Author Topic: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?  (Read 1530 times)

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Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #45 on: January 11, 2019, 08:17:33 PM »

Offline Sophomore

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I would take vintage Shaq or Jordan or even LBJ over Harden any day.

Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #46 on: January 12, 2019, 12:43:21 AM »

Online SCeltic34

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You can't overlook the fact that today's game is tailored for someone like Harden.  Specifically, the fact that teams switch so readily on pick and rolls means that all Houston has to do is run a pick and roll with whatever player is being guarded by the opposing team's weakest player on defense, often a big because clearly most bigs struggle to guard out on the perimeter.  This makes iso ball far simpler for a guard.  Also, no hand checking and even minor contact counts as fouls these days. 

Imagine if Wilt, Jordan, etc. had a mismatch every possession and had the freedom to do whatever the heck they wanted.  Harden is an awesome offensive player, but greatest ever?  Pfft.


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Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #47 on: January 12, 2019, 04:20:08 AM »

Offline bopna

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Hell no.

Hasn't even reached an NBA final.. For all of Lequeens flaws at least he has done it 8 straight times..

I'd still rather have LBJ, or Kobe or MJ.

Harden is a modern day Bernard King who by the way can himself score easily in today's NBA.

Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #48 on: January 12, 2019, 06:39:33 AM »

Offline 10610786d

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So how are the Spurs so hot right now?

Yep they’re on a roll.
They were cold against MEM two nights ago though for MEM pick watch

Maybe here's the next revolution. Lots of long 2's plus lots of long 3's and some layups - makes it harder to guard than simply 3's and layups

Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #49 on: January 12, 2019, 08:10:21 AM »

Offline Who

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Larry Bird

One of the greatest shooters of all time. Terrific at moving without the basketball. Strong post game. Lethal mid-post game. One of the best passers of all time (best non-PG passer of all time). A threat to score from anywhere on the floor. Can create a shot for himself against anyone. Good ball-handler.

His unselfishness on the floor spreads throughout the rest of the team and makes everyone else make the extra pass and move more off the ball in anticipation of getting a pass. Makes the entire team operate better as a group.

Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #50 on: January 12, 2019, 08:16:49 AM »

Online gouki88

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Larry Bird

One of the greatest shooters of all time. Terrific at moving without the basketball. Strong post game. Lethal mid-post game. One of the best passers of all time (best non-PG passer of all time). A threat to score from anywhere on the floor. Can create a shot for himself against anyone. Good ball-handler.

His unselfishness on the floor spreads throughout the rest of the team and makes everyone else make the extra pass and move more off the ball in anticipation of getting a pass. Makes the entire team operate better as a group.
Agreed entirely. In terms of all-around offensive skill, I don't think Larry can be beaten

Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #51 on: January 12, 2019, 09:00:42 AM »

Online hwangjini_1

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Hell no.

Hasn't even reached an NBA final.. For all of Lequeens flaws at least he has done it 8 straight times..

I'd still rather have LBJ, or Kobe or MJ.

Harden is a modern day Bernard King who by the way can himself score easily in today's NBA.
i am not sure how reaching the finals is integral to being the "greatest offensive player of all time". please expand on this. thank you.
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Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #52 on: January 12, 2019, 09:34:23 AM »

Online Somebody

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I'll vouch for Wilt, dude could've definitely developed a shot if he wanted to (aside from FTs but I think he'd definitely not suck as much), his fadeaway was money and he has a clip of swishing in consecutive three point shyhooks. In the meantime he's probably the besr inside scorer ever, and he had a handle plus passing ability.

Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #53 on: January 12, 2019, 09:48:43 AM »

Offline Celtics4ever

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No anyone that thinks this is not a scholar of the game, Wilt was way more dominant, so were Jordan and these other guys.

Quote
Rank   Player   PPG
1.   Michael Jordan*   30.12
2.   Wilt Chamberlain*   30.07
3.   Elgin Baylor*   27.36
4.   Kevin Durant   27.18
5.   LeBron James   27.16
6.   Jerry West*   27.03
7.   Allen Iverson*   26.66
8.   Bob Pettit*   26.36
9.   Oscar Robertson*   25.68
10.   George Gervin*   25.09
11.   Karl Malone*   25.02
12.   Kobe Bryant   24.99
13.   Dominique Wilkins*   24.83
14.   Rick Barry*   24.78
15.   Kareem Abdul-Jabbar*   24.61
16.   Larry Bird*   24.29
17.   Adrian Dantley*   24.27
18.   Pete Maravich*   24.24
19.   Julius Erving*   24.16
20.   Carmelo Anthony   24.01
21.   Anthony Davis   23.89
22.   Shaquille O'Neal*   23.69
23.   James Harden  23.59

https://www.basketball-reference.com/leaders/pts_per_g_career.html

Too far down the list.  Also, plays in the modern cupcake, no handcheck era.   Harden also has his PPG subsidized with blatant no calls and added FTA's.

Re: Is Harden the greatest offensive player of All-Time?
« Reply #54 on: January 14, 2019, 12:24:47 PM »

Offline petbrick

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You can't overlook the fact that today's game is tailored for someone like Harden.  Specifically, the fact that teams switch so readily on pick and rolls means that all Houston has to do is run a pick and roll with whatever player is being guarded by the opposing team's weakest player on defense, often a big because clearly most bigs struggle to guard out on the perimeter.  This makes iso ball far simpler for a guard.  Also, no hand checking and even minor contact counts as fouls these days. 

Imagine if Wilt, Jordan, etc. had a mismatch every possession and had the freedom to do whatever the heck they wanted.  Harden is an awesome offensive player, but greatest ever?  Pfft.

I agree with this. The scary thing is that Harden's not even a particularly good shooter when compared to the league's elite players, so we could be looking at the blueprint for someone even more dull to watch in the future. Presuming there aren't dramatic rule changes, of course.

 

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