Author Topic: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.  (Read 16748 times)

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Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #435 on: June 11, 2019, 08:14:52 PM »

Offline feckless

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For me it's not just that donald avoided the draft with bone spurs but he had the audacity to call out John McCain as not a hero because he was captured.

"I prefer my heroes not to have been captured".

Isn't that calling all P.O.W.'s cowards? Doesn't that mean they are cowards unless they fought to their death.    Donald does not know what makes America great.  He was no patriot when it was time for him to serve and it is sickening too see him hug the flag now.
 
Veterans who support Trump should re-examine his comments on McCain and P.O.W.'s.

For what it's worth I protested the war in Viet Nam but went in to the Marines because I did not want someone else to have to take my place.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2019, 08:21:25 PM by feckless »
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Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #436 on: June 11, 2019, 08:18:32 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I would concur with this last statement [regarding Trump being a coward].  But is is true of any American who shirks duty is a time of war to me.   If you did not volunteer to fight for your country like I did, your not much better than Pres. Trump.    The thing is the cowards nowadays don't need deferrals because it is a volunteer military but if you did not serve in your generation wars, are you much better?   I think not, society has just made it ok to be a coward, whereas you had to work at it in the past.  There will always be cowards, from my military experience I met a lot of them in uniform.   It is a perfectly sane thing to avoid combat.

I don't agree with some of this.  There are many ways somebody can serve their country without being a bullet stopper in some nonsense political conflict.  It doesn't make them a coward to avoid combat.  It isn't a matter of being brave.  There are plenty of valiant people who would prefer not to die for a bullcrap reason.  If our country is attacked, I think it's a duty to serve if you're needed and if you can physically.  If our country is simply meddling overseas?  I don't think you have an obligation to risk your life.

I don't blame Trump for avoiding fighting in Vietnam.  I don't blame anybody.  I don't like that people with resources could avoid it while poor kids couldn't, but I'm not going to condemn people for using their privilege to avoid dying for no good reason. 

And I say this as somebody who comes from a military family, with a father and uncles who served during Vietnam and after.  The military can be a great career choice, and if my circumstances were different, I would have pursued a JAG career.  And, I agree that people who are afraid of combat should not sign up.  But, the idea that you're a coward unless you serve just seems off to me.


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Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #437 on: June 12, 2019, 09:21:11 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Trump says he would talk to and possibly accept dirt on a political rival if it came from a foreign government.

Did we not just have a massive investigation regarding foreign governments trying to influence the American election? Did Trump not come very close to having his son be charged for trying to do exactly what Trump said today that he would do? And he says he wouldn't bother to even alert the FBI?

How can anyone, after hearing this, not come to the conclusion Trump probably already did this but was just lucky enough not to leave an evidence trail? He is admitting he would do exactly the thing he was just investigated for and that he called a "witch hunt"?

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #438 on: June 12, 2019, 11:09:57 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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Trump says he would talk to and possibly accept dirt on a political rival if it came from a foreign government.

Did we not just have a massive investigation regarding foreign governments trying to influence the American election? Did Trump not come very close to having his son be charged for trying to do exactly what Trump said today that he would do? And he says he wouldn't bother to even alert the FBI?

How can anyone, after hearing this, not come to the conclusion Trump probably already did this but was just lucky enough not to leave an evidence trail? He is admitting he would do exactly the thing he was just investigated for and that he called a "witch hunt"?
you won't convince any of his base that he isn't anything but a true patriot.  just backs up the old saying "you can't cure stupid".   I say this after having also seen an interview today of 10 people in Iowa (3 Rep, 3 Dem, 4 Ind) and the ones voting for Trump couldn't mention an actual accomplishment but thinks he's doing great and is patriotic. 

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #439 on: June 13, 2019, 04:48:02 AM »

Offline The Oracle

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Trump says he would talk to and possibly accept dirt on a political rival if it came from a foreign government.

Did we not just have a massive investigation regarding foreign governments trying to influence the American election? Did Trump not come very close to having his son be charged for trying to do exactly what Trump said today that he would do? And he says he wouldn't bother to even alert the FBI?

