Author Topic: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...  (Read 1712 times)

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Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #30 on: December 06, 2018, 12:44:14 PM »

Offline Vermont Green

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I don't get this whole discussion.  Hayward suffered a gruesome injury and is now back on the court.  I can't imagine how much rehab he had to do.  At the start of the season, he was not back at 100% form and neither was essentially the whole team.  He accepted a role to come off the bench that has seemed to change the team mojo and also he has shown some improvement albeit a small sample.

I don't understand what more people want from him.  He does not have a free pass and I don't think he would want one, as evidenced by him not missing a beat when he came off the bench.  And this whole thing with Smart seems like much more about Smart than about Hayward.  Smart has a short fuse and it can get him in trouble sometimes but I am sure his teammates "get" him.  Marcus being Marcus or whatever.

I am expecting another good game from Hayward tonight.  I expect Marcus will be Marcus.  Let's see.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #31 on: December 06, 2018, 01:46:10 PM »

Offline Erik

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It was certainly not my intention to trigger so many emotional and somewhat unhinged responses to what seems like a fairly obvious contrast in situations to an objective observer.

Smart has returned from MANY injuries with an accelerated timeline and to my memory has never been afforded the myriad of excuses that have recently been offered for Hayward's poor performance.  Images of him diving for loose balls in the playoffs last year after tearing the ligament that prevents your thumb from dislocating are still fresh in my mind.   

I'm actually a fan of both players, sorry to ruin the lazy and inaccurate narrative that I just don't "like" Hayward.

However, I do feel it's undeniable that: 1. Hayward was being cheered in this arena while playing for another team 2: Was out of a walking boot before the end of LAST season. 3. Didn't show any real urgency to make it back onto the court. 4. Was given playing time without having to earn it with his play.

I expect these factors most likely rubbed some of his teammates who weren't gifted max contracts at the request of their former college coach the wrong way.

1 and 2 are undeniable facts. 3 and 4 are opinions I disagree with.

Agree that #3 is highly questionable and straight up unfair. I'm pretty sure the Celtics flat out told him that he couldn't return that season.

However, you really disagree with #4? If you're playing better than someone and getting less playing time and getting paid less, there will be friction. No one gives a **** about how good they used to be. Every single person on this team is hungry. They're not just here to make Gordon's life as comfortable as possible.

The best five players on this team include Gordon Hayward.

Based on what data? This is your opinion and is so obviously wrong that even Stevens had to bench him. You know how bad it is to bench your max guy? He just wasnt playing well. And he was starting. And that probably p---ed off teammates. However good he is today or in Utah is completely irrelevant.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #32 on: December 06, 2018, 01:47:54 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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It was certainly not my intention to trigger so many emotional and somewhat unhinged responses to what seems like a fairly obvious contrast in situations to an objective observer.

Smart has returned from MANY injuries with an accelerated timeline and to my memory has never been afforded the myriad of excuses that have recently been offered for Hayward's poor performance.  Images of him diving for loose balls in the playoffs last year after tearing the ligament that prevents your thumb from dislocating are still fresh in my mind.   

I'm actually a fan of both players, sorry to ruin the lazy and inaccurate narrative that I just don't "like" Hayward.

However, I do feel it's undeniable that: 1. Hayward was being cheered in this arena while playing for another team 2: Was out of a walking boot before the end of LAST season. 3. Didn't show any real urgency to make it back onto the court. 4. Was given playing time without having to earn it with his play.

I expect these factors most likely rubbed some of his teammates who weren't gifted max contracts at the request of their former college coach the wrong way.

1 and 2 are undeniable facts. 3 and 4 are opinions I disagree with.

Agree that #3 is highly questionable and straight up unfair. I'm pretty sure the Celtics flat out told him that he couldn't return that season.

However, you really disagree with #4? If you're playing better than someone and getting less playing time and getting paid less, there will be friction. No one gives a **** about how good they used to be. Every single person on this team is hungry. They're not just here to make Gordon's life as comfortable as possible.

The best five players on this team include Gordon Hayward.

Based on what data? This is your opinion and is so obviously wrong that even Stevens had to bench him. You know how bad it is to bench your max guy? He just wasnt playing well. And he was starting. And that probably p---ed off teammates. However good he is today or in Utah is completely irrelevant.

