If needed, should Ainge actually put Tatum in package for AD? Nope, walk away.

[CelticsQuestFor18]

I thought a lot of people here hated Tatum for working out with Kobe.

Now's your chance- ship him out for Anthony Davis!

Well, when you put it that way... 

[Roy H.]

Let me put it this way, if the package needs to include Smart, Williams and a bunch of picks on top of Tatum, then all three would be gone. It's an easy decision. A talent like Davis paired with Kyrie, Horford, Hayward and Brown with a coach like Stevens probably means multiple titles and multiple MVP awards for Davis. He most likely would be considered the best player in the league during that stretch.

So yeah, bye bye Jayson....hello Anthony.

Yes, agreed. Tatum + Smart + Williams + 2 picks would hurt emotionally, but this is like trading for a 26 year old KG, talent-wise.

[LarBrd33]

Let me put it this way, would you have traded Pierce for Tim Duncan early in their careers? Pierce won 1 title while Duncan won 5.

More like trading Dirk for KG (except go check out what dirk was averaging when he was Tatum’s age)?  Tatum should end up better than pierce.

If you swapped those two right now at this very moment, I think you should be prepared to see 20 year old Tatum averaging 25 and 8 with increased minutes/shots on the pelicans while Davis averages 19 and 9 with decreased minutes/shots on the Celtics.  Davis is obviously better right now, but Tatum has the makings of a future All-NBA player as well.  Problem is that any trade for Davis would require other contracts as well - and Davis will be an injury prone expiring contract.

[aefgogreen]

My main concern is AD's health.  How sure are we he is past his injuries?

[Moranis]

Let me put it this way, would you have traded Pierce for Tim Duncan early in their careers? Pierce won 1 title while Duncan won 5.

More like trading Dirk for KG (except go check out what dirk was averaging when he was Tatum’s age)?  Tatum should end up better than pierce.

If you swapped those two right now at this very moment, I think you should be prepared to see 20 year old Tatum averaging 25 and 8 with increased minutes/shots on the pelicans while Davis averages 19 and 9 with decreased minutes/shots on the Celtics.  Davis is obviously better right now, but Tatum has the makings of a future All-NBA player as well.  Problem is that any trade for Davis would require other contracts as well - and Davis will be an injury prone expiring contract.

Boston will be lucky if Tatum is anywhere near the player that Davis is.  He certainly has the top end potential to be a top 5 player in the game, but lots of players have that potential and get no where near that actual level of play.  Fans often get too emotionally attached to young players that they can't see the forest through the trees.  If the trade is something like Tatum, Smart, Yabu, and draft picks for Davis, Boston has to make that trade, especially if it is made early enough to bring back any of the up coming free agents i.e. Rozier, Morris, and Baynes.

I mean imagine this team for the next 5ish seasons

PG - Irving, Rozier
SG - Brown, Vet FA
SF - Hayward, Morris
PF - Davis, Theis
C - Horford, Baynes, Williams

Even if the Warriors come back again (minus Cousins of course), I'd favor that team against them.  I wouldn't favor the C's if Tatum and Smart were there instead of Davis.  Because even if Tatum reaches his full potential he is at least a couple of seasons away from that level and by then Horford and maybe even Hayward and Irving won't be the same level of players.  The window would be missed.  You can't miss your window.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I brought this up a while back, but I couldn't find the old thread.

Is the parallel for Anthony Davis more like Kevin Love or Kevin Garnett?

Because if Davis is more like Kevin Love, without the ultimate ability to lift a team's play, the Celtics should say no, just like the Warriors said no to Love a few years ago. They let Green, Thompson, and Barnes develop together and were rewarded with a championship. In that scenario, our Green-Thompson-Barnes would be Smart-Brown-Tatum-Williams.

If Davis is more like Kevin Garnett, then the Cs should absolutely trade for him.

I'm just not sure which he is. Why aren't his teams making the playoffs more often? I get that his team is bad, but no worse than many of Kevin Garnett's teams. He's putting up big numbers in a very explosive and fast-paced offense, but why can't he make Randle-Mirotic-Holliday into a playoff team?

If Davis is a true MVP player that can elevate his team into contention, then he is worth a king's ransom, but if he can't do that, is he worth it?

