Author Topic: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?  (Read 9707 times)

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Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #30 on: October 23, 2018, 01:51:47 PM »

Offline GreenShooter

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Does anybody remember Lebron’s first season with the Heat? Everybody was tentative with their roles, including Lebron and Wade. Too much deference to others.

That’s what we’re seeing here. Either Kyrie or Hayward needs to step up as the alpha.
I think you will see this team take off once GH dunks on someone. It doesn't have to be Giannis but it has to be somebody. Sounds stupid but this team, and Gordon, need this to happen so they can start playing for real.

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #31 on: October 23, 2018, 01:52:24 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Morphing into Jeff Green before our eyes.

Not close.
Promising first two years and then completely leveled off and disappears at key moments.  That is Jeff Green.  So far that is Jaylen Brown.  Brown certainly can turn it around, but 4 games into year 3, he is following the Jeff Green path pretty darn well.

Did Green ever average 18 / 5 / .549 eFG% in the playoffs, falling one game short of the Finals?  All before age 22?
You know as well as I do that the Thunder did not make the playoffs in either of Green's first 2 seasons in the league.

And we've gone through these comparisons before, but here are their first two seasons per 36 (and they had similar roles and minutes).

Year 1
13.8 p, 5.9 r, 1.7 a, 0.9 s, 0.5 b, 1.8 t, 3.8 f - 50.7 2PT, 34.1 3PT, 68.5 FT (53.9 TS)
13.4 p, 6.1 r, 1.9 a, 0.7 s, 0.8 b, 2.5 t, 3.2 f - 44.4 2PT, 27.6 3PT, 74.4 FT (49.1 TS)

Year 2
17.0 p, 5.8 r, 1.9 a, 1.2 s, 0.4 b, 2.1 t, 3.0 f - 50.7 2PT, 39.5 3PT, 64.4 FT (56.2 TS)
16.2 p, 6.5 r, 1.9 a, 1.0 s, 0.4 b, 2.2 t, 2.5 f - 46.3 2PT, 38.9 3PT, 78.8 FT (53.6 TS)

Fairly similar numbers in year 1 and year 2 for both them.  Similar jumps in production.  Green leveled off completely and never got any better.  Brown was about a year younger in each season, so he has that going for him and he has been the better shooter. 

I believe Brown will continue to grow because that is what most players do, but Jeff Green did not and he is not the only player that peaked very early in his career.  Couple that with their overall first 2 years numbers being similar.  And like Green, Brown is being squeezed out for better players that weren't around his first couple of seasons and also is arguably being forced to play out of position to accommodate those better players (Durant forced Green to play PF and Russ, Harden, and Ibaka were all added after Green - similarly Hayward/Tatum are forcing Brown to play SG, who along with Irving were all added after Brown joined the team).

I love this. Thanks for giving us precedent to make comparisons via raw numbers.

Since you’re so great at it, let’s pull up first and second year Kobe Bryant numbers and place them next to Jaylen Brown’s. They’re incredibly similar, would you say that comparing the two of them is fair?

No, you wouldn’t. A bit of advice, look up the term confirmation bias.
Kobe's numbers aren't actually that similar.  His role was also a lot different than either Brown or Green (by year 2, Brown and Green were full time starters playing in the 30 mpg range, Kobe started 1 game his 2nd year).  Kobe also came out of high school and didn't have 2 or 3 years of college.   And the comparison isn't just per 36, it is role, totals, etc.  Brown and Green are very similar comparisons through 2 seasons. 

As I said, I would expect Brown to continue to improve, unlike Green, but you can't totally right off the possibility that maybe Brown is who he is at this point.  Not every player goes through a Giannis, Butler, Leonard, Kobe, etc. type progression.  Some guys enter the league and just don't get all that much better like Jeff Green, Kelly Olynyk, etc.  Heck Marcus Smart is basically the same player he was after year 2 that is now (stronger a bit better defensively, but essentially the same type and level of player).   

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #32 on: October 23, 2018, 01:55:18 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Morphing into Jeff Green before our eyes.

