My final thread on the trade

[MBunge]

Usually a championship team has a few games won in the playoffs with their bench coming up big,hasn't happened so far on this team.Usually you see a role player come up big in a few games to boost the starters,example:last night in the Bulls vs Hawks game the Bulls backup pf came thru in crunch time for them.He gave them the necessary energy and some timely pts when they needed it,something that hasn't happened on this team yet.Between the players who already existed on the bench and the trade guys the bench hasn't given us much.

Correct. This is where Jeff Green comes in. Where is that 20-point, 5-rebound performance to help lead the team to victory? That is the deal with a bench in the NBA. It is less about consistency and more about someone different stepping up to help a team win. The Celts have had none of that.

Jeff Green is not and never has been an instant offense player.  Yet despite playing fairly well most of the time, Green has played more minutes than the utterly worthless Big Baby for only one game vs. Miami.

Mike

[housecall]

Usually a championship team has a few games won in the playoffs with their bench coming up big,hasn't happened so far on this team.Usually you see a role player come up big in a few games to boost the starters,example:last night in the Bulls vs Hawks game the Bulls backup pf came thru in crunch time for them.He gave them the necessary energy and some timely pts when they needed it,something that hasn't happened on this team yet.Between the players who already existed on the bench and the trade guys the bench hasn't given us much.

Correct. This is where Jeff Green comes in. Where is that 20-point, 5-rebound performance to help lead the team to victory? That is the deal with a bench in the NBA. It is less about consistency and more about someone different stepping up to help a team win. The Celts have had none of that.

In the end the trade will speak for itself.

[blackberry33]

On another note, did anyone hear Bucher on WEEI this morning? He basically said that the trade weakened the Celtics' chances to win the championship this year and that Danny definitely did not have to sell management on the trade because it was a money saver. He did add that the trade was done for the future. He also added that the veterans on the team were not happy about the trade because they knew it weakened them for this year.

tp
Kendrick Perkins played a whopping 12 games for Boston this year.  This was one of the best teams in the league witout Perkins stepping a foot on the court.  It was one of the best teams in the league without Shaq playing.  It was one of the best teams in the league without Jermaine playing. This was one of the best teams in the league with Semih Erden starting at center.

If Boston doesn't win a championship this year, the reasons for it will start with Rondo playing like absolute crap for that stretch where they lost the chance at homecourt advantage in the playoffs, Big Baby becoming not just worthless but actually harmful to the team when he was on the court, the fact that KG and Ray have each had one good game and 3 poor games against Miami and that this veteran team that has been together for several years still makes way too many stupid turnovers.  The absence of Perk comes in far behind all of that.

Mike

[housecall]

Usually a championship team has a few games won in the playoffs with their bench coming up big,hasn't happened so far on this team.Usually you see a role player come up big in a few games to boost the starters,example:last night in the Bulls vs Hawks game the Bulls backup pf came thru in crunch time for them.He gave them the necessary energy and some timely pts when they needed it,something that hasn't happened on this team yet.Between the players who already existed on the bench and the trade guys the bench hasn't given us much.

Correct. This is where Jeff Green comes in. Where is that 20-point, 5-rebound performance to help lead the team to victory? That is the deal with a bench in the NBA. It is less about consistency and more about someone different stepping up to help a team win. The Celts have had none of that.

Jeff Green is not and never has been an instant offense player.  Yet despite playing fairly well most of the time, Green has played more minutes than the utterly worthless Big Baby for only one game vs. Miami.

Mike

I thought i was fair with the failures of the bench.I figure before new players can be successful the ones already exist should be clicking on all cylinders,something that hasn't happened.I never expected Green,Kristic,Murphy to come in and instantly everything is fixed but if we'd had the best BBD,Shaq(healthier)to put JO in the intended bench role to be the leaders from the bench.Im not sure if Green will ever adjust to being a role player.Some players aren't made to come off the bench.This is where Danny&Doc comes in...its their job to make sure the transition works.

[JohnBagleyValueMeal]

Would it be a fair position to take that Green hasn't played all that well but that he is still a better alternative than what we faced before the trade?

Thank you so much for this response, I was beginning to think that I was speaking a different language or something.

Yes, it would be totally fair to argue that, and it would also be totally fair to argue that other potential moves that may have been made (for Battier or for Brewer or whoever) could have been just as good. I don't know if the numbers would support any of those arguments, I haven't really looked, but at least that's a conversation that could go somewhere.

I also don't see how anyone can rationally say that Perk on one knee and looking at a large contract extension is a better situation...

I don't think you have to choose between this particular trade and no moves at all, is all I'm saying. I'm not arguing that the Celtics shouldn't have traded Perkins, necessarily, I'm only saying that the numbers look like we haven't received the boost we needed from the acquisitions.

dlpin - I'm not interested in comparing Perkins and Jeff Green for the same reason I'm not comparing Chris Paul and Jeff Green--I'm trying to compare apples to apples, so I'm sticking with players that are occupying a similar role.

Something that it occurs to me that I might not be communicating well: In picking the players for comparison, I'm assuming that the Perk trade for a wing was going to happen, and looking at how to contextualize Green's performance in terms of other wing players playing a similar role. I think that might be the sticking point in our discussion.

That said, I'd appreciate if you would back up off the caps lock. I'm trying to have a respectful conversation here, I don't need the "THAT MAKES NO SENSE" stuff.

[vinnie]

The most interesting thing about this trade: OKC traded two starters and are a much better team --