They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team.
Most talent in the league. We don't want or need AD.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #33 on: December 06, 2018, 02:20:01 PM »

Offline bdm860

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It was certainly not my intention to trigger so many emotional and somewhat unhinged responses to what seems like a fairly obvious contrast in situations to an objective observer.

Smart has returned from MANY injuries with an accelerated timeline and to my memory has never been afforded the myriad of excuses that have recently been offered for Hayward's poor performance.  Images of him diving for loose balls in the playoffs last year after tearing the ligament that prevents your thumb from dislocating are still fresh in my mind.   

I'm actually a fan of both players, sorry to ruin the lazy and inaccurate narrative that I just don't "like" Hayward.

However, I do feel it's undeniable that: 1. Hayward was being cheered in this arena while playing for another team 2: Was out of a walking boot before the end of LAST season. 3. Didn't show any real urgency to make it back onto the court. 4. Was given playing time without having to earn it with his play.

I expect these factors most likely rubbed some of his teammates who weren't gifted max contracts at the request of their former college coach the wrong way.

1 and 2 are undeniable facts. 3 and 4 are opinions I disagree with.

Agree that #3 is highly questionable and straight up unfair. I'm pretty sure the Celtics flat out told him that he couldn't return that season.

However, you really disagree with #4? If you're playing better than someone and getting less playing time and getting paid less, there will be friction. No one gives a **** about how good they used to be. Every single person on this team is hungry. They're not just here to make Gordon's life as comfortable as possible.

The best five players on this team include Gordon Hayward.

Based on what data? This is your opinion and is so obviously wrong that even Stevens had to bench him. You know how bad it is to bench your max guy? He just wasnt playing well. And he was starting. And that probably p---ed off teammates. However good he is today or in Utah is completely irrelevant.

They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team.

Also while I love Baynes, there's no world where I think he's one of the 5 best Celtics' players, despite sometimes being in the starting lineup.

And Erik, what kind of data do you need?  For players that have played at least 50 minutes Hayward is:

4th in PER
4th in WS
3rd in OBPM
3rd in DBPM
3rd in BPM
3rd in VORP
3rd in +/-
1st in DRtg

The only stat I can find where Hayward is not top 5 is ORtg (where he comes in 6th ahead of Brown, Tatum, Morris, and Rozier).

What data are you seeing that shows Hayward is not one of the top 5 Celtics?

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Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #34 on: December 06, 2018, 02:43:39 PM »

Offline DefenseWinsChamps

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It was certainly not my intention to trigger so many emotional and somewhat unhinged responses to what seems like a fairly obvious contrast in situations to an objective observer.

Smart has returned from MANY injuries with an accelerated timeline and to my memory has never been afforded the myriad of excuses that have recently been offered for Hayward's poor performance.  Images of him diving for loose balls in the playoffs last year after tearing the ligament that prevents your thumb from dislocating are still fresh in my mind.   

I'm actually a fan of both players, sorry to ruin the lazy and inaccurate narrative that I just don't "like" Hayward.

However, I do feel it's undeniable that: 1. Hayward was being cheered in this arena while playing for another team 2: Was out of a walking boot before the end of LAST season. 3. Didn't show any real urgency to make it back onto the court. 4. Was given playing time without having to earn it with his play.

I expect these factors most likely rubbed some of his teammates who weren't gifted max contracts at the request of their former college coach the wrong way.

1 and 2 are undeniable facts. 3 and 4 are opinions I disagree with.

Agree that #3 is highly questionable and straight up unfair. I'm pretty sure the Celtics flat out told him that he couldn't return that season.

However, you really disagree with #4? If you're playing better than someone and getting less playing time and getting paid less, there will be friction. No one gives a **** about how good they used to be. Every single person on this team is hungry. They're not just here to make Gordon's life as comfortable as possible.

The best five players on this team include Gordon Hayward.

Based on what data? This is your opinion and is so obviously wrong that even Stevens had to bench him. You know how bad it is to bench your max guy? He just wasnt playing well. And he was starting. And that probably p---ed off teammates. However good he is today or in Utah is completely irrelevant.

They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team.

Also while I love Baynes, there's no world where I think he's one of the 5 best Celtics' players, despite sometimes being in the starting lineup.

