Author Topic: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything  (Read 7792 times)

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Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #120 on: September 15, 2019, 01:57:00 AM »

Offline Somebody

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Fierce1 with a load of cobwobble lol. Brown and Rozier were the only guys clutch enough to show up with monster games in game 6, which could've sent us to the finals if other guys bothered to show up. Being clutch isn't only making timely plays when your team is down in the trenches, it can also be making timely plays when your foot is on the opposing team's throat to close out a series. Brown is far better than a complementary player like Smart, the disrespect levelled at him in this forum is real lol.
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Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #121 on: September 15, 2019, 09:49:26 AM »

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The only thing that Bradley Beal does better than Brown is shoot and score. But then again, Beal has been given the #1 or #2 scoring role since being in the league. Brown did that for 1 year at age 21.

Here is a look at both players' first three seasons. Not a huge difference when you iron out the minutes in per36 numbers.

https://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.fcgi?request=1&sum=1&player_id1_hint=Jaylen+Brown&player_id1_select=Jaylen+Brown&y1=2019&player_id1=brownja02&idx=players&player_id2_hint=Bradley+Beal&player_id2_select=Bradley+Beal&y2=2015&player_id2=bealbr01&idx=players

It took 3 more years for Beal to become an All-Star after his third year in the league where he put up numbers of 15.6/3.8/3.1. In hindsight, if Washington gave up on Beal after three seasons, like some want the Celtics to do to Brown, it would have been a huge mistake, much like this scenario would be.

Apparently Beal was able to develop but Brown shouldn't be given that opportunity because Kemba Walker is 29. Listen, this team is not in win mode now because Danny signed Kemba. They are on the way to win now mode but they are more in "let's win while developing youth mode." Clearly if Danny had this team in win mode the bench wouldn't consist of so many inexperienced players looking to develop. Besides 4th year Brown and 3rd year Tatum, this team has:

RWilliams little used 2nd year player.
Edwards rookie
Langford rookie
GWilliams rookie
Poirier rookie
Fall rookie
Green rookie
Strus two way rookie
Waters two way rookie
Wanamaker little used 2nd year player
Theis 3rd year

This is not the bench of a team trying to win now. It just ain't. If Ainge wanted to win now the roster would have been filled with role playing vets, not inexperience rookies and 2nd year players.

As for trading for Love. He is 31 years old and signed for the next 4 years at $30 million. I would rather pay Jaylen Brown $120 million over the next 4 years than Love. I would expect that Jaylen at 23 will be a better player than Love over the next 4 years. Love is already showing major signs of having a diminishing return on that contract.

I have no problem trading Brown or Tatum for that matter. But it has to be for someone significant, not meh former All-Stars. Brown or Tatum or Hayward could become meh All-Stars. What the team needs is a real superstar, and there just isn't one on the market. So, in the absence of an available superstar, you keep and develop Tatum and Brown hoping, at the least, they become meh All-Stars, but at the most, develop into difference making superstars.


« Last Edit: September 15, 2019, 10:01:44 AM by nickagneta »

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #122 on: September 15, 2019, 10:07:39 AM »

Offline Donoghus

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Trading Smart & Brown for Bradley Beal is not gonna to put this team over the top. 

I certainly don't think there should be a rush to see Jaylen out of town.


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Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #123 on: September 15, 2019, 10:24:57 AM »

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Trading Smart & Brown for Bradley Beal is not gonna to put this team over the top. 

I certainly don't think there should be a rush to see Jaylen out of town.
Yeah, I said the same thing awhile back. Beal for Brown and Smart, due to the fact you are killing your defense on the perimeter, would be a net negative for this team, IMO.

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #124 on: September 15, 2019, 12:55:05 PM »

Offline Fierce1

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Fierce1 with a load of cobwobble lol. Brown and Rozier were the only guys clutch enough to show up with monster games in game 6, which could've sent us to the finals if other guys bothered to show up. Being clutch isn't only making timely plays when your team is down in the trenches, it can also be making timely plays when your foot is on the opposing team's throat to close out a series. Brown is far better than a complementary player like Smart, the disrespect levelled at him in this forum is real lol.

It's a good thing the season starts next month.

