Kobe you RUINED Jayson Tatum.....

[SparzWizard]

As long as he's scoring and putting up points resulting in wins idc how he plays

The problem is when his midrange is not hitting. I'd prefer if he attacks the basket and draw fouls.

Exactly what the Celtics AS A TEAM should be doing if the J's aren't falling!

[Chris22]

I thought Tatum's moves were better last year.

No more training with Kobe. Train with Pierce.

[Alleyoopster]

Alert, Alert, Alert!!! Celtics Strong Forum name change in the works - we will no longer log onto - forum.celticsstrong.com/index.php?board=3.0  the new login name will be entitled
nothingbutcomplaints.celticsstrong.com/index.php?board=3.0 

smh

[LatterDayCelticsfan]

Cue the 'is Jeff Green Jayson Tatum' comparison thread.

[LarBrd33]

Agreed...even if his numbers are decent (still expected more) straight up dont like his game this year.

weird.  He’s terrific.

The ball stopping and long 2s are killing me man. Expected a bigger jump too but I guess that's my problem

i like him taking long 2s.  He's gotta get good at those so anytime I see him taking a contested long 2, I consider it a win.  He needs those reps and I love the team is giving him the freedom to get those reps.  He can't develop into a star if all he does is play the minimal role he had last year.  We need him to be a go-to scorer. 

Thanks, Kobe.

[Green-18]

Too many people are confusing a higher usage rate with poor shot selection.  Sure, Tatum has had stretches of poor iso shots.  Many of these instances have occurred when the team was struggling to find their confidence.  The reality is that Tatum has improved his shot selection and efficiency since the first month of the season.  Kobe didn't ruin Tatum.  He is just going through some growing pains.

Tatum has seen his largest increase in FGA's from beyond the arc.  Everyone seems to be complaining about the mid-range shot attempts.  I decided to compare mid-range shot selection from last season.

2017-18 - Tatum took 3.8 FGA per game between 10-23 feet
2018-19 - Tatum is taking 4 FGA per game between 10-23 feet

There really isn't much of a difference from last season.  Tatum's TS% from the past 27 games is equal to his rookie campaign.  Not bad when you consider that his usage rate has increased. 

If we want to discuss sophomore struggles, look no further than Donovan Mitchell.  His efficiency has taken a nosedive this season, largely because he has too much responsibility.  I'm not going to complain about Tatum's 1 or 2 iso shots per game. 


 

 

[Erik]

As long as he's scoring and putting up points resulting in wins idc how he plays

The problem is when his midrange is not hitting. I'd prefer if he attacks the basket and draw fouls.

Exactly what the Celtics AS A TEAM should be doing if the J's aren't falling!

Would you like Tatum to not take an open shot if the previous 20 didn’t go in, for example? This is just bad advice.

If the argument is they shouldn’t settle for tough shots at the start of the shot clock, I agree. I also think they don’t generally do that based on what I’m seeing with my eyes. Early shots on the clock are usually quick Horford Irving screen into a straight on 3, which is absolutely fine in my book. They run their play. If the play breaks down someone goes iso and takes a “tough shot” - for you. For them it’s not that tough.

[KGs Knee]

Kobe did not ruin Tatum, that is just nonsense. Most of the best perimeter players have had a good midrange game.   Having a guy that can get a shot from the elbow or post is a great weapon to have in the arsenal. It can't always be threes or layups, those are the shots the defense is usually trying to take away, so when they do you need to be able to do something different.

Having a player like Tatum that can get off a shot when the offense breaks down is critical. Encountering some bumps in the road occasionally as Tatum learns to use this weapon most effectively is to be expected. He definitely should not abandon that part of his game just because some confused fans think otherwise.

[CF033]

Tatum killed it last night. I think he's been great this year. You can't expect a massive jump with the Celts having so much talent on the roster, and desperately trying to get GH back up to speed, and us just being wing heavy in general. On many other teams he'd probably be dropping 25 a night this year, and at 20 years old! The future is very bright for this kid.

[TheReaLPuba]

If you guys can't tell with the "eye test" that Tatum's shot selection and overall shooting has regressed this year then I can't really help you.

