Author Topic: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor  (Read 1274 times)

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Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« on: May 16, 2019, 02:03:32 AM »

Offline Never Nervous Pervis

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Key takeaways from Milwaukee and Toronto's success as we prepare for the draft.

1. Your best player should be a long, versatile wing/swing who can not only get into the lane and create their own shot, but who is a lock-down defender at multiple positions.

2. You can find superstars in the middle of the first round (Kawhi and Giannis were both taken 15). Secondary stars can be found late (Middleton at 39 and Siakam at 27). Keep that in mind as we draft 14, 20 & 22.

3. You can easily acquire #3 guys (Lowry/Ibaka and Bledsoe) for a future first.

4. It usually takes one coach to get you close, and then a fresh voice to get you over the top. (I hate saying that, because I like Brad.)

5. You need rosters that are not only deep, but well-balanced. And you need vets on your bench who understand their roles and complement your starters.

« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 02:10:36 AM by Never Nervous Pervis »

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2019, 02:39:12 AM »

Offline bopna

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Key takeaways from Milwaukee and Toronto's success as we prepare for the draft.

1. Your best player should be a long, versatile wing/swing who can not only get into the lane and create their own shot, but who is a lock-down defender at multiple positions.

2. You can find superstars in the middle of the first round (Kawhi and Giannis were both taken 15). Secondary stars can be found late (Middleton at 39 and Siakam at 27). Keep that in mind as we draft 14, 20 & 22.

3. You can easily acquire #3 guys (Lowry/Ibaka and Bledsoe) for a future first.

4. It usually takes one coach to get you close, and then a fresh voice to get you over the top. (I hate saying that, because I like Brad.)

5. You need rosters that are not only deep, but well-balanced. And you need vets on your bench who understand their roles and complement your starters.

We do have that versatile wing.. Hayward is as versatile as you could want him to be.. We just didn't have the Utah version this playoffs but if we had, It would not have been a drubbing from the hands of the Bucks..

Here is to hoping GH is going to NOT suck next season and playing along side AD.

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2019, 03:34:16 AM »

Offline mr. dee

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It's always been that way since the start of the decade. But you can still win with just an all-star 2-way wing, even if its he's not an MVP material. It's one thing to draft a superstar, it's another one to develop them. Would Giannis or Kawhi develop into a superstar in different teams?

Just look at the teams that have won the championship since 2010:

2011 Mavs = Shawn Marion
2012 Heat = Lebron James
2013 Heat = Lebron James
2014 Spurs = Kawhi Leonard
2015 Warriors = Andre Iguodala
2016 Cavs = Lebron James
2017 Warriors = Kevin Durant
2018 Warriors = Kevin Durant

Championship teams always have enough fit and balance on their talent depth. We have many players who are supposedly versatile but doesn't specialize enough in one certain area we badly need. Our 2008 team won the trophy because Doc was able to adjust using the bench who provided different skillset on certain matchups.

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2019, 04:51:05 AM »

Offline LilRip

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How about this lesson: vets win. Young players don’t. Guys like Tatum are still more than a couple of seasons away. Giannis needed a few years and even then, he’s still just about to come into his own in the playoffs.
- LilRip

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2019, 05:19:11 AM »

Online Celtics4ever

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The main thing they did was go all in to win it    DA took a more passive wait for Davis, route and it hurt us.

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2019, 06:56:03 AM »

Offline Somebody

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Another lesson is not only look for skill, but skill with size. Toronto and Milwaukee all have pretty big frontcourts that are skilled, and we really only have Horford that fits the bill.

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #6 on: May 16, 2019, 06:56:43 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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The main thing they did was go all in to win it    DA took a more passive wait for Davis, route and it hurt us.

bingo

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #7 on: May 16, 2019, 06:58:43 AM »

Offline SHAQATTACK

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Another lesson is not only look for skill, but skill with size. Toronto and Milwaukee all have pretty big frontcourts that are skilled, and we really only have Horford that fits the bill.

this has been our weakness since losing KG and Perk .  Lack of young skilled bigs .  drafting turrible

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #8 on: May 16, 2019, 07:41:10 AM »

Offline CelticsPoetry

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The main thing they did was go all in to win it    DA took a more passive wait for Davis, route and it hurt us.
You know he couldnt do that because of the Rose rule

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #9 on: May 16, 2019, 07:45:30 AM »

Offline Birdman

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I remember when Lopez was a free agent..i wanted him and posted that. ppl laugh and said no way..29 points last nighht and would fit great on Celtics this year..oh well
C/PF-Horford, Baynes, Noel, Theis, Morris,
SF/SG- Tatum, Brown, Hayward, Smart, Semi, Clark
PG- Irving, Rozier, Larkin

