Author Topic: TRADE IDEAS  (Read 5047 times)

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Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #90 on: October 15, 2020, 11:55:01 AM »

Offline RPGenerate

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washington doesn't want to give up beal.  full stop.   and any deal would have to include jaylen. 

i keep hearing this draft has no superstars worth trading up for,  sure it does.  they said the same thing in the doncic draft.  it wasn't perceived the way it is now.   look how that turned out.  the key is identifying the guy.
That isn't true about the 2018 NBA draft. Many people had high hopes for Trae Young, DeAndre Ayton, Luke Doncic, Marvin Bagley, ect. Those guys would probably be the first pick in this draft.
2020 Celticsstrong All-2000s Draft: Denver Nuggets:
PG: Gary Payton / Steve Francis
SG: Kyrie Irving / Raja Bell / Danny Green
SF: Rip Hamiltion / Glenn Robinson / Robert Covington
PF: Carmelo Anthony / Draymond Green / Anthony Mason
C: Tim Duncan / DeMarcus Cousins / Zydrunas Ilgauskas

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #91 on: October 15, 2020, 12:08:44 PM »

Online td450

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I think the Celtics are a lot closer than most of you realize. And more importantly, the organization believes in this roster.

A few minor changes, sure. But there will be no major moves. Hayward/Kemba healthy throughout the playoffs and there is a very realistic chance we win the title this year.

If we see expected progression from the Jays, and Kemba and Hayward can stay healthy, that alone will make us a serious contender.

Dannyís challenge this offseason is to fill in the holes.

If that's true then I find it bewildering that we didn't add any veteran role players to the bench that could have relieved some minutes and pressure of our starters. Given the performances, injuries and contract issues of our 'veterans' Walker, Wanamaker, Hayward, Ojeleye, Theis and Kanter I'm not as willing as you anymore to push the goals. I think the Celtics can start their peak 2-3 years from now.

Tatum, Brown and Smart carried the team when it mattered. That's the core for me. We have some talented young guys that have lots of potential and 3 first round picks in the draft. Slowly build for the future is my device with Smart (26), Brown (23), Tatum (22), R.Williams (22), G.Williams (21) and Langford (20).

I'm not saying we should dump Walker, Hayward and Theis for just any offer. But if Hayward won't extend for a reasonable price (70/3 - 80/4 or something) I would trade him before the deadline to get us out of the luxury tax. And Walker is a contract that will probably look worse and worse over time, get a cheaper (borderline)-All Star back and I'm happy. What the playoffs have shown is that Theis can't be your lone starting big and he's an expiring contract, in a good deal I'd let him go as well even though I like him.

Management can do a lot of things, but they need to mostly work for a team to win a championship, especially without an MVP level player. If Walker and/or Hayward had able to provide some end of game poise, we'd have made it to the finals as is. Neither guy can walk away from the playoffs and say they performed near expectations.

By next year, it probably won't matter, because Tatum and Brown will be that much more developed as leaders.

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #92 on: October 15, 2020, 04:42:14 PM »

Offline johnnygreen

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I think the Celtics need to make a major change, and specifically to the center position. I like Theis, and I think he has performed well. Letís not forget, I donít think Danny thought Al Horford would leav during free agency, so he didnít plan accordingly. I mentioned a trade for Joel Embiid before, but Iíll adjust my previous proposal.

Bos Ė Joel Embiid
Phi Ė Jaylen Brown, Myles Turner
Ind Ė Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford

As much as we love our current roster, specifically with the Jís, I think a philosophical change in the offense is needed. We are not an elite 3 point shooting team like Golden State, who put more resources in 3 point shooting than a big man. I feel like the Celtics exert so much effort on the defensive end, that it effects their offense. How many times does the opposing team get second chances because they simply outrebound us? That takes a toll over the course of a game. As much as I like Theis, he simply isnít the presence that Embiid is. I like Jaylen, but the offensive game he brings doesnít come close to what Embiid could provide. Being in a bad environment hurts some players, and sometimes they simply need a change of scenery, and I think Embiid fits that bill.

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #93 on: October 15, 2020, 07:06:52 PM »

Online gouki88

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I think the Celtics are a lot closer than most of you realize. And more importantly, the organization believes in this roster.

A few minor changes, sure. But there will be no major moves. Hayward/Kemba healthy throughout the playoffs and there is a very realistic chance we win the title this year.

If we see expected progression from the Jays, and Kemba and Hayward can stay healthy, that alone will make us a serious contender.