But if you want some numbers too:


Season   Age   Tm         2P      0-3    3-10     10-16   16 <3   3P
2017-18     19   BOS      .492    .629   .258     .438   .420         .434

2018-19    20   BOS      .492    .700   .377     .365   .405         .382

From basketball-reference.com: https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/t/tatumja01.html

So basically Tatum's shooting has vastly improved on layups and short shots but his midrange game all the way out to the 3 point shot has dropped off considerably.

I can only attribute that to poor shot selection and hero-type ball.

Can anyone find out his shooting percentages on open jumpers? Particularly off a pass?

[SHAQATTACK]

the Celts having so much talent on the roster,

then why an't we winning more games ?

[A Future of Stevens]

the Celts having so much talent on the roster,

then why an't we winning more games ?

The unquestionable most talented team in the league has only a .05% higher win % than the Celtics as of today. (Warriors @.64% vs Celtics at .59%)

[Atzar]

I suspect that Tatum's shot selection is a symptom of a different problem (and no, Kobe is not the problem... that's garbage).  My main issue with Tatum right now is that he has a tendency to freeze whenever he receives the ball in the half court.  This gives the defense time to adjust.  His man catches up, and the off ball defenders shift in his direction.  This means he has to deal with a lot more traffic than he otherwise would have when he finally unfreezes.  He's more likely to pull up because he thinks he can't get all the way to the rim, and when he does drive he's more prone to getting stripped.  Tatum has done this freezing thing since college.

Contrast that to Jaylen Brown.  I know a lot of people are out on him right now, but one of the things I like about him is that there's little hesitation in his game.  As soon as he gets the ball, he's doing something with it - driving, shooting, or passing.  Rarely does he just hold it while he decides what to do next.  He doesn't give the defense time to key on him.  I think he has quietly adapted his game to an off ball role much better than people realize, but it's masked by a horrific shooting slump that may or may not be a product of his hand injury.  I'd like Tatum to adopt Brown's decisiveness into his own game. 

[footey]

I suspect that Tatum's shot selection is a symptom of a different problem (and no, Kobe is not the problem... that's garbage).  My main issue with Tatum right now is that he has a tendency to freeze whenever he receives the ball in the half court.  This gives the defense time to adjust.  His man catches up, and the off ball defenders shift in his direction.  This means he has to deal with a lot more traffic than he otherwise would have when he finally unfreezes.  He's more likely to pull up because he thinks he can't get all the way to the rim, and when he does drive he's more prone to getting stripped.  Tatum has done this freezing thing since college.

Contrast that to Jaylen Brown.  I know a lot of people are out on him right now, but one of the things I like about him is that there's little hesitation in his game.  As soon as he gets the ball, he's doing something with it - driving, shooting, or passing.  Rarely does he just hold it while he decides what to do next.  He doesn't give the defense time to key on him.  I think he has quietly adapted his game to an off ball role much better than people realize, but it's masked by a horrific shooting slump that may or may not be a product of his hand injury.  I'd like Tatum to adopt Brown's decisiveness into his own game.

TP on Tatum observation.

Tatum should work with Pierce rather than Kobe. Their athleticism more comparable. Brown athleticism more similar to Kobe. Tatum needs to work on his craftiness. Not particularly explosive.

[Celtics4ever]

Tatum should work with Pierce rather than Kobe. Their athleticism more comparable. Brown athleticism more similar to Kobe. Tatum needs to work on his craftiness. Not particularly explosive.

I think LeBron James would disagree with you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PPci3nXFoQ

That being said, I would love to see him work with PP.

I know a lot of people are out on him right now, but one of the things I like about him is that there's little hesitation in his game.  As soon as he gets the ball, he's doing something with it - driving, shooting, or passing.  Rarely does he just hold it while he decides what to do next.  He doesn't give the defense time to key on him.  I think he has quietly adapted his game to an off ball role much better than people realize, but it's masked by a horrific shooting slump that may or may not be a product of his hand injury.  I'd like Tatum to adopt Brown's decisiveness into his own game.

Do you like the Bricks and To's and bonehead plays?