How can anyone, after hearing this, not come to the conclusion Trump probably already did this but was just lucky enough not to leave an evidence trail? He is admitting he would do exactly the thing he was just investigated for and that he called a "witch hunt"?
It is in no way illegal to listen to unsolicited information no matter who you are or the source of the information, nor should it be.  If it were a crime it would be exploited mercilessly by foreign actors as well as political opponents in an effort to attack/unseat political opposition.  I am not a lawyer but it is my understanding that the information must involve an exchange of money as well as having nefarious intent to rise to a criminal level, kinda like what Hillary did.

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #440 on: June 13, 2019, 06:37:28 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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you won't convince any of his base that he isn't anything but a true patriot.  just backs up the old saying "you can't cure stupid".

Like all politicians he is in this game for himself, that is true of almost all of them.

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FWIW:  Of the current crop of candidates, the only ones who have served in the military are Pete Buttigieg, Seth Moulton, Mike Gravel and Tulsi Gabbard.

I know this and I never said military service was a requirement for being president.   I was just pointing out to  people that laws have changed when a lot of them in all honesty would have probably did the same thing or sought too.    But to me, it is not a litmus test for service.    {Pres/ Bush Jr.   Pres. Clinton and Pres. Trump all had some shady military stuff.

We have had plenty of fine presidents who have never served.   

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If it were a crime it would be exploited mercilessly by foreign actors as well as political opponents in an effort to attack/unseat political opposition

Hillary Clinton would be rotting in a jail cell, too.   This is going to boomerang back to her, mark my words.

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Did we not just have a massive investigation regarding foreign governments trying to influence the American election? Did Trump not come very close to having his son be charged for trying to do exactly what Trump said today that he would do? And he says he wouldn't bother to even alert the FBI?

Joe Biden has a dirty past, I doubt the media brings it up because they play favorites   He just had Pres. Obama clear him in the probe, while he was lining his pockets.   

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Why is Joe Biden so warm toward China?

Last week, Biden raised eyebrows when he shrugged off concerns over the China threat. “Come on, man,” Biden said. “I mean, you know, they’re not bad folks, folks. But guess what, they’re not competition for us.”

Perhaps Biden’s insouciant attitude toward the Chinese government has to do with the fact that his family does not consider them competitors but business partners.

In 2013, then-Vice President Joe Biden and his son Hunter Biden flew aboard Air Force Two to China. Less than two weeks later, Hunter Biden’s firm inked a $1 billion private equity deal with a subsidiary of the Chinese government’s Bank of China. The deal was later expanded to $1.5 billion. In short, the Chinese government funded a business that it co-owned along with the son of a sitting vice president.

If it sounds shocking that a vice president would shape US-China policy as his son — who has scant experience in private equity — clinched a coveted billion-dollar deal with an arm of the Chinese government, that’s because it is.

https://nypost.com/2019/05/11/the-troubling-reason-why-biden-is-so-soft-on-china/

No outrage about this stuff?

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Two years after leaving office, Joe Biden couldn’t resist the temptation last year to brag to an audience of foreign policy specialists about the time as vice president that he strong-armed Ukraine into firing its top prosecutor.

In his own words, with video cameras rolling, Biden described how he threatened Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko in March 2016 that the Obama administration would pull $1 billion in U.S. loan guarantees, sending the former Soviet republic toward insolvency, if it didn’t immediately fire Prosecutor General Viktor Shokin.

“I said, ‘You’re not getting the billion.’ I’m going to be leaving here in, I think it was about six hours. I looked at them and said: ‘I’m leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor is not fired, you’re not getting the money,’” Biden recalled telling Poroshenko.

“Well, ****, he got fired. And they put in place someone who was solid at the time,” Biden told the Council on Foreign Relations event, insisting that President Obama was in on the threat.
But Ukrainian officials tell me there was one crucial piece of information that Biden must have known but didn’t mention to his audience: The prosecutor he got fired was leading a wide-ranging corruption probe into the natural gas firm Burisma Holdings that employed Biden’s younger son, Hunter, as a board member.