Not close.
Promising first two years and then completely leveled off and disappears at key moments.  That is Jeff Green.  So far that is Jaylen Brown.  Brown certainly can turn it around, but 4 games into year 3, he is following the Jeff Green path pretty darn well.

Did Green ever average 18 / 5 / .549 eFG% in the playoffs, falling one game short of the Finals?  All before age 22?
You know as well as I do that the Thunder did not make the playoffs in either of Green's first 2 seasons in the league.

And we've gone through these comparisons before, but here are their first two seasons per 36 (and they had similar roles and minutes).

Year 1
13.8 p, 5.9 r, 1.7 a, 0.9 s, 0.5 b, 1.8 t, 3.8 f - 50.7 2PT, 34.1 3PT, 68.5 FT (53.9 TS)
13.4 p, 6.1 r, 1.9 a, 0.7 s, 0.8 b, 2.5 t, 3.2 f - 44.4 2PT, 27.6 3PT, 74.4 FT (49.1 TS)

Year 2
17.0 p, 5.8 r, 1.9 a, 1.2 s, 0.4 b, 2.1 t, 3.0 f - 50.7 2PT, 39.5 3PT, 64.4 FT (56.2 TS)
16.2 p, 6.5 r, 1.9 a, 1.0 s, 0.4 b, 2.2 t, 2.5 f - 46.3 2PT, 38.9 3PT, 78.8 FT (53.6 TS)

Fairly similar numbers in year 1 and year 2 for both them.  Similar jumps in production.  Green leveled off completely and never got any better.  Brown was about a year younger in each season, so he has that going for him and he has been the better shooter. 

I believe Brown will continue to grow because that is what most players do, but Jeff Green did not and he is not the only player that peaked very early in his career.  Couple that with their overall first 2 years numbers being similar.  And like Green, Brown is being squeezed out for better players that weren't around his first couple of seasons and also is arguably being forced to play out of position to accommodate those better players (Durant forced Green to play PF and Russ, Harden, and Ibaka were all added after Green - similarly Hayward/Tatum are forcing Brown to play SG, who along with Irving were all added after Brown joined the team).

Going by your logic does that mean Fultz is a bust after 4 games?
Who said anything about Brown being bust?  And including the playoffs, Fultz has played 20 games in his career.  If you can't see the difference, I don't know what to tell you.

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #33 on: October 23, 2018, 01:57:40 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Morphing into Jeff Green before our eyes.

Not close.
Promising first two years and then completely leveled off and disappears at key moments.  That is Jeff Green.  So far that is Jaylen Brown.  Brown certainly can turn it around, but 4 games into year 3, he is following the Jeff Green path pretty darn well.
says the guy who proclaimed Fultz to be a highly valuable trade chip in the Kawhi sweepstakes as well as the same guy who treats everyone in Celtic green as a scrub while players on other teams are always so much better than the ones we have.

your talent evaluation isn't the greatest.

at some point Brown will get his mojo back.   if nothing else, he'll be better than Green if for no other reason than he'll put more effort in on defense every night
Come on, I was merely talking about what was reported i.e. that had the Sixers included Fultz, Leonard would have been in Philadelphia right now.  That isn't my opinion on that at all.  I think the red flags with Fultz are absolutely there and he may never recover and live up to the potential, but as I said in my previous post, Fultz has played just 20 games in his career.  That is a bit early to write off his talent. 

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #34 on: October 23, 2018, 01:59:37 PM »

Offline Rondo9

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Morphing into Jeff Green before our eyes.

Not close.
Promising first two years and then completely leveled off and disappears at key moments.  That is Jeff Green.  So far that is Jaylen Brown.  Brown certainly can turn it around, but 4 games into year 3, he is following the Jeff Green path pretty darn well.

Did Green ever average 18 / 5 / .549 eFG% in the playoffs, falling one game short of the Finals?  All before age 22?
You know as well as I do that the Thunder did not make the playoffs in either of Green's first 2 seasons in the league.

And we've gone through these comparisons before, but here are their first two seasons per 36 (and they had similar roles and minutes).

