Getting Beal: What's the strategy?

[GreenEnvy]

Only way C's get beal is if brown or tatum are involved.

Obviously the C's want to add to brown and tatum but there is nothing at our disposal to make that happen. No amount of draft picks is making that happen because none of them will be top 5 or even 10 for that matter.

And hate to break it to everyone but NO ONE WANTS KEMBA!

Also there's no one on our bench that anyone wants.

So this comes down to are brown and tatum the guys? If not then which one goes? I can't envision a trade for beal where tatum is the one going out. So if it's brown, a guy that has improved every season are we really considering it worth it?

Beal is a big stage player but the team is essentially in the same spot in not being able to add a 3rd player. Seems like a waste imo.

That just isn't true.  Milwaukee acquired Jrue Holiday (a similar player) without including any really good players and Brooklyn acquired Harden (a significantly better player) without including any really good players.  Teams entering rebuilding often want a mass of draft picks  and cap relief.  Boston can provide both of those things if they can find a 3rd team to take Walker (the Knicks, Clippers, and a few other teams make sense for him).

Holiday is 3 years older than Beal, and not nearly the offensive of Beal. Beal is the leading scorer in the NBA.  It would take a substantially bigger package to get him. he is not a "similar player."

Except they are.  They are both in the 15-25 range as players because contrary to what this board believes, you actually play basketball on both ends of the floor and there is more to offense then just scoring.  Holiday is a much better passer.  He is a respectable shooter (in the last 2.5 seasons, Beal is 35% on 7.6 attempts, while Holiday is 34.4% on 5.4 attempts).  Beal is a more efficient scorer (in part because he gets to the line a lot more frequently), but he also shoots a lot more shots which helps a great deal with scoring a lot of points.  Holiday has consistently made his teams better, while Beal quite frankly has not because Beal quite frankly does only 1 thing well, while Holiday does a lot of things well. 

Beal is a bit better and he is younger, so he would take more, but he isn't Harden and Harden was acquired without any prime assets or known draft pick positions as well.

Jrue is a fine player, but I think it’s quite a stretch to put him in the top 25, and ridiculous to consider him around the 15th best player in the league.

Pretty ironic to criticize this board for only focusing on offense, then saying Beal isn’t on Harden’s level. Beal has been a top-10 player this season. Jrue has never been.

[Vermont Green]

Beal is a hot commodity right now.  He is playing great, showing leadership, everything you want in a top player.  I would say he has much more value than Jrue Holiday.  Whether that if fair or properly accounts for defense and intangibles, I don't know, but I feel Beal would be well above Holiday.

And I don't see why the Wizards would trade him.  I am not spending much time dreaming up Beal trades.  Just don't see it as even remotely realistic.

[jambr380]

Beal is a hot commodity right now.  He is playing great, showing leadership, everything you want in a top player.  I would say he has much more value than Jrue Holiday.  Whether that if fair or properly accounts for defense and intangibles, I don't know, but I feel Beal would be well above Holiday.

And I don't see why the Wizards would trade him.  I am not spending much time dreaming up Beal trades.  Just don't see it as even remotely realistic.

Yeah, other than the Tatum connection, I just don't think it's feasible. I have no desire to trade Jaylen for him and it would require a lot of picks on top of Kemba. And, honestly, a healthy Kemba seems just as good of a fit as Beal.

The time to acquire Beal was way back when we thought he might never be able to play 25 mpg because of his health issues; not now when he is playing the best he ever has in his life. Danny doesn't buy high, so expect a much less tantalizing player if and when we do make a big trade.

[PhoSita]

Beal is a hot commodity right now.  He is playing great, showing leadership, everything you want in a top player.  I would say he has much more value than Jrue Holiday.  Whether that if fair or properly accounts for defense and intangibles, I don't know, but I feel Beal would be well above Holiday.

And I don't see why the Wizards would trade him.  I am not spending much time dreaming up Beal trades.  Just don't see it as even remotely realistic.

I'm not sure I see it as realistic, either.

I'm just thinking that for the Celts to go from a 2nd tier team to one of the teams that is seen as a serious contender, they probably need to pull off one of these talent-coup trades where they get a guy they probably shouldn't be able to get (like BRK did with Harden).

Usually to do that you need to have multiple stars already on your roster (check) and for one of your stars to have a personal connection with an All-Star caliber player who is likely to become available in a trade soon (check).


If Beal ain't it, then I'm not sure who is going to give the Celts a chance to really take a step up.  Karl Towns?  I'm dubious. 

[Moranis]

Only way C's get beal is if brown or tatum are involved.