U.S. banking records show Hunter Biden’s American-based firm, Rosemont Seneca Partners LLC, received regular transfers into one of its accounts — usually more than $166,000 a month — from Burisma from spring 2014 through fall 2015, during a period when Vice President Biden was the main U.S. official dealing with Ukraine and its tense relations with Russia.

The general prosecutor’s official file for the Burisma probe — shared with me by senior Ukrainian officials — shows prosecutors identified Hunter Biden, business partner Devon Archer and their firm, Rosemont Seneca, as potential recipients of money.

Although Biden made no mention of his son in his 2018 speech, U.S. and Ukrainian authorities both told me Biden and his office clearly had to know about the general prosecutor's probe of Burisma and his son's role. They noted that:

    Hunter Biden's appointment to the board was widely reported in American media;
    The U.S. Embassy in Kiev that coordinated Biden's work in the country repeatedly and publicly discussed the general prosecutor's case against Burisma;
    Great Britain took very public action against Burisma while Joe Biden was working with that government on Ukraine issues;
    Biden's office was quoted, on the record, acknowledging Hunter Biden's role in Burisma in a New York Times article about the general prosecutor's Burisma case that appeared four months before Biden forced the firing of Shokin. The vice president's office suggested in that article that Hunter Biden was a lawyer free to pursue his own private business deals.

President Obama named Biden the administration’s point man on Ukraine in February 2014, after a popular revolution ousted Russia-friendly President Viktor Yanukovych and as Moscow sent military forces into Ukraine’s Crimea territory.


https://thehill.com/opinion/white-house/436816-joe-bidens-2020-ukrainian-nightmare-a-closed-probe-is-revived

So do folks think Joe Biden is still a saint?

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Over the next seven years, as both Joe Biden and John Kerry negotiated sensitive and high-stakes deals with foreign governments, Rosemont entities secured a series of exclusive deals often with those same foreign governments.

Some of the deals they secured may remain hidden. These Rosemont entities are, after all, within a private equity firm and as such are not required to report or disclose their financial dealings publicly.

Some of their transactions are nevertheless traceable by investigating world capital markets. A troubling pattern emerges from this research, showing how profitable deals were struck with foreign governments on the heels of crucial diplomatic missions carried out by their powerful fathers. Often those foreign entities gained favorable policy actions from the United States government just as the sons were securing favorable financial deals from those same entities.

Nowhere is that more true than in their commercial dealings with Chinese government-backed enterprises.

Rosemont Seneca joined forces in doing business in China with another politically connected consultancy called the Thornton Group. The Massachusetts-based firm is headed by James Bulger, the nephew of the notorious mob hitman James “Whitey” Bulger. Whitey was the leader of the Winter Hill Gang, part of the South Boston mafia. Under indictment for 19 murders, he disappeared. He was later arrested, tried, and convicted.

James Bulger’s father, Whitey’s younger brother, Billy Bulger, serves on the board of directors of the Thornton Group. He was the longtime leader of the Massachusetts state Senate and, with their long overlap by state and by party, a political ally of Massachusetts Senator John Kerry.

https://nypost.com/2018/03/15/inside-the-shady-private-equity-firm-run-by-kerry-and-bidens-kids/

One has to wonder what these guys got out of Iran.

"Power tends to corrupt; absolute power corrupts absolutely" -John Dalberg-Acton, 1st Baron Acton

Now Pres. Trump was pretty corrupt prior to taking office most of us agree.   But I do not think Biden should be in office either, in light of some of this media ignored information.   Mainstream media plays favorites for their side, any one who gets their news solely from it, is from that group of people that can't be cured.   This is true of the left and right.

I just heard the Obama Administration deleted a ton of ICE documents to give them a rosy past.

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The Obama administration deleted hundreds of speeches and statements on the Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) website just hours before President Donald Trump officially entered office, according to research released Tuesday.

A collection of 190 transcripts of speeches on ICE’s website was deleted on Jan. 18 and late in the evening on Jan. 19, 2017, according to research conducted by the Sunlight Foundation, a nonpartisan organization that advocates for government transparency. Statements made by high-ranking ICE officials regarding controversial immigration topics such as sanctuary cities, E-Verify, treatment of detainees, and other issues were included in the reported deletions.

