Anyone want to talk about this epic collapse?

[ETNCeltics]

Robert Williams was all I was interested in and I thought he did well. Looks bigger and stayed down.
Romeo showed his hops on that dunk and his length on defence..

Maybe a little rusty and out of control, but he was a beast athlete out there. I hope he can stay healthy the rest of the season.

[mmmmm]

I hope Tatum, Hayward, Kemba, Jaylen are all out, and Smart suspended tonite!  Danny deserves to see "HIS" bench play a whole game and get routed by the Cavs!

TP

100% agree with you. He did a horrible job with the bench leaving it with all inexperienced players that can’t help you win right now if heavily called on.

Is there a team in the NBA that can win if it is missing ALL of it's top five players?   What team has THAT kind of depth?

Injuries happen but when you leave the bench full of inexperienced players then you blow big leads at home against an average team.
Not doing anything to a weak bench with a bunch of rookies can derail the season. I’m not saying they need all stars on their bench just one vet maybe that can come in and calm things down a little and score? You can’t expect every starting player is going to be healthy every night and when your trying to get the 2nd seed games like last night can’t happen.

Across a 15 man (13-active) roster, very few teams have more than 3 or 4 guys who you look to as primary scorers at any point, whether starting or off the bench.  These are the guys who you expect to 'get points'.   Almost all the other 10-11 guys on a typical roster are role players and secondary scorers or even guys who almost never score.

For most teams, of those 3-4 guys who are able to act as 'primary scorer', only a couple of those guys are in the starting lineup and maybe one or two are off the bench.

This team has 4 efficient volume scorers already.  They just all happen to be starters.   But when healthy they cover all the bench lineups as well.   So they are filling the role of 'primary scorer' that we don't bring off the bench.

In a more conventional roster, you aren't really any more or less protected against the bizarre volume of injuries that have suddenly struck the Celtics. 

Take the Clippers for an example.  They have 2 primary scorers in their starting lineup (Kawhi & George) and otherwise 3 supporting cast guys (Zubac, Beverley & Harkless) who combine to score just 21 points per game.   To get scoring during bench lineups they depend on Lou Williams and Montreal Harrell to be the primary scorers.   

But that doesn't protect them against a wide swath of injuries any more than Boston.  If Kawhi and George AND both Harrell and Williams were all injured at the same time, then they would be in the same sort of trouble as Boston is right now.  The fact that Williams and Harrell come off the bench is the only difference.   In either case, it would be a "perfect storm" of too many injuries to too many of your best players all at the same time.

[iadera]

No more credit for Hayward. Should be on the block

[chiken]

Funny.
We want bench Scoring When we give up 50 points in a qtr.. (The two guys people are talking about bringing on play ZERO Defense)
The bench was only outscored by two points in this game btw..

Silver lining

I think it was much needed for the young players on the bench. They were not connected on Defense last night, They were outhustled, outsmarted and outplayed and it's understandable (not just because they are young)... They get so many DNPs... Probably never in their wildest dreams did they think they would ALL get in a game at the time needing to help us win... (usually, when they get in the game it's defer and get the heck out of the way)

So, in my opinion, this was good for the team and a good weapon for Brad. Now the kids Know that their number can truly be called and it might not be with the J's or Gordon or Kemba on the court...  And they now know how embarrassing it can be when you play the way that they played...

This bodes well because I do think those guys can play with more effort and discipline.
We need them to.

[angryguy77]

If smart isn't palying hero ball he's making dumb mistakes at the end of the game.

Brad is not the coach we need either.

I said this in the game thread that the effort given against Hou was embarrassing and last night's approach to the game by the players and coach show they are more than just one player away from being legit contenders.

Welcome to avg team limbo friends. I see a lot of 2nd round playoff exits with this roster unless DA brings in some talent and a coach. 

[ImShakHeIsShaq]

I hope Tatum, Hayward, Kemba, Jaylen are all out, and Smart suspended tonite!  Danny deserves to see "HIS" bench play a whole game and get routed by the Cavs!

TP

100% agree with you. He did a horrible job with the bench leaving it with all inexperienced players that can’t help you win right now if heavily called on.

Is there a team in the NBA that can win if it is missing ALL of it's top five players?   What team has THAT kind of depth?

Injuries happen but when you leave the bench full of inexperienced players then you blow big leads at home against an average team.
Not doing anything to a weak bench with a bunch of rookies can derail the season. I’m not saying they need all stars on their bench just one vet maybe that can come in and calm things down a little and score? You can’t expect every starting player is going to be healthy every night and when your trying to get the 2nd seed games like last night can’t happen.