Obviously the C's want to add to brown and tatum but there is nothing at our disposal to make that happen. No amount of draft picks is making that happen because none of them will be top 5 or even 10 for that matter.

And hate to break it to everyone but NO ONE WANTS KEMBA!

Also there's no one on our bench that anyone wants.

So this comes down to are brown and tatum the guys? If not then which one goes? I can't envision a trade for beal where tatum is the one going out. So if it's brown, a guy that has improved every season are we really considering it worth it?

Beal is a big stage player but the team is essentially in the same spot in not being able to add a 3rd player. Seems like a waste imo.

That just isn't true.  Milwaukee acquired Jrue Holiday (a similar player) without including any really good players and Brooklyn acquired Harden (a significantly better player) without including any really good players.  Teams entering rebuilding often want a mass of draft picks  and cap relief.  Boston can provide both of those things if they can find a 3rd team to take Walker (the Knicks, Clippers, and a few other teams make sense for him).

Holiday is 3 years older than Beal, and not nearly the offensive of Beal. Beal is the leading scorer in the NBA.  It would take a substantially bigger package to get him. he is not a "similar player."

Except they are.  They are both in the 15-25 range as players because contrary to what this board believes, you actually play basketball on both ends of the floor and there is more to offense then just scoring.  Holiday is a much better passer.  He is a respectable shooter (in the last 2.5 seasons, Beal is 35% on 7.6 attempts, while Holiday is 34.4% on 5.4 attempts).  Beal is a more efficient scorer (in part because he gets to the line a lot more frequently), but he also shoots a lot more shots which helps a great deal with scoring a lot of points.  Holiday has consistently made his teams better, while Beal quite frankly has not because Beal quite frankly does only 1 thing well, while Holiday does a lot of things well. 

Beal is a bit better and he is younger, so he would take more, but he isn't Harden and Harden was acquired without any prime assets or known draft pick positions as well.

Jrue is a fine player, but I think it’s quite a stretch to put him in the top 25, and ridiculous to consider him around the 15th best player in the league.

Pretty ironic to criticize this board for only focusing on offense, then saying Beal isn’t on Harden’s level. Beal has been a top-10 player this season. Jrue has never been.

I think Beal is around 18 and Holiday is around 25.  So both in the range I indicate.  And before anyone thinks that is nuts I think these players are clearly better than Beal (in no real order) - Lebron, Giannis, Durant, Harden, Curry, Davis, Leonard, Embiid, Jokic, Doncic, Paul, Tatum, Lillard, George, Butler, Gobert, Irving - that is 17.  I think those guys are all clearly better than Beal and I think you could make arguments on others (Zion, Towns, Booker, Mitchell, Simmons, Adebayo, Siakam, etc.).  Beal is an excellent scorer, but he isn't an elite shooter and he doesn't do much else at an even above average rate.  Because he is such a great scorer though he gets elevated past some more well rounded players, but I don't think he passes those players up.  He is in year 9 and very much in his prime.  It isn't like he is going to get appreciably better.

Beal isn't on Harden's level.  Harden is a significantly better player than Beal.  He is a better scorer, rebounder, passer, and probably even defender.  Harden is a top 5 player in the game. 

[GreenWarrior]

I don't think you're going to find anyone dealing in reality that would say jrue Holiday's trade value is equal to bradley beal.

I think if you asked an avg./casual NBA fan who is better beal or jrue Holiday I think they're reply would be who is jrue Holiday.

You can throw all the stats and rankings against the wall that you want no one will ever believe jrue and beal are on par in anyway.

[wdleehi]

I think the only possibility is in the offseason.   


Trade the TPE for a useful player either in his prime or entering his prime.  (actually, younger better).   In the offseason, package that player with one or two young rookie deal players and two to three 1st round picks. 

[PhoSita]

I think the only possibility is in the offseason.   


Trade the TPE for a useful player either in his prime or entering his prime.  (actually, younger better).   In the offseason, package that player with one or two young rookie deal players and two to three 1st round picks.

I think that's a good point -- using the TPE to add players who can be used to aggregate salary to go after Beal later.

[Celtics2021]

To get Beal, I would:

Trade Kemba to Chicago for Otto Porter Jr. and a 1st.  (Hopefully more -- I don't buy the sentiment expressed by some here that Kemba is untradeable/valueless -- but I'll compromise at one 1st for the time being).  Use the Hayward TPE to absorb Porter Jr.'s contract, and get a brand new TPE at Kemba's salary.  (There are a few other teams that could also mostly match Kemba's salary with a large expiring, but I think Chicago is the best fit.)

In the offseason, or even next season, use the Kemba TPE and draft assets (including the pick acquired for Kemba) to get Beal.