Year 1
13.8 p, 5.9 r, 1.7 a, 0.9 s, 0.5 b, 1.8 t, 3.8 f - 50.7 2PT, 34.1 3PT, 68.5 FT (53.9 TS)
13.4 p, 6.1 r, 1.9 a, 0.7 s, 0.8 b, 2.5 t, 3.2 f - 44.4 2PT, 27.6 3PT, 74.4 FT (49.1 TS)

Year 2
17.0 p, 5.8 r, 1.9 a, 1.2 s, 0.4 b, 2.1 t, 3.0 f - 50.7 2PT, 39.5 3PT, 64.4 FT (56.2 TS)
16.2 p, 6.5 r, 1.9 a, 1.0 s, 0.4 b, 2.2 t, 2.5 f - 46.3 2PT, 38.9 3PT, 78.8 FT (53.6 TS)

Fairly similar numbers in year 1 and year 2 for both them.  Similar jumps in production.  Green leveled off completely and never got any better.  Brown was about a year younger in each season, so he has that going for him and he has been the better shooter. 

I believe Brown will continue to grow because that is what most players do, but Jeff Green did not and he is not the only player that peaked very early in his career.  Couple that with their overall first 2 years numbers being similar.  And like Green, Brown is being squeezed out for better players that weren't around his first couple of seasons and also is arguably being forced to play out of position to accommodate those better players (Durant forced Green to play PF and Russ, Harden, and Ibaka were all added after Green - similarly Hayward/Tatum are forcing Brown to play SG, who along with Irving were all added after Brown joined the team).

Going by your logic does that mean Fultz is a bust after 4 games?
Who said anything about Brown being bust?  And including the playoffs, Fultz has played 20 games in his career.  If you can't see the difference, I don't know what to tell you.

And if you're so eager to compare brown to green after 4 games then you need to reevaluate. Give it time.

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #35 on: October 23, 2018, 02:03:52 PM »

Offline Smartacus

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Not too impressed with Jaylen so far but I did really like what I saw from that 3 he hit towards the end of the game that put us within striking distance.

I give TMac a lot of credit for teaching Jaylen that he needs to learn how to operate in limited space. They played 1 on 1 games this offseason where they had to score on the defender without dribbling.

I feel like Jaylen has never had much coaching that didn't just focus on making him and transition player and open shooter. TMac showed Jaylen he isn't always going to be completely open but needs to be able to capitalize even when he's got a defender in his face. 

Late in the 4th last night Jaylen received the pass and leaned into his shot in such a way that his defender was unable to bother his 3. IMO if he can figure out how to hit that consistently that is the type of play that turns Jaylen from a respectable 3 and D player to a top 10 wing in the NBA.

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #36 on: October 23, 2018, 02:03:54 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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Kobe also came out of high school and didn't have 2 or 3 years of college.

Quote
(by year 2, Brown and Green were full time starters playing in the 30 mpg range, Kobe started 1 game his 2nd year).

You understand you're talking out of both sides of your mouth, right?

Brown didn't have 2 or 3 years of college, either.  He played one year, which is closer to Kobe's zero than to Green's three.

Similarly, all three players became starters at different times:  Green was force fed minutes as a rookie, Jaylen earned his minutes as a sophomore, and Kobe became a full-time starter in year three.  Notably, though, Kobe and Jaylen played fairly similar minutes their first two years (17 mins / 31 minutes for Jaylen, 16 mins / 26 mins for Kobe).

And, despite being more similar to Kobe in career arc, he's no more likely to turn into Kobe than he is into Green.


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Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #37 on: October 23, 2018, 02:06:09 PM »

Offline Moranis

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The idea that you can judge Jaylen Brown's entire third year and determine he has leveled off as a player 4 games into his third year is pretty stunning. I am using the word stunning to be respectful.

A 4 game sample size is not a large enough sample size to judge a player's entire year. I am very surprised by the very intelligent posters on this board that are doing so.