And Erik, what kind of data do you need?  For players that have played at least 50 minutes Hayward is:

4th in PER
4th in WS
3rd in OBPM
3rd in DBPM
3rd in BPM
3rd in VORP
3rd in +/-
1st in DRtg

The only stat I can find where Hayward is not top 5 is ORtg (where he comes in 6th ahead of Brown, Tatum, Morris, and Rozier).

What data are you seeing that shows Hayward is not one of the top 5 Celtics?

I was going to look at these stats later. Thanks. I think these stats pretty much summarize the truth.

Gordon Hayward has struggled through the early part of this season, but the narrative in this thread that everything is his fault, or that he was gifted playing time, or that he is entitled is simple wrong.
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Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #35 on: December 06, 2018, 02:46:23 PM »

Offline Moranis

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It was certainly not my intention to trigger so many emotional and somewhat unhinged responses to what seems like a fairly obvious contrast in situations to an objective observer.

Smart has returned from MANY injuries with an accelerated timeline and to my memory has never been afforded the myriad of excuses that have recently been offered for Hayward's poor performance.  Images of him diving for loose balls in the playoffs last year after tearing the ligament that prevents your thumb from dislocating are still fresh in my mind.   

I'm actually a fan of both players, sorry to ruin the lazy and inaccurate narrative that I just don't "like" Hayward.

However, I do feel it's undeniable that: 1. Hayward was being cheered in this arena while playing for another team 2: Was out of a walking boot before the end of LAST season. 3. Didn't show any real urgency to make it back onto the court. 4. Was given playing time without having to earn it with his play.

I expect these factors most likely rubbed some of his teammates who weren't gifted max contracts at the request of their former college coach the wrong way.

1 and 2 are undeniable facts. 3 and 4 are opinions I disagree with.

Agree that #3 is highly questionable and straight up unfair. I'm pretty sure the Celtics flat out told him that he couldn't return that season.

However, you really disagree with #4? If you're playing better than someone and getting less playing time and getting paid less, there will be friction. No one gives a **** about how good they used to be. Every single person on this team is hungry. They're not just here to make Gordon's life as comfortable as possible.

The best five players on this team include Gordon Hayward.

Based on what data? This is your opinion and is so obviously wrong that even Stevens had to bench him. You know how bad it is to bench your max guy? He just wasnt playing well. And he was starting. And that probably p---ed off teammates. However good he is today or in Utah is completely irrelevant.

They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team.

Also while I love Baynes, there's no world where I think he's one of the 5 best Celtics' players, despite sometimes being in the starting lineup.

And Erik, what kind of data do you need?  For players that have played at least 50 minutes Hayward is:

4th in PER
4th in WS
3rd in OBPM
3rd in DBPM
3rd in BPM
3rd in VORP
3rd in +/-
1st in DRtg

The only stat I can find where Hayward is not top 5 is ORtg (where he comes in 6th ahead of Brown, Tatum, Morris, and Rozier).

What data are you seeing that shows Hayward is not one of the top 5 Celtics?
heck taking advanced metrics out of it, he is

5th in mpg
5th in ppg (6th in shots)
4th in rpg
3rd in apg
3rd in spg

Hayward has pretty clearly been a top 5 Celtic this year and he is only going to climb up that list until he ends up where he belongs at the top of it.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #36 on: December 06, 2018, 03:59:12 PM »

Online SparzWizard

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It wouldn't even matter in a positive light if he came back for last year's playoffs. You'd see the same performance he was making around October/November or probably worse. That's because he'd been rushed to get back.

But that was never happening anyway with that second surgery.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #37 on: December 06, 2018, 06:16:25 PM »

Offline Erik

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It was certainly not my intention to trigger so many emotional and somewhat unhinged responses to what seems like a fairly obvious contrast in situations to an objective observer.

Smart has returned from MANY injuries with an accelerated timeline and to my memory has never been afforded the myriad of excuses that have recently been offered for Hayward's poor performance.  Images of him diving for loose balls in the playoffs last year after tearing the ligament that prevents your thumb from dislocating are still fresh in my mind.   

I'm actually a fan of both players, sorry to ruin the lazy and inaccurate narrative that I just don't "like" Hayward.