[Moranis]

I think the only possibility is in the offseason.   


Trade the TPE for a useful player either in his prime or entering his prime.  (actually, younger better).   In the offseason, package that player with one or two young rookie deal players and two to three 1st round picks.

I think that's a good point -- using the TPE to add players who can be used to aggregate salary to go after Beal later.

I still think it just makes more sense to trade Kemba.  I don't Kemba and Beal would be a good fit anyway, so trade Kemba now, pick up more flexibility, and use the players you got for Kemba, to acquire Beal.  That way you still then have the TPE.

Something like Walker for Morris, Beverley, Zubac.  Then use Beverley, Thompson, and Nesmith, plus the 21, 22, 24, 26 picks (you finalize after the draft so you are trading the player in 21 and thus can trade the 22 pick) for Beal.

So after that trade next summer you'd have Smart, Beal, Brown, Tatum, Zubac, Morris, Pritchard, R. Williams, G. Williams, Langford you re-sign Theis and Ojeleye and then still have the whole TPE to use.   

[Vermont Green]

I still think it just makes more sense to trade Kemba.   

This is simple.  If we could do some combination of trades that ended up with Kemba plus maybe a young player and some picks getting us Beal, then sure, I am in for that.  Kemba going to another team for assets that Washington likes, or whatever.  If we have Beal, we certainly don't need Kemba.  Beal would be an upgrade.  Definitely worth Kemba plus additional assets.

I just don't see it though.  I think if we trade Kemba, we should try to trade him for assets we want.  That trade would be hard enough.

[PhoSita]

I still think it just makes more sense to trade Kemba.  I don't Kemba and Beal would be a good fit anyway, so trade Kemba now, pick up more flexibility, and use the players you got for Kemba, to acquire Beal.  That way you still then have the TPE.

I think trading Kemba would be a necessary part of any move to acquire another very highly paid player, just for cap reasons.  However I'm not sure if it's realistic to expect that Kemba would be an asset in a trade for Beal.  In that case including Kemba might mean adding a third team which inherently makes it a lot more difficult to complete a deal.

[Moranis]

I still think it just makes more sense to trade Kemba.  I don't Kemba and Beal would be a good fit anyway, so trade Kemba now, pick up more flexibility, and use the players you got for Kemba, to acquire Beal.  That way you still then have the TPE.

I think trading Kemba would be a necessary part of any move to acquire another very highly paid player, just for cap reasons.  However I'm not sure if it's realistic to expect that Kemba would be an asset in a trade for Beal.  In that case including Kemba might mean adding a third team which inherently makes it a lot more difficult to complete a deal.

well that is why I'd just trade Kemba now.  I think the Clippers or Knicks would take him this year.  Morris, Beverley, Zubac I mentioned a few posts back.  I think that makes sense for both teams.  As for the Knicks, they have a bunch of cap room and a bunch of expiring contracts.  Something like Walker and Edwards for Ntkilina, Burks, Bullock, and Noel or Payton.  Add another 14 million or so TPE and a bunch of expiring contracts.  Also significantly increases the bench depth, though obviously at the expense of the starting lineup.  Maybe you can get Knox instead of one of the expirings.  I'd try for that.

Now the Knicks trade wouldn't provide any pieces to get Beal, unless you did that at the same time, but it would clear a ton of room off the books (and the team would have to cut Green and probably Semi to do a 2 for 4). 

I'm just at the point where clearing Kemba makes sense.  I just don't think he is worth having around because he isn't good enough to make a difference and his salary is just so big.

[gouki88]

Jrue Holiday is not the same as beal. Harden and houston situation is a different situation, harden wanted out and houston wanted to get rid of him and also got oladipo in the deal.

Celtics have nothing close to an oladipo to deal outside of brown or tatum. No one wants kemba, danny tried moving kemba already and everyone got offended for ainge trying to sell them damaged goods - no one wants kemba.

exactly. Not even close

Jrue Holiday is better at everything besides scoring the ball. Talent isn't just scoring, you realise?

[GreenWarrior]

Jrue Holiday is not the same as beal. Harden and houston situation is a different situation, harden wanted out and houston wanted to get rid of him and also got oladipo in the deal.

Celtics have nothing close to an oladipo to deal outside of brown or tatum. No one wants kemba, danny tried moving kemba already and everyone got offended for ainge trying to sell them damaged goods - no one wants kemba.

exactly. Not even close

Jrue Holiday is better at everything besides scoring the ball. Talent isn't just scoring, you realise?

Reality is you guys will convince no one that jrue Holiday is worth more  or equal to beal in trade value.

And if you don't believe me then why don't we just go after jrue instead of beal if he is