“With a couple of clicks of a mouse, access to a federal government web resource containing 12 years of primary source materials on ICE’s history was lost,” the Sunlight Foundation wrote, noting that archived speeches dating back from 2004 were among those deleted.

https://dailycaller.com/2019/06/12/obama-administration-deleted-ice-speeches/

Truth is he was just as harsh if not more harsh than Pres. Trump and the children in cages started with him.


The really scary thing in this election is foreign policy.   Pres. Trump scares me somewhat.   Biden was on the wrong side of choices more times than not look at some of the fiascos like the Syrian Crisis, Benghazi, and the Isis is the junior varsity comments.   A of the candidates look like lightweights in this area, too.   Hopefully, the debates show otherwise as I watch all of them both sides as I think it is part of our duty as citizens given the privilege to vote.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 07:39:45 AM by Celtics4ever »

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #441 on: June 13, 2019, 08:07:44 AM »

Offline nickagneta

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I wonder about the President openly admitting to being willing to get political dirt on political adversaries from foreign powers to affect an election and I get 10,000 words of the absolute worst Republican whataboutism I have ever seen on Joe Biden and "hey it's not money so it's not illegal".

Does it even matter to you two that the leader of our country just admitted he would do what Mueller was investigating him for? That he admitted he wouldn't even alert the FBI on even something like this, even though his personally picked FBI Director said he would actually need to call the FBI on something like that?

Hey, if Biden whataboutism and "nothing to see here, he didn't actually take money" gets you through the day, have at!!!

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #442 on: June 13, 2019, 08:44:26 AM »

Offline slamtheking

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I wonder about the President openly admitting to being willing to get political dirt on political adversaries from foreign powers to affect an election and I get 10,000 words of the absolute worst Republican whataboutism I have ever seen on Joe Biden and "hey it's not money so it's not illegal".

Does it even matter to you two that the leader of our country just admitted he would do what Mueller was investigating him for? That he admitted he wouldn't even alert the FBI on even something like this, even though his personally picked FBI Director said he would actually need to call the FBI on something like that?

Hey, if Biden whataboutism and "nothing to see here, he didn't actually take money" gets you through the day, have at!!!
Yes, that is crossing a line.
Please, no more.
One absolute truth that gets steamrolled or ignored by every pro-Trumper or what-abouter --> Trump is the president.  Period.  no one else is president.  He is the person elected to run and lead this country.  Obama's no longer in office.  Move on.  Hillary didn't win.  Move on.  None of the Dem candidates have been winnowed out from the pack even but by all means let's focus on attacking them while ignoring the outrage that is the Trump administration.  One other thing that gets steamrolled --> not everyone who's against or questioning Trump excuses what happened in other administrations or by other politicians.  Seems to me only the pro-Trumpers/excusers point at the Dems and say they did this and they did that so why are people complaining about Trump.  I may have missed it but I've yet to see anyone who's had negative comments about Trump not say that ALL politicians and administrations need to be held to higher standard of conduct, ethics and concern for the country as a whole.   

Now that I've vented, I originally came back to this thread this morning to pose a question based on you posting this tidbit yesterday because a thought occurred to me very early this morning --> Did Trump make that statement to deliberately instigate the impeachment process that he seems to so desperately want?  Pelosi's been adamant that she won't start the process without some sort of smoking gun that even Senate Republicans can't excuse away which seems to be frustrating Trump to no end.  Is this his next move to get her to impeach? 

Thoughts anyone?
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 08:47:55 AM by nickagneta »

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #443 on: June 13, 2019, 09:00:34 AM »

Offline Surferdad

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I don't doubt that trump wants an impeachment.  We should give it to him because history will judge our actions.  A "sympathy vote" by his base won't get him re-elected.

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #444 on: June 13, 2019, 10:01:38 AM »

Offline fairweatherfan

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I wonder about the President openly admitting to being willing to get political dirt on political adversaries from foreign powers to affect an election and I get 10,000 words of the absolute worst Republican whataboutism I have ever seen on Joe Biden and "hey it's not money so it's not illegal".

