Author Topic: BOSTON GLOBE: Brad Stevens needs to make some changes in his approach  (Read 2433 times)

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Offline RJ87

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https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2019/05/11/brad-stevens-needs-make-some-changes-his-approach/82LNh1GhYrEBIHwnOdP08O/story.html

Some interesting tidbits:
Quote
It wasnít that the coaching staff was unaware of these issues, according to team sources; it was that they really didnít know what to do about it.

Quote
Stevens, who has allowed the players to police themselves in the past, swooped in too late to solve the issues. Some players blamed him for integrating Hayward into the starting lineup without giving more regard to the feelings of Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum.

Quote
Stevens has loaded his staff in past years with Butler disciples, young coaches skilled in analytics but not necessarily how to handle millennial NBA players.

I think most Cs fans (including myself) agree that putting Hayward in the starting lineup right way was a big mistake.

Anyone could see that was an issue - especially since Gordon wasn't ready. It reminds me of a Jackie Mac piece from earlier in the season where she said multiple players were unhappy with Gordon taking minutes from them when he was playing badly.

For me, it comes back to Stevens not clearly defining roles.
The thing is most of you guys here were screaming "HURR DURR 30 MILLION BENCH PLAYER" when a few others including me advocated for Hayward to come off the bench. It was very obvious that Hayward likely wouldn't be ready, and that letting him round into form off the bench with low pressure and expectations would be the better option.

Did you give yourself a gold star? You should. At least a pat on the back.

I (and many others) wasn't privy to the inner workings of the team. I was still under the impression that our infrastructure was among the best in the league and that our coaches had players on the same page with clearly defined roles that they were willing and ready to play. I was wrong. If I had known that Brad would basically just throw a basketball into the middle of the court and have them fight to the death while he rewatched footage of Butler's NCAA run, I might have some different opinions.
Indiana Pacers
PG: D.Russell, P.Mills, A.Holiday, E.Simner
SG: V.Oladipo, C.Joseph, S.Hicks, D. Reed
SF: D. McDermott, A.Crabbe
PF: T. Young, T. Leaf, K. O'Quinn
C: M. Turner, D. Sabonis
PICKS: https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Indiana-Pacers/11/Rosters/Regular

Offline Somebody

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https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2019/05/11/brad-stevens-needs-make-some-changes-his-approach/82LNh1GhYrEBIHwnOdP08O/story.html

Some interesting tidbits:
Quote
It wasn’t that the coaching staff was unaware of these issues, according to team sources; it was that they really didn’t know what to do about it.

Quote
Stevens, who has allowed the players to police themselves in the past, swooped in too late to solve the issues. Some players blamed him for integrating Hayward into the starting lineup without giving more regard to the feelings of Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum.

Quote
Stevens has loaded his staff in past years with Butler disciples, young coaches skilled in analytics but not necessarily how to handle millennial NBA players.

I think most Cs fans (including myself) agree that putting Hayward in the starting lineup right way was a big mistake.

Anyone could see that was an issue - especially since Gordon wasn't ready. It reminds me of a Jackie Mac piece from earlier in the season where she said multiple players were unhappy with Gordon taking minutes from them when he was playing badly.

For me, it comes back to Stevens not clearly defining roles.
The thing is most of you guys here were screaming "HURR DURR 30 MILLION BENCH PLAYER" when a few others including me advocated for Hayward to come off the bench. It was very obvious that Hayward likely wouldn't be ready, and that letting him round into form off the bench with low pressure and expectations would be the better option.
Did you give yourself a gold star? You should. At least a pat on the back.

I (and many others) wasn't privy to the inner workings of the team. I was still under the impression that our infrastructure was among the best in the league and that our coaches had players on the same page with clearly defined roles that they were willing and ready to play. I was wrong. If I had known that Brad would basically just throw a basketball into the middle of the court and have them fight to the death while he rewatched footage of Butler's NCAA run, I might have some different opinions.
Quite the way to respond when you were wrong, give yourself a pat on the back, and stick a gold star on your forehead while you're at it! And even without knowing the inner workings of the team, it's obvious that inserting a player who had a horrific injury back into the starting lineup in front of players who played their butts off in the biggest stage of basketball wouldn't be good for "clearly defined roles", and certainly would affect the players being "willing and ready to play".

Offline Scintan

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This team had problems in player acquisition. 
This team had coaching problems. 
This team had system and/or system fit problems. 
This team had rotation problems. 
This team had player attitude problems. 
This team had player talent and/or play level problems. 

And, because of a number of factors, many of which we may never learn the whole of, none of the above was adequately addressed.  All of this was obvious to most.  It was only the greenest of the green who couldn't see it.


When people are free to do as they please, they usually imitate each other.