Across a 15 man (13-active) roster, very few teams have more than 3 or 4 guys who you look to as primary scorers at any point, whether starting or off the bench.  These are the guys who you expect to 'get points'.   Almost all the other 10-11 guys on a typical roster are role players and secondary scorers or even guys who almost never score.

For most teams, of those 3-4 guys who are able to act as 'primary scorer', only a couple of those guys are in the starting lineup and maybe one or two are off the bench.

This team has 4 efficient volume scorers already.  They just all happen to be starters.   But when healthy they cover all the bench lineups as well.   So they are filling the role of 'primary scorer' that we don't bring off the bench.

In a more conventional roster, you aren't really any more or less protected against the bizarre volume of injuries that have suddenly struck the Celtics. 

Take the Clippers for an example.  They have 2 primary scorers in their starting lineup (Kawhi & George) and otherwise 3 supporting cast guys (Zubac, Beverley & Harkless) who combine to score just 21 points per game.   To get scoring during bench lineups they depend on Lou Williams and Montreal Harrell to be the primary scorers.   

But that doesn't protect them against a wide swath of injuries any more than Boston.  If Kawhi and George AND both Harrell and Williams were all injured at the same time, then they would be in the same sort of trouble as Boston is right now.  The fact that Williams and Harrell come off the bench is the only difference.   In either case, it would be a "perfect storm" of too many injuries to too many of your best players all at the same time.

You better say it! Hell, clips can't even float as well as the Cs have when missing just KL, let alone him and PG! Our supporting cast has stepped up more than their's had when injuries hit when PG and KL weren't playing early season for them. No one wants to be honest about that though, it doesn't fit their narrative!

[footey]

I was supremely disappointed by the finish of last night's game, but really, not sure what to expect with so many guys hurt.

Silver lining: Rob Williams played great when it counted. After a shaky start, he played very well, just makes us feel bigger, and quicker.  Will help Theis if he can get some rest too. Guy has been playing a lot of minutes this season. Want him to be rested for the playoffs.

Let's focus on getting healthy for our playoff run. If we lose to the Cavs tonight because we are missing 4 of our top 5 guys, not the end of the world.

Frankly, I wish we would just rest Kemba for most of the remaining games so that he can get his knee strength back, and be ready for the playoffs. So what if we forfeit the 2 seed to Toronto?  We beat them there this year, we can do it again.  They are not invincible.

[mmmmm]

Funny.
We want bench Scoring When we give up 50 points in a qtr.. (The two guys people are talking about bringing on play ZERO Defense)
The bench was only outscored by two points in this game btw..

Silver lining

I think it was much needed for the young players on the bench. They were not connected on Defense last night, They were outhustled, outsmarted and outplayed and it's understandable (not just because they are young)... They get so many DNPs... Probably never in their wildest dreams did they think they would ALL get in a game at the time needing to help us win... (usually, when they get in the game it's defer and get the heck out of the way)

So, in my opinion, this was good for the team and a good weapon for Brad. Now the kids Know that their number can truly be called and it might not be with the J's or Gordon or Kemba on the court...  And they now know how embarrassing it can be when you play the way that they played...

This bodes well because I do think those guys can play with more effort and discipline.
We need them to.

This is a good point.   Once Jaylen was gone, I know I was looking for Carsen and/or Romeo to be more aggressive and start launching more shots.   Those two guys ultimately have to become more aggressive scorers to fill their projected roles in the NBA.   

[Spicoli]

Unreal that Steven's waived the white flag on this game because of a back to back. He should've made them play the OT. You don't give away games. I keep telling folks Stevens doesn't have killer instinct. This game should be over and it's not just Smarts fault.

Stop saving timeouts when teams go on runs. Worry about the timeouts later..he doesn't know when to stop a run

Bingo! Stevens is a decent coach but i would be absolutely SHOCKED if he lead this team to a title. He has literally no killer instinct whatsoever. No feel for the game or what's happening in the game. Levert didn't see hardly any double teams which is absolutely insane when a guy is that hot. Any normal coach would force the ball out of his hands in that situation similar to how the Lakers forced the ball out of Tatums hands just last week. If the Lakers kept playing Tatum straight up they would have lost. Stevens just never learns. He's going to get us bounced in the playoffs with his stubbornness i can feel it.

[angryguy77]

I was supremely disappointed by the finish of last night's game, but really, not sure what to expect with so many guys hurt.

Silver lining: Rob Williams played great when it counted. After a shaky start, he played very well, just makes us feel bigger, and quicker.  Will help Theis if he can get some rest too. Guy has been playing a lot of minutes this season. Want him to be rested for the playoffs.

Let's focus on getting healthy for our playoff run. If we lose to the Cavs tonight because we are missing 4 of our top 5 guys, not the end of the world.