However, I do feel it's undeniable that: 1. Hayward was being cheered in this arena while playing for another team 2: Was out of a walking boot before the end of LAST season. 3. Didn't show any real urgency to make it back onto the court. 4. Was given playing time without having to earn it with his play.

I expect these factors most likely rubbed some of his teammates who weren't gifted max contracts at the request of their former college coach the wrong way.

1 and 2 are undeniable facts. 3 and 4 are opinions I disagree with.

Agree that #3 is highly questionable and straight up unfair. I'm pretty sure the Celtics flat out told him that he couldn't return that season.

However, you really disagree with #4? If you're playing better than someone and getting less playing time and getting paid less, there will be friction. No one gives a **** about how good they used to be. Every single person on this team is hungry. They're not just here to make Gordon's life as comfortable as possible.

The best five players on this team include Gordon Hayward.

Based on what data? This is your opinion and is so obviously wrong that even Stevens had to bench him. You know how bad it is to bench your max guy? He just wasnt playing well. And he was starting. And that probably p---ed off teammates. However good he is today or in Utah is completely irrelevant.

They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team.

Also while I love Baynes, there's no world where I think he's one of the 5 best Celtics' players, despite sometimes being in the starting lineup.

And Erik, what kind of data do you need?  For players that have played at least 50 minutes Hayward is:

4th in PER
4th in WS
3rd in OBPM
3rd in DBPM
3rd in BPM
3rd in VORP
3rd in +/-
1st in DRtg

The only stat I can find where Hayward is not top 5 is ORtg (where he comes in 6th ahead of Brown, Tatum, Morris, and Rozier).

What data are you seeing that shows Hayward is not one of the top 5 Celtics?
heck taking advanced metrics out of it, he is

5th in mpg
5th in ppg (6th in shots)
4th in rpg
3rd in apg
3rd in spg

Hayward has pretty clearly been a top 5 Celtic this year and he is only going to climb up that list until he ends up where he belongs at the top of it.

Are you guys including data after he got benched (you know... started playing well)?

I'm saying that he was terrible for the start and he shouldn't have been a starter until he proved himself. This probably created team friction.

Also, Marcus Smart is not a statistically relevant player (you can't use stats to rank him).

"They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team."

So what is going to be your excuse when he is put back into the starting lineup? They fixed the lineup issues? Bull. He sucked, was pulling the team down, and he got benched.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 06:34:13 PM by Erik »

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #38 on: December 06, 2018, 07:01:46 PM »

Offline GreenEnvy

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It was certainly not my intention to trigger so many emotional and somewhat unhinged responses to what seems like a fairly obvious contrast in situations to an objective observer.

Smart has returned from MANY injuries with an accelerated timeline and to my memory has never been afforded the myriad of excuses that have recently been offered for Hayward's poor performance.  Images of him diving for loose balls in the playoffs last year after tearing the ligament that prevents your thumb from dislocating are still fresh in my mind.   

I'm actually a fan of both players, sorry to ruin the lazy and inaccurate narrative that I just don't "like" Hayward.

However, I do feel it's undeniable that: 1. Hayward was being cheered in this arena while playing for another team 2: Was out of a walking boot before the end of LAST season. 3. Didn't show any real urgency to make it back onto the court. 4. Was given playing time without having to earn it with his play.

I expect these factors most likely rubbed some of his teammates who weren't gifted max contracts at the request of their former college coach the wrong way.

1 and 2 are undeniable facts. 3 and 4 are opinions I disagree with.

Agree that #3 is highly questionable and straight up unfair. I'm pretty sure the Celtics flat out told him that he couldn't return that season.

However, you really disagree with #4? If you're playing better than someone and getting less playing time and getting paid less, there will be friction. No one gives a **** about how good they used to be. Every single person on this team is hungry. They're not just here to make Gordon's life as comfortable as possible.

The best five players on this team include Gordon Hayward.

Based on what data? This is your opinion and is so obviously wrong that even Stevens had to bench him. You know how bad it is to bench your max guy? He just wasnt playing well. And he was starting. And that probably p---ed off teammates. However good he is today or in Utah is completely irrelevant.

They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team.

Also while I love Baynes, there's no world where I think he's one of the 5 best Celtics' players, despite sometimes being in the starting lineup.