Rozier and Brown showed up in Game 6 when the game was not close.
Game 7 was a close game and Rozier and Brown failed to deliver.

Rozier's already gone.

Will Brown remain with the Celts for 30m per year?

I don't think so.

So let's wait and see.

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #125 on: September 15, 2019, 01:00:46 PM »

Offline Fierce1

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Last season we rarely saw Smart and Brown on the court at the same time in the last 5 minutes of a game.

That could change this season.

But if Brad goes with 1 big and 4 other players in the last 5 minutes, it's going to be Kemba, Smart, Hayward, Tatum, and a big man.

Once again Brown will be sitting and watching.

From Brad's substitution pattern last season, Smart was always in the game in the last 5 minutes.

Only time Brown got to play in the last 5 minutes of the game was when Smart was injured and was absent for 7 games in the playoffs.

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #126 on: September 15, 2019, 02:05:10 PM »

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Fierce1 with a load of cobwobble lol. Brown and Rozier were the only guys clutch enough to show up with monster games in game 6, which could've sent us to the finals if other guys bothered to show up. Being clutch isn't only making timely plays when your team is down in the trenches, it can also be making timely plays when your foot is on the opposing team's throat to close out a series. Brown is far better than a complementary player like Smart, the disrespect levelled at him in this forum is real lol.

It's a good thing the season starts next month.

Rozier and Brown showed up in Game 6 when the game was not close.
Game 7 was a close game and Rozier and Brown failed to deliver.

Rozier's already gone.

Will Brown remain with the Celts for 30m per year?

I don't think so.

So let's wait and see.
Oh for sure, I'm excited to see Brown spread his wings assuming that Stevens will take away the yoke on him (a short leash is an understatement for how little tolerance Stevens had for Brown last season) and give him the opportunity he deserves. And game 6 wasn't close because everyone else "failed to deliver" when winning it could've saved us from the danger of playing in a winner take all game 7, not because Brown and Rozier "fail to deliver in clutch moments". It could be because of my tennis background, but I always value players who step up to nip a game in the bud (or at least attempt to since basketball is a team sport that requires your entire team to outperform the opposition) when they have the opportunity more than players who fail to kill the match early and barely scrape by in the last possible moment with "the clutch gene". And I absolutely think that Brown will be staying here on that 30 million contract if the front office doesn't go full OKC and trade him away for a pu pu platter.
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Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #127 on: September 15, 2019, 02:07:04 PM »

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Last season we rarely saw Smart and Brown on the court at the same time in the last 5 minutes of a game.

That could change this season.

But if Brad goes with 1 big and 4 other players in the last 5 minutes, it's going to be Kemba, Smart, Hayward, Tatum, and a big man.

Once again Brown will be sitting and watching.

From Brad's substitution pattern last season, Smart was always in the game in the last 5 minutes.

Only time Brown got to play in the last 5 minutes of the game was when Smart was injured and was absent for 7 games in the playoffs.
And he made Stevens look like an absolute fool for not doing so earlier. Playing Smart over Brown in general is a foolish move unless there's a very specific matchup you want to combat by putting Smart out there.
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Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #128 on: September 15, 2019, 02:12:58 PM »

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I want to see the lineup stats for the Celtics in the last 5 minutes of a game. I seriously doubt Brown barely played in those minutes last year.

EDIT: 82games.com states Brown played in 41% of the available minutes to him in clutch situations last year which is last 5 minutes of the 4th quarter or overtime, neither team ahead by more than 5. That doesn't sound like barely playing the last 5 minutes of a game to me, especially since Brown played 48% of minutes available to him last year.
« Last Edit: September 15, 2019, 02:57:25 PM by nickagneta »

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #129 on: September 16, 2019, 02:40:09 AM »

Offline Fierce1

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Last season we rarely saw Smart and Brown on the court at the same time in the last 5 minutes of a game.

That could change this season.

But if Brad goes with 1 big and 4 other players in the last 5 minutes, it's going to be Kemba, Smart, Hayward, Tatum, and a big man.

Once again Brown will be sitting and watching.

From Brad's substitution pattern last season, Smart was always in the game in the last 5 minutes.