Frankly, I wish we would just rest Kemba for most of the remaining games so that he can get his knee strength back, and be ready for the playoffs. So what if we forfeit the 2 seed to Toronto?  We beat them there this year, we can do it again.  They are not invincible.

The nets are a bottom feeding team w/o Irving and KD. Injuries are no excuse.
The celtics collapsed yet again because they went cold and couldn't find a bucket.

[mmmmm]

I was supremely disappointed by the finish of last night's game, but really, not sure what to expect with so many guys hurt.

Silver lining: Rob Williams played great when it counted. After a shaky start, he played very well, just makes us feel bigger, and quicker.  Will help Theis if he can get some rest too. Guy has been playing a lot of minutes this season. Want him to be rested for the playoffs.

Let's focus on getting healthy for our playoff run. If we lose to the Cavs tonight because we are missing 4 of our top 5 guys, not the end of the world.

Frankly, I wish we would just rest Kemba for most of the remaining games so that he can get his knee strength back, and be ready for the playoffs. So what if we forfeit the 2 seed to Toronto?  We beat them there this year, we can do it again.  They are not invincible.

The nets are a bottom feeding team w/o Irving and KD. Injuries are no excuse.
The celtics collapsed yet again because they went cold and couldn't find a bucket.

Shocking fact:  If we did not have Kemba, Gordon, Jaylen, Jayson and Marcus, we would be worse than a bottom feeding team.

That's not an excuse.  That's a reality.

And it's a reality that would be true of any team in the NBA.

[jambr380]

I was supremely disappointed by the finish of last night's game, but really, not sure what to expect with so many guys hurt.

Silver lining: Rob Williams played great when it counted. After a shaky start, he played very well, just makes us feel bigger, and quicker.  Will help Theis if he can get some rest too. Guy has been playing a lot of minutes this season. Want him to be rested for the playoffs.

Let's focus on getting healthy for our playoff run. If we lose to the Cavs tonight because we are missing 4 of our top 5 guys, not the end of the world.

Frankly, I wish we would just rest Kemba for most of the remaining games so that he can get his knee strength back, and be ready for the playoffs. So what if we forfeit the 2 seed to Toronto?  We beat them there this year, we can do it again.  They are not invincible.

The nets are a bottom feeding team w/o Irving and KD. Injuries are no excuse.
The celtics collapsed yet again because they went cold and couldn't find a bucket.

Shocking fact:  If we did not have Kemba, Gordon, Jaylen, Jayson and Marcus, we would be worse than a bottom feeding team.

That's not an excuse.  That's a reality.

And it's a reality that would be true of any team in the NBA.

Absolutely...but that doesn't change the fact that we had a 5 point lead with 10 seconds left in the game or a 13 point lead with 4 minutes left in the game. It's not just that we didn't have our best players, we just played so undisciplined down the stretch and the Nets were inexplicably able to tie the game and then destroy us in OT...something that everybody saw coming with the Summer League line-up we had out there.

[GreenRunsDeep33]

Unreal that Steven's waived the white flag on this game because of a back to back. He should've made them play the OT. You don't give away games. I keep telling folks Stevens doesn't have killer instinct. This game should be over and it's not just Smarts fault.

Stop saving timeouts when teams go on runs. Worry about the timeouts later..he doesn't know when to stop a run

Bingo! Stevens is a decent coach but i would be absolutely SHOCKED if he lead this team to a title. He has literally no killer instinct whatsoever. No feel for the game or what's happening in the game. Levert didn't see hardly any double teams which is absolutely insane when a guy is that hot. Any normal coach would force the ball out of his hands in that situation similar to how the Lakers forced the ball out of Tatums hands just last week. If the Lakers kept playing Tatum straight up they would have lost. Stevens just never learns. He's going to get us bounced in the playoffs with his stubbornness i can feel it.

This is what I've been saying. Some games your talent needs to take over down the stretch and sometimes the coaching has to reveal itself down the stretch with strategic moves. Stevens cant always be in teaching mode...sometimes you just need to win. If he won tonight, it would be coaching with all the core players that are out.

We cant keep waiting on the other team to make a mistake. Challenge more calls, get more techs, call more timely TOs, make better substitutions, feed the hot hand, take guys out when they are jacking bad shots. All of that is coaching

[ozgod]

No more credit for Hayward. Should be on the block

Pretty sure he wasn't around for the collapse, unless you want to trade him for getting injured?

[CelticsPoetry]

No more credit for Hayward. Should be on the block

Pretty sure he wasn't around for the collapse, unless you want to trade him for getting injured?

Dont you know the narrative here? How dare he get injured, he's on a max contract!!??