And Erik, what kind of data do you need?  For players that have played at least 50 minutes Hayward is:

4th in PER
4th in WS
3rd in OBPM
3rd in DBPM
3rd in BPM
3rd in VORP
3rd in +/-
1st in DRtg

The only stat I can find where Hayward is not top 5 is ORtg (where he comes in 6th ahead of Brown, Tatum, Morris, and Rozier).

What data are you seeing that shows Hayward is not one of the top 5 Celtics?
heck taking advanced metrics out of it, he is

5th in mpg
5th in ppg (6th in shots)
4th in rpg
3rd in apg
3rd in spg

Hayward has pretty clearly been a top 5 Celtic this year and he is only going to climb up that list until he ends up where he belongs at the top of it.

Are you guys including data after he got benched (you know... started playing well)?

I'm saying that he was terrible for the start and he shouldn't have been a starter until he proved himself. This probably created team friction.

Also, Marcus Smart is not a statistically relevant player (you can't use stats to rank him).

"They benched Hayward for lineup reasons. He still finishes games, which demonstrates he is one of the five best players on the team."

So what is going to be your excuse when he is put back into the starting lineup? They fixed the lineup issues? Bull. He sucked, was pulling the team down, and he got benched.

Should his stats as a reserve not count? Why, because it doesn’t fit your narrative?

I never understood the argument that he has to earn anything. He is a max all-star coming off an injury. So Semi should get minutes over him because he banged a couple treys in the playoffs and defended some tough covers?

He wasn’t the only terrible one from the start, and he’s probably the only one who had a reason. Yet he gets most of the blame. His move to the bench was not because he was bad, but more to get others (Brown) going. Gordon doesn’t need other great players around him to be better, he makes others around him better.

When he gets moved back into the starting lineup, there won’t be as many issues because as we can see, he plays well with Irving, Tatum, and Horford. The issue is seemingly Brown, who’s also been stinking it up out there.

If this is truly a “play well or be benched” team, all the starters should’ve been benched at some point.
I AM A CELTIC

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #39 on: December 06, 2018, 07:06:13 PM »

Offline GreenFaith1819

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Brought me so much joy to see Gordon Hayward break loose like he did..

Even more joy to see his teammates tease him while he was being interviewed after the big game.

We are going to see MORE games like this from him. After all - this was TYPICAL (give or take a few points, rebs, and assists) of what he did in Utah prior to coming to BOS.

Will he do this EVERY game? Of course not....not yet. But he is getting CLOSER........

GH being our Swiss Army knife...Jaylen and Tatum looking to put someone on a poster and being our young studs...Kyrie going off on his scoring binges...Smart being the Green Bull in our opponent's China shops...Big Al anchoring our defense......

Great bench with Morris, Theis, Baynes, Smart, Scary T...interchangeable parts....starters offering to come off the bench...all for the TEAM..

Three wins in a row (so far)...several solid wins (PHI, MIL, TOR, MIN)...

Things coming together for GH (and this TEAM)...

By June we'll all be like



And I love it.
Marcus Smart "Impacts Winning." Boston Celtics Coach Brad Stevens

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #40 on: December 06, 2018, 07:29:56 PM »

Offline Erik

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Answers in-line:

Should his stats as a reserve not count? Why, because it doesn’t fit your narrative?
Yes, that's actually exactly why. I made an argument that he sucked before being benched and I was told that I'm incorrect because of stats X, Y and Z that included his time on the bench. If you're going to disprove my original argument, use the correct stats.

I never understood the argument that he has to earn anything. He is a max all-star coming off an injury. So Semi should get minutes over him because he banged a couple treys in the playoffs and defended some tough covers?
He is coming off a major injury and had 5 minutes and 15 seconds of chemistry with the team. He should have started on the bench, gained some confidence, and earned his minutes. It would have helped his confidence to beat up on 2nd tier players and shown some leadership. Instead, he was gifted a slot because of his former self (which he's obviously a starter on the team prior to injury) and that probably p---ed off some of his teammates.

He wasn’t the only terrible one from the start, and he’s probably the only one who had a reason. Yet he gets most of the blame. His move to the bench was not because he was bad, but more to get others (Brown) going. Gordon doesn’t need other great players around him to be better, he makes others around him better.
You're absolutely correct that it is unfair to place all of the blame on him. I place all of the blame on Brad Stevens for starting him. He saw his error and corrected it. You have to get the guy's confidence back before throwing him to the wolves. By the way, I'm not sure how you can see his move to the bench anything other than shaking up the lineup for wins. Morris and Smart have been playing well -- they got inserted into the starting lineup. Sorry, but it's not rocket science.