Offline moiso

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Yes, Stevens started Hayward before he was ready.  But it seems strange that we are focusing on that right now.  That was so long ago and Stevens corrected that mistake.  The team had months to get over that.  We had every chance to right the ship by playoff time.  Starting Hayward was a factor in the team's psyche early on, but it was so long ago that it seems kind of irrelevant now.  It's old news.  Hayward was coming off the bench and looked healthy at the end of the season and the team still played like crap. 

Offline MaxAMillion

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Well this canít be...Kyrie was the problem with this team. Hayward and Stevens are never the issue. I canít wait to hear the excuses when Hayward doesnít live up to his contract again next year. I am sure Tatum and Brown will be responsible.

Offline jambr380

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Yes, Stevens started Hayward before he was ready.  But it seems strange that we are focusing on that right now.  That was so long ago and Stevens corrected that mistake.  The team had months to get over that.  We had every chance to right the ship by playoff time.  Starting Hayward was a factor in the team's psyche early on, but it was so long ago that it seems kind of irrelevant now.  It's old news.  Hayward was coming off the bench and looked healthy at the end of the season and the team still played like crap.

Yeah, tp. People need to get over the 'Brad started Hayward too early' argument. Sure, it may be true, but lots of teams have at least one starter who isn't worthy of starting and they play just fine. Kyrie, Horford, Tatum, and Brown should have been able to make up for it and it's not like we didn't have [what we thought were] quality subs able to come in and make a difference.

While Brad isn't completely free of blame, I feel much of this year was beyond his control and believe he will learn from this. I think all of us are looking forward to major changes this offseason.

Offline RJ87

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https://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/celtics/2019/05/11/brad-stevens-needs-make-some-changes-his-approach/82LNh1GhYrEBIHwnOdP08O/story.html

Some interesting tidbits:
Quote
It wasnít that the coaching staff was unaware of these issues, according to team sources; it was that they really didnít know what to do about it.

Quote
Stevens, who has allowed the players to police themselves in the past, swooped in too late to solve the issues. Some players blamed him for integrating Hayward into the starting lineup without giving more regard to the feelings of Jaylen Brown and Jayson Tatum.

Quote
Stevens has loaded his staff in past years with Butler disciples, young coaches skilled in analytics but not necessarily how to handle millennial NBA players.

I think most Cs fans (including myself) agree that putting Hayward in the starting lineup right way was a big mistake.

Anyone could see that was an issue - especially since Gordon wasn't ready. It reminds me of a Jackie Mac piece from earlier in the season where she said multiple players were unhappy with Gordon taking minutes from them when he was playing badly.

For me, it comes back to Stevens not clearly defining roles.
The thing is most of you guys here were screaming "HURR DURR 30 MILLION BENCH PLAYER" when a few others including me advocated for Hayward to come off the bench. It was very obvious that Hayward likely wouldn't be ready, and that letting him round into form off the bench with low pressure and expectations would be the better option.
Did you give yourself a gold star? You should. At least a pat on the back.

I (and many others) wasn't privy to the inner workings of the team. I was still under the impression that our infrastructure was among the best in the league and that our coaches had players on the same page with clearly defined roles that they were willing and ready to play. I was wrong. If I had known that Brad would basically just throw a basketball into the middle of the court and have them fight to the death while he rewatched footage of Butler's NCAA run, I might have some different opinions.
Quite the way to respond when you were wrong, give yourself a pat on the back, and stick a gold star on your forehead while you're at it! And even without knowing the inner workings of the team, it's obvious that inserting a player who had a horrific injury back into the starting lineup in front of players who played their butts off in the biggest stage of basketball wouldn't be good for "clearly defined roles", and certainly would affect the players being "willing and ready to play".

Hey, if you want to be condescending, I can give it back. If it was so obvious, why didn't the coach who some people already labeled a genius think of it at the start of the season?
Indiana Pacers
PG: D.Russell, P.Mills, A.Holiday, E.Simner
SG: V.Oladipo, C.Joseph, S.Hicks, D. Reed
SF: D. McDermott, A.Crabbe
PF: T. Young, T. Leaf, K. O'Quinn
C: M. Turner, D. Sabonis
PICKS: https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Indiana-Pacers/11/Rosters/Regular

Offline RJ87

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Yes, Stevens started Hayward before he was ready.  But it seems strange that we are focusing on that right now.  That was so long ago and Stevens corrected that mistake.  The team had months to get over that.  We had every chance to right the ship by playoff time.  Starting Hayward was a factor in the team's psyche early on, but it was so long ago that it seems kind of irrelevant now.  It's old news.  Hayward was coming off the bench and looked healthy at the end of the season and the team still played like crap.