Honestly, I'm probably gonna have mixed feelings either way this shakes down. But I wonder more and more if Ainge should take a lesson from Jerry West and play the long game here.

Those first round picks can be value contracts, or you could trade them them for reliable role players, or you could trade them for more picks later.

[nickagneta]

I brought this up a while back, but I couldn't find the old thread.

Is the parallel for Anthony Davis more like Kevin Love or Kevin Garnett?

Because if Davis is more like Kevin Love, without the ultimate ability to lift a team's play, the Celtics should say no, just like the Warriors said no to Love a few years ago. They let Green, Thompson, and Barnes develop together and were rewarded with a championship. In that scenario, our Green-Thompson-Barnes would be Smart-Brown-Tatum-Williams.

If Davis is more like Kevin Garnett, then the Cs should absolutely trade for him.

I'm just not sure which he is. Why aren't his teams making the playoffs more often? I get that his team is bad, but no worse than many of Kevin Garnett's teams. He's putting up big numbers in a very explosive and fast-paced offense, but why can't he make Randle-Mirotic-Holliday into a playoff team?

If Davis is a true MVP player that can elevate his team into contention, then he is worth a king's ransom, but if he can't do that, is he worth it?

Honestly, I'm probably gonna have mixed feelings either way this shakes down. But I wonder more and more if Ainge should take a lesson from Jerry West and play the long game here.

Those first round picks can be value contracts, or you could trade them them for reliable role players, or you could trade them for more picks later.

Isn't it obvious that Davis is KG like? His defense is light years better than Love ever had and Davis got the Pels to the playoffs twice with little help and even made the 2nd round. Love in Minnesota never played in the playoffs and couldn't win more than 31 games except one time and even that was just 40 games.

[Moranis]

I brought this up a while back, but I couldn't find the old thread.

Is the parallel for Anthony Davis more like Kevin Love or Kevin Garnett?

Because if Davis is more like Kevin Love, without the ultimate ability to lift a team's play, the Celtics should say no, just like the Warriors said no to Love a few years ago. They let Green, Thompson, and Barnes develop together and were rewarded with a championship. In that scenario, our Green-Thompson-Barnes would be Smart-Brown-Tatum-Williams.

If Davis is more like Kevin Garnett, then the Cs should absolutely trade for him.

I'm just not sure which he is. Why aren't his teams making the playoffs more often? I get that his team is bad, but no worse than many of Kevin Garnett's teams. He's putting up big numbers in a very explosive and fast-paced offense, but why can't he make Randle-Mirotic-Holliday into a playoff team?

If Davis is a true MVP player that can elevate his team into contention, then he is worth a king's ransom, but if he can't do that, is he worth it?

Honestly, I'm probably gonna have mixed feelings either way this shakes down. But I wonder more and more if Ainge should take a lesson from Jerry West and play the long game here.

Those first round picks can be value contracts, or you could trade them them for reliable role players, or you could trade them for more picks later.

Isn't it obvious that Davis is KG like? His defense is light years better than Love ever had and Davis got the Pels to the playoffs twice with little help and even made the 2nd round. Love in Minnesota never played in the playoffs and couldn't win more than 31 games except one time and even that was just 40 games.

I do think he is closer to KG than Love, but I don't think dwc's point should totally be disregarded either.  the Pelicans have underperformed.  Now some of that is Davis has missed a bunch of games and has been hobbled a fair amount even when he plays.  Is that because he is injury prone or is it because he is taking on an inordinate amount of workload and strain?  Or maybe, Davis' game doesn't quite translate to wins and losses like it should.  That said, you make the trade every single time.  Even if he is just injury prone, you still make the trade every single time because Davis elevates the current team to a level that Tatum just can't do right now, and I don't think you want to waste Horford's last good years or the best years that Irving and Hayward have left (even if their prime still might coincide with the beginning of Tatum's you still miss out on 3ish years waiting for Tatum to come into his own). 

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I brought this up a while back, but I couldn't find the old thread.

Is the parallel for Anthony Davis more like Kevin Love or Kevin Garnett?

Because if Davis is more like Kevin Love, without the ultimate ability to lift a team's play, the Celtics should say no, just like the Warriors said no to Love a few years ago. They let Green, Thompson, and Barnes develop together and were rewarded with a championship. In that scenario, our Green-Thompson-Barnes would be Smart-Brown-Tatum-Williams.

