Could Horford end up being the worst contract of offseason?

[bdm860]

I like Al, have no ill will towards the man, wish him the best, I would have taken the money too, yada, yada, yada.

But it's kind of ironic that it seems like one of the reasons he left Boston was because of the dysfunction of last year's team, only to walk right into another dysfunctional team.  The parallels (thus far) are striking:

Boston played a super close 7 game series in the ECF in '18 and was everyone's favorite coming out of the East in '19...

Philly played a super close 7 game series that many act like was the ECF in '19, and were a lot of people's favorite coming out of the East in '20...

[fairweatherfan]

I like Al, have no ill will towards the man, wish him the best, I would have taken the money too, yada, yada, yada.

But it's kind of ironic that it seems like one of the reasons he left Boston was because of the dysfunction of last year's team, only to walk right into another dysfunctional team.  The parallels (thus far) are striking:

Boston played a super close 7 game series in the ECF in '18 and was everyone's favorite coming out of the East in '19...

Philly played a super close 7 game series that many act like was the ECF in '19, and were a lot of people's favorite coming out of the East in '20...

The twist at the end of last year's soap opera is that the real team killing villain was Al all along.

[Fafnir]

For all that people rave about his leadership by example we've definitely seen the limits of it lol.

I do enjoy the idea of Al secretly doing needful things like "pranks" and self destructing the Celtics and now the 76ers has me giggling I'm not going to lie.

"Terry you are so talented, keep your head up and keep shooting you will get yours in the end"

"Mook you're right Brown is being a little Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again."

"Kyrie I watched that entire youtube playlist you sent me and you're right, they aren't telling us everything."

 

[fairweatherfan]

For all that people rave about his leadership by example we've definitely seen the limits of it lol.

I do enjoy the idea of Al secretly doing needful things like "pranks" and self destructing the Celtics and now the 76ers has me giggling I'm not going to lie.

"Terry you are so talented, keep your head up and keep shooting you will get yours in the end"

"Mook you're right Brown is being a little Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again."

"Kyrie I watched that entire youtube playlist you sent me and you're right, they aren't telling us everything."

 

"Y'know Ben I'm a husband and a father, but I never feel more like a man than when I hit a 3"

"Toby, you've got your money, what are you worried about defense for?"

"Jayson this year Kyrie and I've got the 3 ball and paint covered. What we need from you is to dominate the midrange."

Secretly taking Kyrie's dreamcatcher and hiding it in Terry's locker.

[Donoghus]

Does part of the Process involve painting yourself into a corner with questionable contracts?

[celticsclay]

Average Al put up 6 pts

Father Time is really taking a toll

Same as Harris, though Al only took 5 shots in his 22 minutes, while Harris took 12 shots in his 25 minutes.

Philly fans on Liberty Ballers are really (and, in my mind, rightfully) turning on Harris, as well as turning on the FO for giving him that bonkers contract. He's been essentially the exact same player since his Orlando days

Yeah Harris is the much larger problem.  Al is overpaid, but he is also paid the 4th most on the team (accounting for Simmons max kicking in) and they always knew that he was likely their 5th offensive option with a fully healthy squad.  Even right now as a 4th option, he is a fairly typical 4th option i.e. some games where he gets going and some games where they don't use him much.  I mean Brook Lopez is Milwaukee's 4th option and Donte DiVincenzo or George Hill is their 5th option.  Al, even with all the negative pub, is still better than those guys.  He is paid too much for that role, but you sometimes have to overpay to land a guy as a free agent.  Similarly, the Lakers 4th and 5th options are Danny Green and KCP (or maybe even Bradley) and the Lakers 3rd option, Kuzma comes off the bench so he doesn't even share a lot of touches with the top guys.  The Clippers have 4 great scorers and then players like Landry Shamet, Patrick Beverley, etc.  No question Horford is overpaid, but his actual production is fairly typical for a guy that is a 4th or 5th option on offense i.e. basically 12/7/4

His production is actually quite bad because he is shooting 44% from field and 31% from three as a big man while often looking like a traffic cone on defense. You really picked the wrong hill to die on with Horford not being a problem.

[celticsclay]

Does part of the Process involve painting yourself into a corner with questionable contracts?

They are in full meltdown on libertyballers. Some are convinced brown could get fired if they get blown out by bucks. They are currently 8-10 in their last 18

[Surferdad]

Does part of the Process involve painting yourself into a corner with questionable contracts?

LOL, it wasn't supposed to be.  A Process takes time, and we thought their players were bought into that.  Then they go and do a LAL-style instant gratification move.

[Fafnir]

Does part of the Process involve painting yourself into a corner with questionable contracts?

LOL, it wasn't supposed to be.  A Process takes time, and we thought their players were bought into that.  Then they go and do a LAL-style instant gratification move.

I mean they're going all in to win right now.