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #10 on: May 16, 2019, 11:17:29 AM »

Offline PhoSita

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1 - Combining a guy who is elite at creating and finishing shots inside / getting to the free throw line with a bunch of tall shooters is a great recipe for a potent offense

2 - Stacking together a bunch of guys with really long arms and getting them to buy into a team defensive system that prioritizes preventing any decent looks near the basket is a great recipe for a strong defense
You’ll have to excuse my lengthiness—the reason I dread writing letters is because I am so apt to get to slinging wisdom & forget to let up. Thus much precious time is lost.
- Mark Twain

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #11 on: May 16, 2019, 11:54:38 AM »

Offline Moranis

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You need a legit MVP candidate, and it helps a great deal if that MVP candidate is elite on both ends of the floor.  Of course you have always needed that from the dawn of the NBA.  That is why I never put much stock in Boston this year.  I expected a better regular season given the depth on the team, but never expected Boston to be a real threat to win the title. 

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #12 on: May 16, 2019, 12:07:04 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Key takeaways from Milwaukee and Toronto's success as we prepare for the draft.

1. Your best player should be a long, versatile wing/swing who can not only get into the lane and create their own shot, but who is a lock-down defender at multiple positions.

2. You can find superstars in the middle of the first round (Kawhi and Giannis were both taken 15). Secondary stars can be found late (Middleton at 39 and Siakam at 27). Keep that in mind as we draft 14, 20 & 22.

3. You can easily acquire #3 guys l) for a future first.

4. It usually takes one coach to get you close, and then a fresh voice to get you over the top. (I hate saying that, because I like Brad.)

5. You need rosters that are not only deep, but well-balanced. And you need vets on your bench who understand their roles and complement your starters.

Quote
1. Your best player should be a long, versatile wing/swing who can not only get into the lane and create their own shot, but who is a lock-down defender at multiple positions. 
Don't agree with this. If you get a generational talent at another position you can easily build a championship team around them. Tim Duncan and Steph Curry prove that. Not only were title teams built around them but dynasties were built around them.

Quote
2. You can find superstars in the middle of the first round (Kawhi and Giannis were both taken 15). Secondary stars can be found late (Middleton at 39 and Siakam at 27). Keep that in mind as we draft 14, 20 & 22.
You can! But it should never be expected and you shouldn't expect that you can find one every year. The most likely outcome of players in the mid to late first is bench role player to bust.

Quote
3. You can easily acquire #3 guys for a future first.
Very true.

Quote
4. It usually takes one coach to get you close, and then a fresh voice to get you over the top. (I hate saying that, because I like Brad.)
Not true. Doc, Pops, Carlysle, Spoelstra, we're all there during the build up and then we're there for the titles.

Quote
5. You need rosters that are not only deep, but well-balanced. And you need vets on your bench who understand their roles and complement your starters.
Spot on!!! Absolutely true though every once and a while young guys learn they need to play their role from the start and do. Like Leon Powe. Malcolm Brogdon. Marcus Smart(though it took until his 5th year to realize he needed to shoot less threes).


Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #13 on: May 16, 2019, 12:35:03 PM »

Offline Walker Wiggle

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 Deleted

Re: Lessons we can learn from Mil & Tor
« Reply #14 on: May 16, 2019, 12:48:32 PM »

Offline Walker Wiggle

  • Marcus Smart
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At the risk of sounding like a broken record, those two clubs (and PHI) expended valuable assets to compete this season. The Celtics did not.

Toronto:
- Traded for a mega star who may very well leave after this season.
- Traded a 26-year-old Valanciunas for a 34 year-old Gasol who will make $25m next year.

Milwaukee:
- Traded 22-year-old Thon Maker for Mirotic, who will be a FA this summer.
- Brogdon, Lopez, and Middleton are all FAs this summer.

Philly:
- Traded away Fultz for basically nothing.
- Traded away a bunch of stuff, including Landry Shamet and two future 1sts, for Tobias Harris.
- Traded Covington and Saric for Butler.

Philly of course is on vacation, just like the Celtics. 538 says Milwaukee has a 22% of winning it all this year, and Toronto has a 13% chance. (GSW is at 64%.)

Should Ainge have gone all in for this year, with GSW (and Rockets and others) lurking in the West, and knowing that those other three teams in the East will have a tough time keeping their rosters together beyond this summer?

It stinks and all, but I understand Ainge and company's thought process as it related to this season.

Lastly: The real lesson from Milwaukee and Toronto this year? Have a top-five player.

 

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