Is this the mentally weakest Celtic team ever?

[mr. dee]

I've been watching Celtic teams for some time now. I've watched Bill Russell, Dave Cowens and Larry Bird era teams games through youtube and NBATV. I also watched the post Reggie Lewis-era with Dominique Wilkins leading the team (though that was short).

But I have never seen a Celtic team as soft as this one. Just no heart. Even the Pitino years, Walker-Pierce era and IT-led Celtics showed more grit than this team. Red must probably rolling on his grave now.

[cltc5]

[GreenEnvy]

Definitely heartless. You can’t teach (or coach) heart.

This squad didn’t have it.

They rolled over and died.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

Yes.

[SparzWizard]

This team was supposed to be talented (if not the most talented since 2008 Celtics) with Irving, Horford, and Hayward. And with last year's blooming development of Tatum and Brown.

But they are mentally the weakest team ever.

[Chris22]

Not mentally weak.

Physically weak.

[Chief Macho]

could you imagine what kevin garnett would have done to kyrie mentally?   he would have quit in the second month.

[keevsnick]

I think this seasons woes can all be traced back to three basic factors. The first was Hayward, it's not his fault but he was bad especially to start the year. Having him in the starting line up forced all the young guys like Tatum, Brown Rozier to change their roles and hunt their own shots a bit. It hurt our defense a lot. He should have been coming off the bench for 15minutes a game to start the year. Then that bad start caused simmering tensions in the form of Kyries awful leadership to boil over, which only made everything worse. Suddenly nobody could trust each other on the court. And finally there was Stevens, I think more than his timeouts or philosophy his biggest failure was the ability to adapt. He was too slow to bench Hayward and Brown when they struggled, too slow to hold guys like Tatum accountable when he got mid range happy, too slow to put Brown back in once he started heating up the second half of the season, too slow alter Haywards role (yes, he's a great passer. But if you can't score you shouldn't handle the ball as  much as he did), too slow each step of the way.

I think honestly one way or another we just have to pick a direction. Get Kyrie, throw some piece for Davis, thats fine. Let Kyrie go, probably lose Horford, maybe trade Hayward (if we can) and go young with Tatum and Brown as 1a and 1b options is fine too (and honestly, I might enjoy that more). Either way  if there's one thing I think we learned its that when you try to both rebuild with youth and compete one way  or another you usually end up doing neither properly.

[cltc5]

Partly the coaches fault.  Zero leadership all year from him

[Chief Macho]

true.  but this was stevens first time with this type of team.   he's very young and was a college coach.  plus he went to the ecf last year.  dude can coach.   why can't he get a learning curve.


baby bathwater and such.

[SparzWizard]

I think this seasons woes can all be traced back to three basic factors. The first was Hayward, it's not his fault but he was bad especially to start the year. Having him in the starting line up forced all the young guys like Tatum, Brown Rozier to change their roles and hunt their own shots a bit. It hurt our defense a lot. He should have been coming off the bench for 15minutes a game to start the year. Then that bad start caused simmering tensions in the form of Kyries awful leadership to boil over, which only made everything worse. Suddenly nobody could trust each other on the court. And finally there was Stevens, I think more than his timeouts or philosophy his biggest failure was the ability to adapt. He was too slow to bench Hayward and Brown when they struggled, too slow to hold guys like Tatum accountable when he got mid range happy, too slow to put Brown back in once he started heating up the second half of the season, too slow alter Haywards role (yes, he's a great passer. But if you can't score you shouldn't handle the ball as  much as he did), too slow each step of the way.

I think honestly one way or another we just have to pick a direction. Get Kyrie, throw some piece for Davis, thats fine. Let Kyrie go, probably lose Horford, maybe trade Hayward (if we can) and go young with Tatum and Brown as 1a and 1b options is fine too (and honestly, I might enjoy that more). Either way  if there's one thing I think we learned its that when you try to both rebuild with youth and compete one way  or another you usually end up doing neither properly.

You are also forgetting Danny Ainge and that trade deadline. He literally bothered Dell Demps to not flip Davis to the Lakers because he also had a package ready for the Pelicans in the summer. And that might've also affected Jayson Tatum.

[keevsnick]

I think this seasons woes can all be traced back to three basic factors. The first was Hayward, it's not his fault but he was bad especially to start the year. Having him in the starting line up forced all the young guys like Tatum, Brown Rozier to change their roles and hunt their own shots a bit. It hurt our defense a lot. He should have been coming off the bench for 15minutes a game to start the year. Then that bad start caused simmering tensions in the form of Kyries awful leadership to boil over, which only made everything worse. Suddenly nobody could trust each other on the court. And finally there was Stevens, I think more than his timeouts or philosophy his biggest failure was the ability to adapt. He was too slow to bench Hayward and Brown when they struggled, too slow to hold guys like Tatum accountable when he got mid range happy, too slow to put Brown back in once he started heating up the second half of the season, too slow alter Haywards role (yes, he's a great passer. But if you can't score you shouldn't handle the ball as  much as he did), too slow each step of the way.

I think honestly one way or another we just have to pick a direction. Get Kyrie, throw some piece for Davis, thats fine. Let Kyrie go, probably lose Horford, maybe trade Hayward (if we can) and go young with Tatum and Brown as 1a and 1b options is fine too (and honestly, I might enjoy that more). Either way  if there's one thing I think we learned its that when you try to both rebuild with youth and compete one way  or another you usually end up doing neither properly.

You are also forgetting Danny Ainge and that trade deadline. He literally bothered Dell Demps to not flip Davis to the Lakers because he also had a package ready for the Pelicans in the summer. And that might've also affected Jayson Tatum.

I don't blame Dany for that at all (assuming he actually did that) because A) he had to say Tatum was available to get them to hold Davis B) It worked and now we have a shot at Davis this summer C) Tatum never seems all that bother by the trade rumors when asked about them D) The trade rumors didn't cause him  to lose his shot, jack long twos, or regress on defense and E) if they did thats on him.

Nw if you wnat to blame Dany for not thinning this team with a Rozer  or Morris trade to simplify roles or increase the other guys playing time + get assets for those expiring's than fine, but I don't know that such a move saves our season.

[Who]

This team and the 1978 team are the ones that spring to mind.

[Celtics4ever]

A lot of the Pitino teams were much worse teams even this team plagued by defeatism would beat any Pitino era team, 9 times out of ten, maybe more.  But this team had their bags packed prior to this last game.

Ainge should hire McHale to work with Robert Williams all summer.

[Csfan1984]

Not sure I can say mentally weak if egos are they reason this team was a failure all year.