So tired of getting killed on the glass......

[gar]

KG and JjJ had 5 rebounds. Vucevic had 5 Offensive rebounds. I don't mind when we don't get offensive rebounds. What I mind is when the other team's back up center has more offensive rebounds than 4 out of 5 of the starters manage for total rebounds.

Bass 4, Wilcox 1, Stiemsma 2 - total rebounds - these are not over the hill vets, these are players who should be coming into their own right now.

[BASS_THUMPER]

timing and position is better than height any day of the week...

[thestackshow]

Like someone earlier in the thread said, its not that they CANT rebound its that they WONT rebound.

Just watch a Celtic game, any celtic game, and watch when the opposing team shoots the ball, nobody on the celtics goes after a rebound, they stand still and wait for it to bounce to one of their teammates, and the opposing teams players just walk or run right by them, its like they refuse to make one extra step to grab the ball.

Its the most puzzling thing ive ever seen, thats why the Celtics routinely fumble the ball around, they arent even prepared for rebounds, when they DO come up with a rebound, they fumble it to the other team and off of each others hands like the ball is on fire or something.

Its just puzzling.

Not to mention ive never EVER seen anyone on this team box anyone out, I remember learning how to box people out when i was in 2nd grade on my junior league basketball team.

Guess these guys never learned that tactic. lol.

[j804]

Like someone earlier in the thread said, its not that they CANT rebound its that they WONT rebound.

Just watch a Celtic game, any celtic game, and watch when the opposing team shoots the ball, nobody on the celtics goes after a rebound, they stand still and wait for it to bounce to one of their teammates, and the opposing teams players just walk or run right by them, its like they refuse to make one extra step to grab the ball.

Its the most puzzling thing ive ever seen, thats why the Celtics routinely fumble the ball around, they arent even prepared for rebounds, when they DO come up with a rebound, they fumble it to the other team and off of each others hands like the ball is on fire or something.

Its just puzzling.

Not to mention ive never EVER seen anyone on this team box anyone out, I remember learning how to box people out when i was in 2nd grade on my junior league basketball team.

Guess these guys never learned that tactic. lol.

I agree you are spot on definitely frustrating. I want someone who can rebound and/or work the post hopefully by the trade deadline, if not hell next year when we rebuild. It is torture watching the rebounding woes and its plagued us for years.

[jdz101]

Its got to be a combination of the players and the coaching.....dead last in rebounding...how pathetic.

[jc3celticsphan]

feels like deja vu from last season... no boards and no scorers

danny better do somthing.

[Galeto]

Getting killed on the glass and not finishing up a defensive stop is one of the most infuriating things to witness.  That the Celtics don't give it back to the opposition by grabbing their own share of offensive boards makes it all that much worse.

Before Garnett underwent knee surgery three years ago, he could singlehandedly control the defensive boards similar to what Howard does for Orlando.  Since his injury, he hasn't been anywhere close to his former rebounding self, even though he's rebounding has picked up lately.  I would have hoped that Ainge would then have emphasized getting strong defensive rebounders onto the roster but no, it's been a parade of Wallace, O'Neal, Bass (who I like for his other qualities, nevertheless) and Big Baby, all of whom are horrible on the defensive boards. 

Before Garnett arrived, it was exasperating to see the Celtics get killed on the boards during the Mark Blount Era.  When he arrived and things changed, it was amazing to see.  We were one of those other teams now, one with actual positive rebounding differentials.  It was short lived.  For basically all of my time as a Celtics fan, the Celtics have gotten killed on the boards and it's sucked very hard.

[scaryjerry]

Been a bad reboubing team who turn it over a lot for a while now  before this  season....infuriating

[clover]

The C's top rebounders per 48 are KG, then Stiemer, then Wilcox, with 12.7, 12.3 and 12.2--for 73rd, 80th and and 85th in the league. 

Perk, for reference, comes in with 11.7 for 100th, ahead of JO's 11.4 for 113th.  3J is at 11.3, but somehow he's not coming up on the espn sort I'm using.

Bass IMO belongs adding scoring to the second unit and Wilcox or even Stiemer should be in with the starters.

Of the rookies, Stiemer had more blocks and rebounds earlier in the year, but has clearly been focused on improving his defensive positioning--so I think it's reasonable to expect he'll do better again once he brings it all together.  3J seems to be improving his rebounding, though his play is largely in garbage time, as the the season goes on.  So I think those are good signs for both of them.  Still, I think they'd be doing better if Cliff Ray or another dedicated big man coach were on staff to work with them.

Old man KG seems to rebound best when he's rested--and that seemed to be the first flush of games out of the AS break. I don't know what that portends for him for these last seven weeks of the season.

[bostonpatriot]

Rebounding rate is a better metric than rebounding per minute.

Boston has been a mediocre rebounding team since Garnett and Powe got injured 3 years ago. I'm used to it.

[lantinm]

If Danny isn't going to make any moves, then Doc needs to start JJJ at the 4 alongside Garnett.  Jajuan is a pretty decent rebounder, and every time I've seen him play he attacks the offensive glass.  I understand that he's a rookie and that he's going to make mistakes and miss defensive rotations, but both his length and athleticism will make up for a lot of it.

