.  Fournier, I guess?  Though I'd rather Fournier take the minutes of guys like Ojeleye than Smart. 

IMO we don't need to cut his minutes.  We need him to play better.  Because the reality is, unless this mythical "healthy Romeo Langford" shows up and proves that he deserves a role, we just don't have anybody else. 

[liam]

I agree with everything you said but would add that the one thing Brad can control is Smart's minutes.

Where are you putting his minutes?  Kemba and JB can't play more than they already do.  I feel like Pritchard at ~20 minutes per game is already shouldering about as much burden as I want to put on him at this stage in his career.  Fournier, I guess?  Though I'd rather Fournier take the minutes of guys like Ojeleye than Smart. 

IMO we don't need to cut his minutes.  We need him to play better.  Because the reality is, unless this mythical "healthy Romeo Langford" shows up and proves that he deserves a role, we just don't have anybody else.

Pritchard was at 15 minutes last night and Smart at 38. I would've preferred 30/23. I really just want Pritchard out there 25 minutes a night. Smarts minutes will go down with team fully healthy. If that ever happens I don't see Smart over 30 minutes a night. I would've taken his 4 good minutes last night at the end of the game and just ditched the 34 bad minutes he played earlier. 4th quarter Smart is way better than first three quarters Smart. Brad should maybe just play him the last 12 minutes.

[footey]

So according to NBA last two minute report, foul should have been called on Smart, not Adams:

https://twitter.com/SteveBHoop/status/1377013843382177793?s=20

[mobilija]

Thanks bud. TP

@footey

[Goldstar88]

Smart played like Draymond Green tonight. Only took 6 shots(made 3 of them). Had 10 ast, 4reb, 3stl, 1blk, while playing very good D.

The passing was contagious. Had to have been a season high assists for the team and the guys actually looked like they were enjoying playing with each other. If Smart can have a pass first mindset like he did tonight, C’s might be able to turn things around.

[LilRip]

Smart played like Draymond Green tonight. Only took 6 shots(made 3 of them). Had 10 ast, 4reb, 3stl, 1blk, while playing very good D.

The passing was contagious. Had to have been a season high for the team and the guys actually looked like they were enjoying playing with each other. If Smart can have a pass first mindset like he did tonight, C’s might be able to turn things around.

We can hope but historically, it doesn’t last. Smart will definitely shoot/turnover the C’s out of another game against a tough opponent sooner than we think, his confidence buoyed by moments of him bringing the C’s back against the Raps in game 3 and his other improbable streaks (11 threes in one game).

He’s the ultimate trick or treat player

[nickagneta]

Smart played like Draymond Green tonight. Only took 6 shots(made 3 of them). Had 10 ast, 4reb, 3stl, 1blk, while playing very good D.

The passing was contagious. Had to have been a season high for the team and the guys actually looked like they were enjoying playing with each other. If Smart can have a pass first mindset like he did tonight, C’s might be able to turn things around.

Two of his three turnovers were on trying to be too flashy and showtime with his passes. I wish he would just make the good, right pass and not the Magic Johnson type pass.

Other than that, a fantastic game by Smart.

Now let's see him string about 8-10 games like that in a row.

[Goldstar88]

Smart played like Draymond Green tonight. Only took 6 shots(made 3 of them). Had 10 ast, 4reb, 3stl, 1blk, while playing very good D.

The passing was contagious. Had to have been a season high for the team and the guys actually looked like they were enjoying playing with each other. If Smart can have a pass first mindset like he did tonight, C’s might be able to turn things around.

Two of his three turnovers were on trying to be too flashy and showtime with his passes. I wish he would just make the good, right pass and not the Magic Johnson type pass.

Other than that, a fantastic game by Smart.

Now let's see him string about 8-10 games like that in a row.

He did have some bad TO’s, but overall his assist/turnover ratio was 3-1. I will take it.