If Davis is more like Kevin Garnett, then the Cs should absolutely trade for him.

I'm just not sure which he is. Why aren't his teams making the playoffs more often? I get that his team is bad, but no worse than many of Kevin Garnett's teams. He's putting up big numbers in a very explosive and fast-paced offense, but why can't he make Randle-Mirotic-Holliday into a playoff team?

If Davis is a true MVP player that can elevate his team into contention, then he is worth a king's ransom, but if he can't do that, is he worth it?

Honestly, I'm probably gonna have mixed feelings either way this shakes down. But I wonder more and more if Ainge should take a lesson from Jerry West and play the long game here.

Those first round picks can be value contracts, or you could trade them them for reliable role players, or you could trade them for more picks later.

Isn't it obvious that Davis is KG like? His defense is light years better than Love ever had and Davis got the Pels to the playoffs twice with little help and even made the 2nd round. Love in Minnesota never played in the playoffs and couldn't win more than 31 games except one time and even that was just 40 games.

Yeah. To be clear -- I see the connection to Garnett in play style, but that's not what I'm talking about about.

There is a different ineffable quality that superstars have (Garnet was a superstar and Love wasn't) where they control the game and lift their team to Ws.

In that sense, I wonder if Davis is more like Love than Garnett. Maybe he is just in a bad situation. Maybe he is Garnett. I just sometimes wonder a bit.

[footey]

You absolutely have to include Tatum if it is what gets the deal done; Celtic fans exaggerate Tatum's value. He is going to be a solid player, but will never get in the AD level of perennial All Pro. If we do not offer Tatum, Lakers will most assuredly provide the better offer, because they will give up whomever Lebron lets them.

[footey]

I brought this up a while back, but I couldn't find the old thread.

Is the parallel for Anthony Davis more like Kevin Love or Kevin Garnett?

Because if Davis is more like Kevin Love, without the ultimate ability to lift a team's play, the Celtics should say no, just like the Warriors said no to Love a few years ago. They let Green, Thompson, and Barnes develop together and were rewarded with a championship. In that scenario, our Green-Thompson-Barnes would be Smart-Brown-Tatum-Williams.

If Davis is more like Kevin Garnett, then the Cs should absolutely trade for him.

I'm just not sure which he is. Why aren't his teams making the playoffs more often? I get that his team is bad, but no worse than many of Kevin Garnett's teams. He's putting up big numbers in a very explosive and fast-paced offense, but why can't he make Randle-Mirotic-Holliday into a playoff team?

If Davis is a true MVP player that can elevate his team into contention, then he is worth a king's ransom, but if he can't do that, is he worth it?

Honestly, I'm probably gonna have mixed feelings either way this shakes down. But I wonder more and more if Ainge should take a lesson from Jerry West and play the long game here.

Those first round picks can be value contracts, or you could trade them them for reliable role players, or you could trade them for more picks later.

MOre like KG only better, because he is 5 years younger.

[Rosco917]

If we weren't set up right now with Big Al, Kyrie, Morris, Hayward, Baynes and even Smart...I would say wait and hold onto Tatum and grow with him.

But in this case, I'll go with the win-now plan. Davis is a top 5 player in the NBA, right now.

Then again...I'm really not 100% on this trade.

[Phantom255x]

Something folks seem to forget is that AD is essentially a rental in 2020. Has a player option he'll likely decline for 2021. So you'd have to be very sure he'd be willing to stay long term here. Very risky to just gamble on given his high trade price.

[rondofan1255]

no interest in seeing them become treadmill Pelicans East

[PhoSita]

I wouldn't include Tatum in the deal unless I was 100% certain Davis was re-signing in Boston long term.

If you get 3+ years of Davis guaranteed alongside Kyrie, then it's worth it, although still hard to swallow.


If you're trading Tatum for only a year or two of Davis with no certainty he'll stick around longer, no thanks.  The league is still too stacked at the top to be sure that Kyrie - Davis is going to result in a championship if all you get is a year or two.


Based on Lowe's reporting it sounds like Davis is thinking of doing what LeBron did in Cleveland and what Durant has done in Oakland.  Just sign a bunch of one year deals and keep the team that signs you eager to keep you happy.  I would not trade Tatum for the "privilege" of worrying about whether Davis is gonna resign every year for half a decade.