That's exactly what a lot of people here wanted Danny to do last year. This is the downside.

Edit: Each time they've spent their war chest of picks and drafted players to mix up their team they've lost. Other than the Tatum deal they haven't been huge disasters, but the steady decline in options to make future moves and meh fits and players (given their contracts) is hurting them badly.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I thought Horford would be a great fit. He can stretch the floor, play defense, and he is a low-usage, low-maintenance player.

The problem is that Ben Simmons would be unstoppable with four shooters around him and Embiid would be better with a pick-and-roll point guard that can shoot outside.

A team of Simmons, Covington, Horford, Harris, and Jrue Holliday would be a much better team than one with Embiid. A team of Embiid, Covington, Jrue Holliday, Harris, and Horford would be a much better team than one with Simmons.

Talent doens't always win out.

[Donoghus]

Does part of the Process involve painting yourself into a corner with questionable contracts?

LOL, it wasn't supposed to be.  A Process takes time, and we thought their players were bought into that.  Then they go and do a LAL-style instant gratification move.

I mean they're going all in to win right now.

That's exactly what a lot of people here wanted Danny to do last year. This is the downside.

Yup.

[celticsclay]

Does part of the Process involve painting yourself into a corner with questionable contracts?

LOL, it wasn't supposed to be.  A Process takes time, and we thought their players were bought into that.  Then they go and do a LAL-style instant gratification move.

I mean they're going all in to win right now.

That's exactly what a lot of people here wanted Danny to do last year. This is the downside.

Yup.

I wonder what really happened with Butler in the offseason. Last night it seemed like Butler and Embid were talking a lot. Seemed like they really like each other (and probably have the same drive to win). Not sure if the issue was with Butler and Simmons or Butler and Brown.

[Moranis]

Average Al put up 6 pts

Father Time is really taking a toll

Same as Harris, though Al only took 5 shots in his 22 minutes, while Harris took 12 shots in his 25 minutes.

Philly fans on Liberty Ballers are really (and, in my mind, rightfully) turning on Harris, as well as turning on the FO for giving him that bonkers contract. He's been essentially the exact same player since his Orlando days

Yeah Harris is the much larger problem.  Al is overpaid, but he is also paid the 4th most on the team (accounting for Simmons max kicking in) and they always knew that he was likely their 5th offensive option with a fully healthy squad.  Even right now as a 4th option, he is a fairly typical 4th option i.e. some games where he gets going and some games where they don't use him much.  I mean Brook Lopez is Milwaukee's 4th option and Donte DiVincenzo or George Hill is their 5th option.  Al, even with all the negative pub, is still better than those guys.  He is paid too much for that role, but you sometimes have to overpay to land a guy as a free agent.  Similarly, the Lakers 4th and 5th options are Danny Green and KCP (or maybe even Bradley) and the Lakers 3rd option, Kuzma comes off the bench so he doesn't even share a lot of touches with the top guys.  The Clippers have 4 great scorers and then players like Landry Shamet, Patrick Beverley, etc.  No question Horford is overpaid, but his actual production is fairly typical for a guy that is a 4th or 5th option on offense i.e. basically 12/7/4

His production is actually quite bad because he is shooting 44% from field and 31% from three as a big man while often looking like a traffic cone on defense. You really picked the wrong hill to die on with Horford not being a problem.

He is actually 45% from the field and 32% from 3, still not good, but Brook Lopez 41.5% from the field 28.7% from 3.  Danny Green is 41.7% from the field (though 37.3% from 3).  Shamet and Beverley are both around 43% from the field (though both are solid from 3).  This notion that Horford isn't a fairly typical 5th option seems strange to me.  Now he isn't paid like a typical 5th option, that is a fair criticism, but his production is about what you would expect from a guy that far down the chart. 

[Fafnir]

Does part of the Process involve painting yourself into a corner with questionable contracts?

LOL, it wasn't supposed to be.  A Process takes time, and we thought their players were bought into that.  Then they go and do a LAL-style instant gratification move.

I mean they're going all in to win right now.

That's exactly what a lot of people here wanted Danny to do last year. This is the downside.

Yup.

I wonder what really happened with Butler in the offseason. Last night it seemed like Butler and Embid were talking a lot. Seemed like they really like each other (and probably have the same drive to win). Not sure if the issue was with Butler and Simmons or Butler and Brown.

If you read the tea leaves from Jimmy's interview and anonymous sources it was Butler vs. Simmons/Brown

Butler didn't like Brown, not sure the details of that. Meanwhile Simmons wanted to have the ball and so did Jimmy and their personalities clashed. Also at this point Simmons hadn't extended so he and his agent (Rich Paul) were likely making noise that 76ers need to commit to Simmons at PG.

[GreenFaith1819]

Some 76er fans roasting Al, lol......he's only a SMALL part of their issues.

I miss Al but he chose his bed to lay in.