Does it even matter to you two that the leader of our country just admitted he would do what Mueller was investigating him for? That he admitted he wouldn't even alert the FBI on even something like this, even though his personally picked FBI Director said he would actually need to call the FBI on something like that?

Hey, if Biden whataboutism and "nothing to see here, he didn't actually take money" gets you through the day, have at!!!

It's wild watching people diminish, excuse, babble and complain their way past not only a major attack on America's elections, not only the beneficiary repeatedly kissing the perpetrator's behind while spreading idiotic conspiracy theories about the Americans investigating it, but now announcing he'd happily accept more help. And by "wild" I mean "profoundly anti-American".

A President saying he's open to secret political aid from foreign governments and mocking the idea of going to the FBI about it is 1000x more threatening to national security than a private email server. And that's without even getting into other recent travesties like assuring Kim Jong Un the CIA won't use any informants against him because "we fell in love". Or the dozens of foreign governments funneling him money through his businesses, in direct violation of the Constitution. There's no bottom to the cravenness of the betrayal and moral rot. And I'm not just talking about Trump; he's one guy. Everyone enabling and incentivizing this is complicit. Including those House Dems that are blocking action against this. Everyone.

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #445 on: June 13, 2019, 12:10:44 PM »

Offline indeedproceed

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I wonder about the President openly admitting to being willing to get political dirt on political adversaries from foreign powers to affect an election and I get 10,000 words of the absolute worst Republican whataboutism I have ever seen on Joe Biden and "hey it's not money so it's not illegal".

Does it even matter to you two that the leader of our country just admitted he would do what Mueller was investigating him for? That he admitted he wouldn't even alert the FBI on even something like this, even though his personally picked FBI Director said he would actually need to call the FBI on something like that?

Hey, if Biden whataboutism and "nothing to see here, he didn't actually take money" gets you through the day, have at!!!

It's wild watching people diminish, excuse, babble and complain their way past not only a major attack on America's elections, not only the beneficiary repeatedly kissing the perpetrator's behind while spreading idiotic conspiracy theories about the Americans investigating it, but now announcing he'd happily accept more help. And by "wild" I mean "profoundly anti-American".

A President saying he's open to secret political aid from foreign governments and mocking the idea of going to the FBI about it is 1000x more threatening to national security than a private email server. And that's without even getting into other recent travesties like assuring Kim Jong Un the CIA won't use any informants against him because "we fell in love". Or the dozens of foreign governments funneling him money through his businesses, in direct violation of the Constitution. There's no bottom to the cravenness of the betrayal and moral rot. And I'm not just talking about Trump; he's one guy. Everyone enabling and incentivizing this is complicit. Including those House Dems that are blocking action against this. Everyone.

When you say it like that it almost seems like a big deal that needs our full attention. But what about the economy? And Hillary? Aren't they still super relevant and should be used as reasons not to do anything because we don't want to?

"You've gotta respect a 15-percent 3-point shooter. A guy
like that is always lethal." - Evan 'The God' Turner

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #446 on: June 13, 2019, 12:35:19 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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Now that I've vented, I originally came back to this thread this morning to pose a question based on you posting this tidbit yesterday because a thought occurred to me very early this morning --> Did Trump make that statement to deliberately instigate the impeachment process that he seems to so desperately want?  Pelosi's been adamant that she won't start the process without some sort of smoking gun that even Senate Republicans can't excuse away which seems to be frustrating Trump to no end.  Is this his next move to get her to impeach? 

Thoughts anyone?

When I heard the tidbits of the Trump interview, basically admitting that he accepted "dirt" from the Russians, what occurred to me is that he is trying to get out in front of some information that he knows is going to be released.    Sort of a preemptive distraction.

As to people trying to minimize this, there are two legal distinctions; to be illegal (as I understand it) it has to have monetary value and has to come from a foreign state.  If these two things apply, it is a campaign finance violation.  This is very specific to campaign finance and has nothing to do with what is right or what one should expect from the president.

Hacking and stealing emails from Hilary Clinton and other Democrats is a crime.  Kind of like stealing a car or robbing someone's home.  If you purchase or otherwise receive goods that you know are stolen, I think that is a crime outside of campaign finance regulations.  Trump accepted stolen goods and essentially said on TV he thinks this is fine.  Further, these goods were stolen from his political opponent and stolen by a foreign State, all of which Trump knew at the time.