Dannyís challenge this offseason is to fill in the holes.

If that's true then I find it bewildering that we didn't add any veteran role players to the bench that could have relieved some minutes and pressure of our starters. Given the performances, injuries and contract issues of our 'veterans' Walker, Wanamaker, Hayward, Ojeleye, Theis and Kanter I'm not as willing as you anymore to push the goals. I think the Celtics can start their peak 2-3 years from now..
I think the team pre-All Star break was not seen as a genuine contender by many, including those in our front office. However, after that playoff run, it is.

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #94 on: October 15, 2020, 08:04:49 PM »

Offline RodyTur10

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To the above idea: I think there's zero chance Philadelphia does that.
And I don't like Embiid enough (attitude, condition issues, injury prone) to offer a package that starts Philadelphia thinking.
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There are a lot of rumours about teams willing to trade down, like Minnesota wants a 'star' and Golden State may want veteran help. The Knicks seems to want to trade up or trade down depending on whether they can get LaMelo Ball or Wiseman. I have no problem facilitating New York with LaMelo Ball or help Minnesota land a star (probably 2nd tier/3rd tier star though).

My question is would you be willing to make a deal that helps us, but also helps Golden State in the process?

Because maybe there's a multi-way-deal-possible with Hayward going to Golden State? Ainge wouldn't have to feel bad about sending Hayward to a championship favorite and he'd be a great fit for them.

I'm still thinking about the construction. Minnesota for instance would trade James Johnson as expiring salary filler and he would be a decent fit for us for a year. It would bring us under the cap and we can even use the full MLE then without going into the luxury tax.

Minnesota wants that 3rd star and pressure is on them, because they traded a future pick for Russell and they want to make the playoffs in a brutal Western conference to keep Towns happy.

Teams with (some kind of) a star that maybe are interested in trading for a top pick:

Boston: neither Walker (position) or Hayward (1-year-contract) make sense for the Wolves
Toronto: Siakam, good fit for the Wolves but not sure Toronto wants to rebuild
Indiana: Oladipo, expiring and a big gamble but again a good fit
Orlando: Vucevic, terrible fit next to Towns
Washington: Beal, this makes sense. Wizards have been reluctant but a big asset #1 pick is up for grabs.
Chicago: LaVine, easy to execute. Happy return home, small trade 4=>1
Detroit: Griffin, major injury concerns, trade 7=>1
Atlanta: Collins+6=>1. Wolves would be special offensively
Cleveland: Love, again a happy return? Trade 5=>1
Houston: Westbrook or Harden, can't see it happening
OKC: Paul, can OKC increase their draft capital even further?
Utah: Gobert, go big and inject defense and Towns as PF. Worked for Davis.
Portland: McCollum, maybe Portland wants Hayward, don't see them interested in picks?
San Antonio: DeRozan, had a very good season, an expiring contract though, trade 11=>1
Sacramento: Hield, not a star to me but who knows, trade 12=>1
New Orleans: Holiday, it would be great for the Pelicans to add a top pick to Ball, Ingram and Zion

I highlighted the teams that make sense to me. Do you have ideas how to make this work and have the Celtics trade up (not necessarily to #1 or #2)?
Rationalism over beliefs

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #95 on: October 15, 2020, 10:55:17 PM »

Online Sophomore

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I think the Celtics need to make a major change, and specifically to the center position. I like Theis, and I think he has performed well. Letís not forget, I donít think Danny thought Al Horford would leav during free agency, so he didnít plan accordingly. I mentioned a trade for Joel Embiid before, but Iíll adjust my previous proposal.

Bos Ė Joel Embiid
Phi Ė Jaylen Brown, Myles Turner
Ind Ė Josh Richardson, Romeo Langford

As much as we love our current roster, specifically with the Jís, I think a philosophical change in the offense is needed. We are not an elite 3 point shooting team like Golden State, who put more resources in 3 point shooting than a big man. I feel like the Celtics exert so much effort on the defensive end, that it effects their offense. How many times does the opposing team get second chances because they simply outrebound us? That takes a toll over the course of a game. As much as I like Theis, he simply isnít the presence that Embiid is. I like Jaylen, but the offensive game he brings doesnít come close to what Embiid could provide. Being in a bad environment hurts some players, and sometimes they simply need a change of scenery, and I think Embiid fits that bill.