Only time Brown got to play in the last 5 minutes of the game was when Smart was injured and was absent for 7 games in the playoffs.
And he made Stevens look like an absolute fool for not doing so earlier. Playing Smart over Brown in general is a foolish move unless there's a very specific matchup you want to combat by putting Smart out there.

I can't disagree with you on that.

You are correct, even I would play Brown over Smart because Brown is better on offense.

The problem is none of here are coaching the Celts, it's Brad Stevens!

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #130 on: September 16, 2019, 02:46:26 AM »

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Last season we rarely saw Smart and Brown on the court at the same time in the last 5 minutes of a game.

That could change this season.

But if Brad goes with 1 big and 4 other players in the last 5 minutes, it's going to be Kemba, Smart, Hayward, Tatum, and a big man.

Once again Brown will be sitting and watching.

From Brad's substitution pattern last season, Smart was always in the game in the last 5 minutes.

Only time Brown got to play in the last 5 minutes of the game was when Smart was injured and was absent for 7 games in the playoffs.
And he made Stevens look like an absolute fool for not doing so earlier. Playing Smart over Brown in general is a foolish move unless there's a very specific matchup you want to combat by putting Smart out there.

I can't disagree with you on that.

You are correct, even I would play Brown over Smart because Brown is better on offense.

The problem is none of here are coaching the Celts, it's Brad Stevens!
Then Brad needs to adapt, we shouldn't trade or let go of our best assets just because the coach doesn't know how to utilise them.
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Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #131 on: September 16, 2019, 03:08:47 AM »

Offline Fierce1

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Last season we rarely saw Smart and Brown on the court at the same time in the last 5 minutes of a game.

That could change this season.

But if Brad goes with 1 big and 4 other players in the last 5 minutes, it's going to be Kemba, Smart, Hayward, Tatum, and a big man.

Once again Brown will be sitting and watching.

From Brad's substitution pattern last season, Smart was always in the game in the last 5 minutes.

Only time Brown got to play in the last 5 minutes of the game was when Smart was injured and was absent for 7 games in the playoffs.
And he made Stevens look like an absolute fool for not doing so earlier. Playing Smart over Brown in general is a foolish move unless there's a very specific matchup you want to combat by putting Smart out there.

I can't disagree with you on that.

You are correct, even I would play Brown over Smart because Brown is better on offense.

The problem is none of here are coaching the Celts, it's Brad Stevens!
Then Brad needs to adapt, we shouldn't trade or let go of our best assets just because the coach doesn't know how to utilise them.

I also agree with you on that.

But the problem is Ainge wants Brad to be happy, in an article I read not so long ago, and Brad will be happy if Gordon Hayward is happy.

It's human nature.
Hayward is Brad's boy.
It is what it is.

Popovich played Brown at the 4 and 5 and Brown was effective.
Will Brad do that this season?
We'll know in a little over a month, when the season starts.

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #132 on: September 16, 2019, 03:17:04 AM »

Offline Fierce1

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I want to see the lineup stats for the Celtics in the last 5 minutes of a game. I seriously doubt Brown barely played in those minutes last year.

EDIT: 82games.com states Brown played in 41% of the available minutes to him in clutch situations last year which is last 5 minutes of the 4th quarter or overtime, neither team ahead by more than 5. That doesn't sound like barely playing the last 5 minutes of a game to me, especially since Brown played 48% of minutes available to him last year.

That stat doesn't tell the whole story because every Celtic fan who watched more than half the Celtic games last season never saw Brown in the last 5 minutes of the game when Hayward and Smart were playing.

Somebody posted that Brad is foolish for playing Smart over Brown in crunch time.
That confirms what I'm saying that Celtic fans rarely saw Brown in the last 5 minutes of the game last season.

Also, Brown was averaging 30.7 minutes per game in 2017-18, when Hayward was absent.
Last season Brown was only averaging 25.9 minutes per game.
Brown's minutes dropped by 4.8 minutes from 2018 to 2019.
So it's very clear that Brown doesn't usually play in the last 5 minutes of the game last season.

After losing his starting job to Smart, Brown usually plays after 5 or 7 minutes of the 1st qtr has passed.
Brown stays in early in the 2nd qtr. and sits when there's 7 or 5 minutes left before the half ends.
Same thing happens in the 3rd and 4th qtrs.
If Brown was playing a lot in the clutch, I'm sure he'll get the same 30 minutes per game or close to 30 minutes per game like what he got in 2017-18.


Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #133 on: September 16, 2019, 03:23:53 AM »

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Fierce1 with a load of cobwobble lol. Brown and Rozier were the only guys clutch enough to show up with monster games in game 6, which could've sent us to the finals if other guys bothered to show up. Being clutch isn't only making timely plays when your team is down in the trenches, it can also be making timely plays when your foot is on the opposing team's throat to close out a series. Brown is far better than a complementary player like Smart, the disrespect levelled at him in this forum is real lol.

It's a good thing the season starts next month.

Rozier and Brown showed up in Game 6 when the game was not close.
Game 7 was a close game and Rozier and Brown failed to deliver.

Rozier's already gone.

Will Brown remain with the Celts for 30m per year?

I don't think so.

So let's wait and see.
Oh for sure, I'm excited to see Brown spread his wings assuming that Stevens will take away the yoke on him (a short leash is an understatement for how little tolerance Stevens had for Brown last season) and give him the opportunity he deserves. And game 6 wasn't close because everyone else "failed to deliver" when winning it could've saved us from the danger of playing in a winner take all game 7, not because Brown and Rozier "fail to deliver in clutch moments". It could be because of my tennis background, but I always value players who step up to nip a game in the bud (or at least attempt to since basketball is a team sport that requires your entire team to outperform the opposition) when they have the opportunity more than players who fail to kill the match early and barely scrape by in the last possible moment with "the clutch gene". And I absolutely think that Brown will be staying here on that 30 million contract if the front office doesn't go full OKC and trade him away for a pu pu platter.

I don't know about tennis but in the NBA, not basketball in general, the clutch game enables the NBA to earn more money.

The NBA is a business first and a sport second.
That's why this year's Team USA was shocked at how physical the FIBA game is.
In the NBA, there are superstar calls, refs usually protect the star players.
That doesn't happen in international basketball.

Game 7 is where legends are made and millions of dollars are earned.

Re: What can Brown do for Team USA? Just about everything
« Reply #134 on: September 16, 2019, 03:44:08 AM »

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Fierce1 with a load of cobwobble lol. Brown and Rozier were the only guys clutch enough to show up with monster games in game 6, which could've sent us to the finals if other guys bothered to show up. Being clutch isn't only making timely plays when your team is down in the trenches, it can also be making timely plays when your foot is on the opposing team's throat to close out a series. Brown is far better than a complementary player like Smart, the disrespect levelled at him in this forum is real lol.

It's a good thing the season starts next month.

Rozier and Brown showed up in Game 6 when the game was not close.
Game 7 was a close game and Rozier and Brown failed to deliver.

Rozier's already gone.

Will Brown remain with the Celts for 30m per year?

I don't think so.

So let's wait and see.
Oh for sure, I'm excited to see Brown spread his wings assuming that Stevens will take away the yoke on him (a short leash is an understatement for how little tolerance Stevens had for Brown last season) and give him the opportunity he deserves. And game 6 wasn't close because everyone else "failed to deliver" when winning it could've saved us from the danger of playing in a winner take all game 7, not because Brown and Rozier "fail to deliver in clutch moments". It could be because of my tennis background, but I always value players who step up to nip a game in the bud (or at least attempt to since basketball is a team sport that requires your entire team to outperform the opposition) when they have the opportunity more than players who fail to kill the match early and barely scrape by in the last possible moment with "the clutch gene". And I absolutely think that Brown will be staying here on that 30 million contract if the front office doesn't go full OKC and trade him away for a pu pu platter.

I don't know about tennis but in the NBA, not basketball in general, the clutch game enables the NBA to earn more money.

The NBA is a business first and a sport second.
That's why this year's Team USA was shocked at how physical the FIBA game is.
In the NBA, there are superstar calls, refs usually protect the star players.
That doesn't happen in international basketball.

Game 7 is where legends are made and millions of dollars are earned.
Earning money has nothing to do with the "goodness" of a player though. Winning game 6s when you can close a series out, as far as I'm concerned, helps the team out and creates legends as well (how does Michael Jordan close out finals series?).
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