I could see Jajuan giving us 14 and 8 over 30 minutes of action, and he probably will block a shot or two as well.

Garnett
JJJ
Pierce
Allen
Rondo

Wilcox
Bass
Pietrus
Bradley

As of right now, I think this is the nine man rotation that we should go with.  Steamer can be the 10th man if our bigs get into foul trouble.  Pavlovic, Daniels, O'Neal, and Dooling are dead weight at this point, and Moore seems very likely to be thrown into a trade.

[joeb]

not gonna happen this year, but i hope they bring back the "big man coach" concept next year, especially if new, and presumably younger, personnel are in place. lack of practice time kinda makes this moot this year. the problem is 100% not putting a body on the opposing player.

KG used to out-quick and out-jump everyone...not the case now.

the other guys are just not good position rebounders.

Pierce does it on occasion, as does Rondo.

part of the reason this team doesn't core the ball well anymore is because they are not getting def rebs consistently, which limits their opportunities to get out on the break.

many believe this team is too old to run on the break, just the opposite IMO. without a strong inside game, they rely on pick and roll/pick, along with perimeter ball movement to get open looks. without a lot of penetration, the opposing team's defense has it easier, hence their offense struggles to score. no off rebs makes that worse.

they don't need to be high flying athletes to get out on the break. ray thrives in that situation and they can't double him, nor can they double off Rondo. and why isn't Bass getting is butt down the court faster, either for a quick post up or as a trailer?

many blamed Rondo for the PHL debacle last night, and while not all his fault (everyone stunk it up), he is the one that is supposed to get them into their offense. too many occasions last night where they got the def reb and continued to walk it up the floor. Heinsohn constantly gripes about this and he's right.

[ScoobyDoo]

To: thestackshow

Agreed, when a shot goes up, these guys turn around and look at the rim. They stand and they look at the rim. It's pathetic. They also do not lay a body on anyone, ever.

I DVR'd the Houston game, came home last night, turned it on. Sure enough, ball goes up, KG turns around and looks at the rim while one of Houston's big men just walks past him, gets the rebound, puts the layup in. And I don't mean the Houston big sprinted by KG, shoved him and then got the ball. He literally walked by him, stood flat footed, got the ball and put it in.

In a game earlier this year in Orlando, I watched E'Tuan Moore box out Dwight Howard during a key play down the stretch that allowed one of our bigs to get the rebound.

I don't buy that we aren't big enough, or we're not long enough, or that we're too old. What we are is, too undisciplined and too unmotivated with regards to rebounding. In addition, we're not mentally tough enough or scrappy enough. If this team simply laid a hard body on whatever guy was close enough too you every time the ball went up - it would do wonders for our rebounding.

T: Spilling Green Dye
Agreed, I can live without a high number of offensive rebounds, particularly because we generally shoot a real high percentage.

But the lack of defensive rebounding is unnacceptable

Also agree regarding KG at the 5 spot. What I like about it is that it keeps him closer to the rim and therefore his rebounding has picked up. He's just more in the mix on the glass when at the 5. What I worry about is that he's slightly out of position weight wise with some of these centers and that can lead to injuries over time...especially at his age.

To Lantinm:

I actually wouldn't mind your suggestion. I'm a big fan of throwing guys into the fire and letting them find their way. I mean look how well it worked out for both Bradely and Moore this year. Both did fairly well when Rondo went down and they were shoved into the spotlight. They had some tough games, but had some real bright spots as well and I think it benefited both the team and each of them very much.

I'm not sure about JJJ at the 4 at this moment, though I like what I've seen from him overall.

I'd probably opt for Steamer and KG - but I'd also put Ray on the bench and start Pietrus, which would give us more size and athleticism on the glass as well and Steamer is one guy who actually does lay a body on people.

So I'd go with:

Steamer / Wilcox
KG / Bass
Pierce / Pietrus /Pavlovic / Marquis...
Pietrus / Ray
Rondo / Bradley       

[snively]

It is aggravating to be such a poor rebounding team.  But that's not going to change much as long as Ray and Bass are starters and Dooling is playing rotation minutes. 

[ScoobyDoo]

Strange thing is, Bass "should be" at least a decent to good rebounder. He's 6'8", pretty solidly built and has good foot speed and leaping ability.

That's a guy, with those athletic abilities that should be able to seal his man, whoever is around him...and then rip boards.

For me, rebounding was always a pretty simple process:

1. Find "your" man, or if you are in a rotating defense, find the guy who you are currently responsible for.

2. Lay a hard body on him - but out elbows up and stretched out wide so you can feel the guy tryign to get around you.

3. Seal the guy

4. If the ball is coming your way and the guy you're sealing is bigger than you and think he's gonna go over your back....you jump slightly backwards when you go up for the ball. If he's coming over your back he's gonna foul you every time.

5. At worst, the ball drops in front of you.

I'm 5'10" and I've never had trouble boxing out guys 5 to 6 inches taller than me. The reason is that they are going to have to throw me to the court to get by me. So they're either not getting by me or they're getting  foul - I'll take either.

But we just don't have that mentality - at all. Rebounding is not important to us.

Anyway Snively, agreed re Ray and Bass. Who would you opt for to start, assuming no JO, who I wouldn't start anyway, and the current roster.