Trump is now downplaying this by calling it "dirt" but this dirt he is referring to was stolen material, stolen by the Russians.  When confronted with this knowledge that the Russians had stolen things from American citizens, Trump chose to collaborate with the foreign State over notifying the FBI.

Trump is a fraud and a criminal.  It stuns me that people try to defend or rationalize this because they like the judges he appoints.


Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #447 on: June 13, 2019, 12:58:34 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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Mueller did not find a conspiracy between the Trump team and Russia. But he wrote in the report that "the campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts."

The key word is "stolen".  "Dirt" can be obtained legally and if that were the case, a person would have more latitude in how they handled it.  I would not expect a person to contact the FBI if offered legally obtained "dirt".  But we are talking about stolen information, stolen by a foreign government, essentially spies.  You need to report that to the FBI, not give your approval to release the stolen information.

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #448 on: June 13, 2019, 01:07:17 PM »

Offline nickagneta

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Mueller did not find a conspiracy between the Trump team and Russia. But he wrote in the report that "the campaign expected it would benefit electorally from information stolen and released through Russian efforts."

The key word is "stolen".  "Dirt" can be obtained legally and if that were the case, a person would have more latitude in how they handled it.  I would not expect a person to contact the FBI if offered legally obtained "dirt".  But we are talking about stolen information, stolen by a foreign government, essentially spies.  You need to report that to the FBI, not give your approval to release the stolen information.
But dirt from foreign adversaries is a national security threat. Obviously, those governments would expect something in return...quid pro quo. Suddenly you have a president that is possibly compromised and beholden to foreign forces.

Legally obtained info or not does not matter if it's coming from a foreign entity who expects something in return.

Re: Mueller Report Thread: Report done.
« Reply #449 on: June 13, 2019, 01:16:52 PM »

Offline heyvik

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Now that I've vented, I originally came back to this thread this morning to pose a question based on you posting this tidbit yesterday because a thought occurred to me very early this morning --> Did Trump make that statement to deliberately instigate the impeachment process that he seems to so desperately want?  Pelosi's been adamant that she won't start the process without some sort of smoking gun that even Senate Republicans can't excuse away which seems to be frustrating Trump to no end.  Is this his next move to get her to impeach? 

Thoughts anyone?

When I heard the tidbits of the Trump interview, basically admitting that he accepted "dirt" from the Russians, what occurred to me is that he is trying to get out in front of some information that he knows is going to be released.    Sort of a preemptive distraction.

As to people trying to minimize this, there are two legal distinctions; to be illegal (as I understand it) it has to have monetary value and has to come from a foreign state.  If these two things apply, it is a campaign finance violation.  This is very specific to campaign finance and has nothing to do with what is right or what one should expect from the president.

Hacking and stealing emails from Hilary Clinton and other Democrats is a crime.  Kind of like stealing a car or robbing someone's home.  If you purchase or otherwise receive goods that you know are stolen, I think that is a crime outside of campaign finance regulations.  Trump accepted stolen goods and essentially said on TV he thinks this is fine.  Further, these goods were stolen from his political opponent and stolen by a foreign State, all of which Trump knew at the time.

Trump is now downplaying this by calling it "dirt" but this dirt he is referring to was stolen material, stolen by the Russians.  When confronted with this knowledge that the Russians had stolen things from American citizens, Trump chose to collaborate with the foreign State over notifying the FBI.

Trump is a fraud and a criminal. It stuns me that people try to defend or rationalize this because they like the judges he appoints.
I thought that THIS would be the straw that broke the camels back, BUT Trump supporters are extremely loyal. I went over to the FoxNews FB page and thought that I would see responses that said that he misspoke or that he crossed a line - BUT _ what I saw amazed me. There were comments like:

  • Trump KNEW what he was doing and that the Democrats were eating it up.
  • Trump is in the Dems head.
  • Trump is playing mind games and saying anything that he wants
  • Trump is a mastermind player and the he's running circles around the Dems
I am continually left speechless....


 

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