Author Topic: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...  (Read 2932 times)

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Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2021, 04:50:12 AM »

Offline Kernewek

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1) These aren't mutually exclusive - both fleecing the Nets in 2013 and them having three stars right now can and did happen.

2) Acting like Tatum and Brown - probably the best young duo in the league today - are chump change is a bad take.

3) It's far from a given that their "Big 3" is going to be a substantial force and outshine us, as they have many holes and MANY personality/characteristic issues to face. While I was skeptical of KD fitting in GS, that was a substantially better fit just given the playing styles and overall characters of those guys. This is something completely different with three of the most iso-heavy guys in the league (and historically for both Harden and Kyrie) trying to play together. And that is not even considering the substantial personality challenges - e.g. Kyrie's sabbatical and Harden's recent antics when he wasn't getting his way - or major defensive and depth issues they have.

Ill always say I can be wrong. I may be wrong here. But Im emotional right now seeing the worst-case scenario with regards to Harden. I did not want him in the East unless it was on our team, and I definitely did not want him teaming up with Irving.

Why Irving in particular? I feel like they are not particularly complementary players.
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Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2021, 05:43:17 AM »

Online Ilikesports17

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1) These aren't mutually exclusive - both fleecing the Nets in 2013 and them having three stars right now can and did happen.

2) Acting like Tatum and Brown - probably the best young duo in the league today - are chump change is a bad take.

3) It's far from a given that their "Big 3" is going to be a substantial force and outshine us, as they have many holes and MANY personality/characteristic issues to face. While I was skeptical of KD fitting in GS, that was a substantially better fit just given the playing styles and overall characters of those guys. This is something completely different with three of the most iso-heavy guys in the league (and historically for both Harden and Kyrie) trying to play together. And that is not even considering the substantial personality challenges - e.g. Kyrie's sabbatical and Harden's recent antics when he wasn't getting his way - or major defensive and depth issues they have.

Ill always say I can be wrong. I may be wrong here. But Im emotional right now seeing the worst-case scenario with regards to Harden. I did not want him in the East unless it was on our team, and I definitely did not want him teaming up with Irving.
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Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #17 on: January 14, 2021, 05:46:22 AM »

Offline Csfan1984

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No Nets weren't fleeced. Nets underachieved and did a poor job signing guys. C's took Wallace who was terrible.

Reason why Nets might be better than C's now is C's stayed competitive during their rebuild and only tanked one year. DA and ownership chose to not wait for top 10 player signings or elite draft picks at each level. They even gambled on Irving, Hayward, Hordford as a championship contender none of which were top ten players. And let's be honest, Nets bounce back is mostly luck and location and yet to prove itself.

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #18 on: January 14, 2021, 06:09:26 AM »

Offline BitterJim

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The Nets doing an admirable job of picking up the pieces doesn't change how damaging that trade was for them. Given how little they accomplished with KG and Pierce, losing one top 3 pick is devistating. Losing two (one of which was the #1 overall), plus a few other picks (one pick was for taking on Wallace, so they get a pass there, but not for the rest) I'd absolutely a fleece.
I'm bitter.

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #19 on: January 14, 2021, 06:20:18 AM »

Offline NKY fan

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It really depends on whether you think draft picks are all that precious.
At the rate that picks are being traded starting with the Paul George to clippers trade it suggests that picks are not as valuable.
I think we did fleece the nets but what really helped us was that prochorov got into financial trouble right after the 2013 trade. He was not willing to keep trading for expensive players and pay a heavy luxury tax bill so they decided that giving away high picks was the lesser evil for them.
Now if let say we got the 11th pick in 2016 from the nets. I can still see Danny trading up to 7 and pick Jaylen.
Similar in 2017 if nets gave us the 7th pick there is still probably a way for Danny to trade up to 5 and get Tatum.

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #20 on: January 14, 2021, 06:55:32 AM »

Offline cman88

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We got Jaylen Brown and Jayson tatum for pierce and garnett who were off the nets a year after the trade.


So, yes we did.

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #21 on: January 14, 2021, 07:10:15 AM »

Offline pearljammer10

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An obvious yes we did.

Our rebuild is done when almost our whole team is in their early 20s? 🤔

Our MVP candidate is only 21? 🤔

Next.

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #22 on: January 14, 2021, 07:11:47 AM »

Offline boscel33

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...Because theyve got Durant, Irving and Harden. And our rebuild has been done for years. And weve got Tatum and Brown. Nice pieces, but were not beating that Big 3 anytime soon...