That is a really creative trade idea. Hard to see it happening with such big pieces, but itíd be entertaining if it did! How would you stop the Csí offense? A perimeter defense with Jaylen, Simmons, and Thybulle would be ridiculous, with Turner as a rim protector. Not sure how they would score if they donít force a turnover, but man. Indiana? Whatever.

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #96 on: October 16, 2020, 03:14:19 AM »

Online gouki88

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https://tradenba.com/trades/woeg4Nhcz

Boston trades: Robert Williams, #26
Boston receives: Jarrett Allen

Brooklyn trades: Caris LeVert, Jarrett Allen
Brooklyn receives: Buddy Hield

Sacramento trades: Buddy Hield
Sacramento receives: Caris LeVert, Robert Williams and #26

Why for Boston: Replaces Williams with Allen, a great rebounding, shot blocking and interior finishing big man.

Why for Brooklyn: Take a punt on a potential All-Star SG, rather than hoping youth turns into that.

Why for Sacramento: Removes a malcontent and brings in some good young talent.

https://tradenba.com/trades/AOv7PuCev

Boston trades: Romeo Langford, Vincent Poirier, #14
Boston receives: Lauri Markannen

Chicago trades: Zach Lavine, Lauri Markannen
Chicago receives: Andrew Wiggins, Romeo Langford, Vincent Poirier, #2 and #14

GSW trade: Andrew Wiggins, #2
GSW receive: Zach Lavine, #44

Why for Boston: Get a genuine 4 who can stretch the floor and rebound, despite criminal under-utilisation in Chicago

Why for Chicago: Kickstarts a youth movement with two lottery picks, a prospect and a 20PPG scorer, despite his shocker contract

Why for GSW: Receive a genuine All-Star guard alongside Curry and Klay. Those 3 would stretch the floor like crazy. Also get out of Wiggins' contract.

I would love this big man rotation:
Allen / Theis / Tillman (#30)
Markannen / Grant Williams

That being said, not sure any are realistic or even good value for all involved. Just bored senseless, lol

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #97 on: October 16, 2020, 06:21:10 AM »

Offline Jvalin

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https://tradenba.com/trades/woeg4Nhcz

Boston trades: Robert Williams, #26
Boston receives: Jarrett Allen

Brooklyn trades: Caris LeVert, Jarrett Allen
Brooklyn receives: Buddy Hield

Sacramento trades: Buddy Hield
Sacramento receives: Caris LeVert, Robert Williams and #26

Why for Boston: Replaces Williams with Allen, a great rebounding, shot blocking and interior finishing big man.

Why for Brooklyn: Take a punt on a potential All-Star SG, rather than hoping youth turns into that.

Why for Sacramento: Removes a malcontent and brings in some good young talent.
I'm a fan of Jarret Allen's game. Here are a few thoughts on my part:

1. In a vacuum, is he a better player than Theis? I believe he is, plus he definitely has the potential to become way better than Theis in the future.
2. Is he a better fit in our system compared to Theis? I don't think so.
3. Is he a better prospect than Timelord? Hard to tell. I guess Allen has a higher floor, whereas Timelord has a higher ceiling.

Fwiw, here are some advanced stats. Would love to read your thoughts on anything that strikes your attention.

Pick n Roll offense
Allen 1.37 PPP (29.3% frequency)
Timelord 1.30 PPP (27.0% frequency)
Theis 1.17 PPP (27.5% frequency)

Pick n Roll defense
Allen allowed 0.90 PPP
Timelord allowed 1.21 PPP
Theis allowed 1.24 PPP

Putbacks
Timelord 1.14 PPP (17.2% frequency)
Theis 1.12 PPP (15.3 frequency)
Allen 1.04 PPP (20.3% frequency)

Cuts
Timelord 1.71 PPP (25.4% frequency) --> 99.1 percentile
Theis 1.32 PPP (24.5% frequency)
Allen 1.29 PPP (26.6% frequency)

Rim protection: opponent shooting % in the restricted area
Theis 59.7
Allen 59.7
Timelord 67.3

Rim protection: opponent shooting % in the paint (non-restricted area)
Timelord 35.0
Theis 38.6
Allen 43.4

Spot up shooting - offense
Theis 0.94 PPP (14.5% frequency)
Timelord - no stats available, but he's definitely better than Allen
Allen 0.20 PPP (1.6% frequency) --> 0.2 percentile

Spot up shooting - defense
Timelord allowed 0.50 PPP (15.4% frequency) --> 98.8 percentile
Theis allowed 0.85 PPP (18.2% frequency)
Allen allowed 0.90 PPP (14.3% frequency)