When he gets moved back into the starting lineup, there won’t be as many issues because as we can see, he plays well with Irving, Tatum, and Horford. The issue is seemingly Brown, who’s also been stinking it up out there.

If this is truly a “play well or be benched” team, all the starters should’ve been benched at some point.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #41 on: December 06, 2018, 07:54:09 PM »

Offline hpantazo

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Answers in-line:

Should his stats as a reserve not count? Why, because it doesn’t fit your narrative?
Yes, that's actually exactly why. I made an argument that he sucked before being benched and I was told that I'm incorrect because of stats X, Y and Z that included his time on the bench. If you're going to disprove my original argument, use the correct stats.

I never understood the argument that he has to earn anything. He is a max all-star coming off an injury. So Semi should get minutes over him because he banged a couple treys in the playoffs and defended some tough covers?
He is coming off a major injury and had 5 minutes and 15 seconds of chemistry with the team. He should have started on the bench, gained some confidence, and earned his minutes. It would have helped his confidence to beat up on 2nd tier players and shown some leadership. Instead, he was gifted a slot because of his former self (which he's obviously a starter on the team prior to injury) and that probably p---ed off some of his teammates.

He wasn’t the only terrible one from the start, and he’s probably the only one who had a reason. Yet he gets most of the blame. His move to the bench was not because he was bad, but more to get others (Brown) going. Gordon doesn’t need other great players around him to be better, he makes others around him better.
You're absolutely correct that it is unfair to place all of the blame on him. I place all of the blame on Brad Stevens for starting him. He saw his error and corrected it. You have to get the guy's confidence back before throwing him to the wolves. By the way, I'm not sure how you can see his move to the bench anything other than shaking up the lineup for wins. Morris and Smart have been playing well -- they got inserted into the starting lineup. Sorry, but it's not rocket science.

When he gets moved back into the starting lineup, there won’t be as many issues because as we can see, he plays well with Irving, Tatum, and Horford. The issue is seemingly Brown, who’s also been stinking it up out there.

If this is truly a “play well or be benched” team, all the starters should’ve been benched at some point.


I'm afraid your posts regarding Hayward are not going to age well.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #42 on: December 06, 2018, 08:20:23 PM »

Offline celtics4ever33

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Every Marcus smart fan wanted to make him more valuable,  the way to do that is by crediting him with all the positives the team does and also by discrediting all the positive any other player does. Give them a break, they love smart. The ugly duckling always gets the best treatment.

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #43 on: December 06, 2018, 08:20:37 PM »

Offline Erik

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Even if he becomes the best player in the league, why wouldn't my post age well?

Like, just think through what I'm saying before commenting.

He was playing bad.
He shouldn't have been a starter at the start of the season until fully proving that he was back in good form.

Where is the part that won't age well?
Let's say he turns out to be the best player in the league. What will you do? Reference my comment that he played bad at the start of the season and didn't deserve a starter role until fully back from the injury as a sign that I'm an idiot? The two thoughts have nothing to do with each other as I'm not arguing against the thought that he will probably be the best or 2nd best player on the team soon.
« Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 08:26:10 PM by Erik »

Re: Hayward's free pass has been revoked...
« Reply #44 on: December 06, 2018, 09:28:30 PM »

Offline RockinRyA

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Even if he becomes the best player in the league, why wouldn't my post age well?

Like, just think through what I'm saying before commenting.

He was playing bad.
He shouldn't have been a starter at the start of the season until fully proving that he was back in good form.

Where is the part that won't age well?
Let's say he turns out to be the best player in the league. What will you do? Reference my comment that he played bad at the start of the season and didn't deserve a starter role until fully back from the injury as a sign that I'm an idiot? The two thoughts have nothing to do with each other as I'm not arguing against the thought that he will probably be the best or 2nd best player on the team soon.

he was actually starting to play better before getting benched. He wasnt benched because he's not top 5. Heck he got benched in favor of Baynes, is baynes top 5?!

 

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