Sadly, at this point our best bet is for the season to be cancelled. Otherwise, its the Lakers or Nets winning the next title. 🤢

Dannys gotta retire: Hes too toxic to free agents, nobody wants to trade with him anymore, and we last won a title almost 13 years ago, when George W. Bush was still president. We need to get Popovich here.

Wow two threads saying Danny must go.  You must be bored, or you're really Tree Rollins!
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Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #23 on: January 14, 2021, 07:13:28 AM »

Online Birdman

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Of course!!!
C/PF-Horford, Baynes, Noel, Theis, Morris,
SF/SG- Tatum, Brown, Hayward, Smart, Semi, Clark
PG- Irving, Rozier, Larkin

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #24 on: January 14, 2021, 07:57:36 AM »

Offline IDreamCeltics

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Honestly the Nets have completed 2 full rebuilds in the time it's taken the Celtics to start theirs.
 

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #25 on: January 14, 2021, 08:02:35 AM »

Online wdleehi

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So the Nets got lucky because Durant wanted to play with Irving and Irving wanted to go home and play?   


Then Harden wanted to play with them.



How is this the Celtics didn't fleece the Nets?   




Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #26 on: January 14, 2021, 08:08:24 AM »

Online Roy H.

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Did the Celtics really fleece Rochester to move up for Bill Russell?

Russell only delivered 11 titles in 13 seasons (84.6%, only a B average), while the Ice Capades provided quality family entertainment for 50 years.
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Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #27 on: January 14, 2021, 08:10:39 AM »

Online td450

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1) These aren't mutually exclusive - both fleecing the Nets in 2013 and them having three stars right now can and did happen.

2) Acting like Tatum and Brown - probably the best young duo in the league today - are chump change is a bad take.

3) It's far from a given that their "Big 3" is going to be a substantial force and outshine us, as they have many holes and MANY personality/characteristic issues to face. While I was skeptical of KD fitting in GS, that was a substantially better fit just given the playing styles and overall characters of those guys. This is something completely different with three of the most iso-heavy guys in the league (and historically for both Harden and Kyrie) trying to play together. And that is not even considering the substantial personality challenges - e.g. Kyrie's sabbatical and Harden's recent antics when he wasn't getting his way - or major defensive and depth issues they have.

Ill always say I can be wrong. I may be wrong here. But Im emotional right now seeing the worst-case scenario with regards to Harden. I did not want him in the East unless it was on our team, and I definitely did not want him teaming up with Irving.

Does it look like Harden will play with Irving? We have no explicit confirmation, but it sure looks like Irving's current little vacation was due to him knowing this trade was coming. There is no way to make this work without healthy doses of common sacrifice by all three, and especially Kyrie, who is obviously a distant third banana here. Does that sound plausible?

What can Brooklyn do? What GM in their right mind would give up anything for the privilege of dropping a time bomb onto their roster? And even when they do the dirty work of shedding him for very little, it will be Durant/Harden against Tatum/Brown. I bet on the young guys. They are not on the same skill level, but they are young, both healthy and super fit, infinitely more mature, and they play defense better than any other wing pair in the league. They will win out in the end because they are stronger mentally and emotionally.

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #28 on: January 14, 2021, 08:19:57 AM »

Offline jambr380

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The OP is just trying to elicit a strong reaction. Obviously we fleeced the Nets, but they weren't really punished for getting fleeced. Because they are in one of the two markets players actually want to be in, they were able to sign two superstars for free w/ another demanding a trade only there. The same thing happened with both LA teams over the last couple of years. If we completed the same trade w/ say, the T-Wolves, they would be still be in utter despair right now.

We look at all of those teams and say 'I can't believe they gave up all of those picks.' But, 1) it was totally worth it since they already signed superstar FAs, and 2) they can just go out and sign superstar FAs again if it doesn't work out...and for LAL, it already totally worked out.

Re: Did We Really Fleece the Nets?...
« Reply #29 on: January 14, 2021, 09:01:39 AM »

Online Vermont Green

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To me, the anti-reality to having done the trade is that we don't do the trade, keep Pierce and Garnett and try to win another title or two.  Then try and rebuild through FA.  I don't think we would have won any more titles with that group and I don't think we would have ended up with Durant and Harden.  It is all hypothetical of course.

Danny channeled Bill Belichick, better to trade them too early than too late.  It isn't about who fleeced who, no one has to end being the fleecee or the fleeceor in every trade.  This Harden trade does not change my view of the earlier trade in the least.

« Last Edit: January 14, 2021, 09:50:07 AM by Vermont Green »