Well that's kind of the issue. It happened long ago, but Brad wasn't hands on enough to correct the issue on a mental level. It bothered guys and those feelings seemed to fester.

And as I mentioned earlier, Gordon went to the bench but he still got a nice amount of minutes regardless of how he played.
Indiana Pacers
PG: D.Russell, P.Mills, A.Holiday, E.Simner
SG: V.Oladipo, C.Joseph, S.Hicks, D. Reed
SF: D. McDermott, A.Crabbe
PF: T. Young, T. Leaf, K. O'Quinn
C: M. Turner, D. Sabonis
PICKS: https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Indiana-Pacers/11/Rosters/Regular

Offline Chris22

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Well this canít be...Kyrie was the problem with this team. Hayward and Stevens are never the issue. I canít wait to hear the excuses when Hayward doesnít live up to his contract again next year. I am sure Tatum and Brown will be responsible.

Yes, Kyrie was the problem. He laid down like a dog in the playoffs.

Online gouki88

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Yes, Stevens started Hayward before he was ready.  But it seems strange that we are focusing on that right now.  That was so long ago and Stevens corrected that mistake.  The team had months to get over that.  We had every chance to right the ship by playoff time.  Starting Hayward was a factor in the team's psyche early on, but it was so long ago that it seems kind of irrelevant now.  It's old news.  Hayward was coming off the bench and looked healthy at the end of the season and the team still played like crap.

Well that's kind of the issue. It happened long ago, but Brad wasn't hands on enough to correct the issue on a mental level. It bothered guys and those feelings seemed to fester.

And as I mentioned earlier, Gordon went to the bench but he still got a nice amount of minutes regardless of how he played.
That annoyingly seemed to be a team-wide trend for the most part of the season. I get the whole "empowering players to learn from their mistakes themselves", but leaving them out there to play no matter how badly they were playing was so frustrating. With stars like Kyrie it's understandable - he in particular has the ability to score 10 points in a flash. But with guys like Rozier, Morris, Theis, Hayward, Tatum, Brown and even Smart they would see their normal amount of minutes regardless of performance.

The opposite seemed to be true for our end of bench guys, specifically Wanamaker and Semi, who never got consistent minutes despite showing signs of being solid. For me seeing Wanamaker not used at all was especially annoying

Offline RJ87

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Yes, Stevens started Hayward before he was ready.  But it seems strange that we are focusing on that right now.  That was so long ago and Stevens corrected that mistake.  The team had months to get over that.  We had every chance to right the ship by playoff time.  Starting Hayward was a factor in the team's psyche early on, but it was so long ago that it seems kind of irrelevant now.  It's old news.  Hayward was coming off the bench and looked healthy at the end of the season and the team still played like crap.

Well that's kind of the issue. It happened long ago, but Brad wasn't hands on enough to correct the issue on a mental level. It bothered guys and those feelings seemed to fester.

And as I mentioned earlier, Gordon went to the bench but he still got a nice amount of minutes regardless of how he played.
That annoyingly seemed to be a team-wide trend for the most part of the season. I get the whole "empowering players to learn from their mistakes themselves", but leaving them out there to play no matter how badly they were playing was so frustrating. With stars like Kyrie it's understandable - he in particular has the ability to score 10 points in a flash. But with guys like Rozier, Morris, Theis, Hayward, Tatum, Brown and even Smart they would see their normal amount of minutes regardless of performance.

The opposite seemed to be true for our end of bench guys, specifically Wanamaker and Semi, who never got consistent minutes despite showing signs of being solid. For me seeing Wanamaker not used at all was especially annoying

But I remember in a few of the game threads posters were annoyed that Brown had such a short leash at the beginning of the season and Brad wouldn't let him play through mistakes. Whereas Gordon looked like he just wandered into the arena off the street and had never seen a basketball in his life but he would still get his 25 minutes.
Indiana Pacers
PG: D.Russell, P.Mills, A.Holiday, E.Simner
SG: V.Oladipo, C.Joseph, S.Hicks, D. Reed
SF: D. McDermott, A.Crabbe
PF: T. Young, T. Leaf, K. O'Quinn
C: M. Turner, D. Sabonis
PICKS: https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Indiana-Pacers/11/Rosters/Regular

Offline RJ87

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Looks like we know at least one player who had issues for sure:

https://forum.celticsstrong.com/index.php?topic=100009.0
Indiana Pacers
PG: D.Russell, P.Mills, A.Holiday, E.Simner
SG: V.Oladipo, C.Joseph, S.Hicks, D. Reed
SF: D. McDermott, A.Crabbe
PF: T. Young, T. Leaf, K. O'Quinn
C: M. Turner, D. Sabonis
PICKS: https://basketball.realgm.com/nba/teams/Indiana-Pacers/11/Rosters/Regular

 

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