Scoring in transition
Theis 1.49 PPP (7.0% frequency) --> 96.4 percentile
Allen 1.39 PPP (7.7%   frequency) --> 91.9 percentile
Timelord 1.08 PPP (10.7% frequency)

Post up defense
Allen allowed 0.97 PPP (5.0% frequency)
Theis allowed 1.09 PPP (7.9% frequency)
Timelord - no stats available

Screen assists per 36 minutes
Timelord 6.72
Theis 6.42
Allen 5.98

Charges drawn
Theis 0.11 per 24.1 minutes
Allen 0.01 per 26.5 minutes
Timelord 0.00 per 13.4 minutes

Opponents FG%
Timelord 40.1
Allen 45.1
Theis 45.8

Difference between the average FG% of opponents, and their FG% when Timelord/Allen/Theis is guarding them
Timelord -6.7
Allen -2.8
Theis -2.2

Can't find a stat regarding perimeter defense. If anyone knows any good perimeter defense stats I would love to hear them. My eye test says that Theis is the better perimeter defender. Imo, this is hands down his most valuable skill.
« Last Edit: October 16, 2020, 02:30:02 PM by Jvalin »

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #98 on: October 16, 2020, 08:43:58 PM »

Offline RodyTur10

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Misspost.

Trade machine didn't work properly.  :-[
« Last Edit: Today at 08:20:12 AM by RodyTur10 »
Rationalism over beliefs

Re: TRADE IDEAS
« Reply #99 on: October 16, 2020, 09:22:45 PM »

Offline tazzmaniac

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TRADE IDEA:

To Minnesota Timberwolves:  Gordon Hayward (picks up PO), Daniel Theis, Semi Ojeleye, #14, #30 + Boston 2021 1st

To Boston Celtics:  #1 (I select Anthony Edwards) + James Johnson



Why for Minnesota:

There's a lot of pressure on the organization. They traded their own next year's pick to get D'Angelo Russell for Andrew Wiggins. Not only is the 'win now'-objective they have declared a signal to Karl-Anthony Towns and co. It's also a lost season if they don't significantly improve because Golden State will profit and make the Wolves look foolish if they bottom out, since the pick is only 1-3 protected and unprotected the year after.

The Wolves want a 3rd co-star to Russell en Towns, but they don't grow on trees and I doubt that fits like George or Siakam will be available. Their best bet would be LaVine or Beal, but that might not work out. Any call by Boston will start with asking for Brown or Smart, I understand. But of course we should decline that. When the options become slim Gordon Hayward can look attractive. Fits the team as a glove and we can offer them Daniel Theis as the guy to do the dirty work for Towns. Automatically James Johnson is the logical guy out and they get Semi Ojeleye back as a defensive specialist.

The Wolves obviously need to be compensated with draft capital (in #14, #30, future 1st). The Wolves can trade back up to #8 if the reports are true that the Knicks are looking to trade down (Wolves have #17 from Dallas to make it work).

Their rotation will look like this and that starting line-up looks pretty good actually:

Russell - Beasley - Hayward - Towns - Theis
McLaughlin - Culver - Okogie - Hernangomez - Reid
Layman - Ojeleye - Spellman + rookies, possibly picked at #8 and #30


Why for Boston:

We get out of the luxury tax and therefore postpone a potential repeater tax with at least 2 years. Only giving up expiring contracts and capitalize on our draft picks to get a player with obvious star potential. I think that the Boston Celtics organization and culture would bring out the best in Anthony Edwards.

Some minor other moves:
  • convince Enes Kanter to stay
  • sign Kyle O`Quinn and Shaquille Harrison on minimums
  • draft Paul Reed (#26) and Sam Merrill (#47)
  • let Brad Wanamaker walk
  • waive Javonte Green and Vincent Poirier (2.6M dead cap this year)
  • bring Tremont Waters and Tacko Fall back on two-way contracts if they want

Rotation (and 200K below the 132.6 luxury cap tax):

Walker - Brown - Tatum - J. Johnson - R. Williams
Smart - A. Edwards - Merrill - G. Williams - Kanter
S. Harrison - C. Edwards - Langford - Reed - O'Quinn
The salaries in this trade don't come close to matching. 

The other problem is Minnesota isn't sniffing the playoffs next season after this trade and there is a good chance that Hayward leaves after next season.  So then they would have dropped from #1 to #14 for just two late 1sts.