Brown developed from raw talent to very exciting as a rookie when he started for a hurt Avery Bradley. He came back his sophomore year and had amazing development in all phases of his game. In the playoffs, even though he got hurt and played so for the last games in the series, he grew again and was the best Celtics on the floor most nights, even scoring 30+ points in two games becoming the youngest Celtic to ever score 30 points in a playoff game.

He has struggled through 4 games. I am going to wait and see before making declarative statements on any of the Celtic players this year and the team as a whole. Let's not forget, this team was 2-2 after 4 games last year as well.
I didn't mean to imply I was writing off Brown's 3rd year, just 4 games in, but a lot of what I mentioned in a post after this has to be concerning. 

Brown probably should be a SF.  His ball handling isn't really good enough to be a SG and he struggles defensively with the quicker guards.  With Hayward and Tatum, though, Brown's only real long term minutes will be at SG.  I am concerned about him doing that long term as I think it will continue to cause issues for him.   

In addition, he went from the 2nd option on offense last year (behind Irving) to now at best the 4th option (Irving, Hayward, and Tatum), and I think he is struggling a great deal with that change in role.  I'd like to think he recovers and figures it out, but that can often be a tough pill to swallow and to adjust to.  Tying into that, how does he get his shots?  He isn't a great ball handler, he is perhaps the worst shooter in the starting lineup, he isn't going to be a guy that is crashing the boards and taking it coast to coast.  Last year, when he was the secondary ball handler, it was a lot easier for him to find his offense, that won't be the case this year, and I'm concerned about how he gets shots, other than when he gets the ball on kick-outs and essentially becomes a spot-up shooter (which isn't his strong point). 

And we can't forget the long stretches last year, where it looked like Brown wasn't in the game.  This disappearing act is not a new thing this year.  Brown often lacked initiative on offense last year.  Now that he is down the pecking order and has the ball less, I think there are real concerns that he has a lot of games where you forget he is on the floor. 

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #38 on: October 23, 2018, 02:08:57 PM »

Offline Moranis

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Morphing into Jeff Green before our eyes.

Not close.
Promising first two years and then completely leveled off and disappears at key moments.  That is Jeff Green.  So far that is Jaylen Brown.  Brown certainly can turn it around, but 4 games into year 3, he is following the Jeff Green path pretty darn well.

Did Green ever average 18 / 5 / .549 eFG% in the playoffs, falling one game short of the Finals?  All before age 22?
You know as well as I do that the Thunder did not make the playoffs in either of Green's first 2 seasons in the league.

And we've gone through these comparisons before, but here are their first two seasons per 36 (and they had similar roles and minutes).

Year 1
13.8 p, 5.9 r, 1.7 a, 0.9 s, 0.5 b, 1.8 t, 3.8 f - 50.7 2PT, 34.1 3PT, 68.5 FT (53.9 TS)
13.4 p, 6.1 r, 1.9 a, 0.7 s, 0.8 b, 2.5 t, 3.2 f - 44.4 2PT, 27.6 3PT, 74.4 FT (49.1 TS)

Year 2
17.0 p, 5.8 r, 1.9 a, 1.2 s, 0.4 b, 2.1 t, 3.0 f - 50.7 2PT, 39.5 3PT, 64.4 FT (56.2 TS)
16.2 p, 6.5 r, 1.9 a, 1.0 s, 0.4 b, 2.2 t, 2.5 f - 46.3 2PT, 38.9 3PT, 78.8 FT (53.6 TS)

Fairly similar numbers in year 1 and year 2 for both them.  Similar jumps in production.  Green leveled off completely and never got any better.  Brown was about a year younger in each season, so he has that going for him and he has been the better shooter. 

I believe Brown will continue to grow because that is what most players do, but Jeff Green did not and he is not the only player that peaked very early in his career.  Couple that with their overall first 2 years numbers being similar.  And like Green, Brown is being squeezed out for better players that weren't around his first couple of seasons and also is arguably being forced to play out of position to accommodate those better players (Durant forced Green to play PF and Russ, Harden, and Ibaka were all added after Green - similarly Hayward/Tatum are forcing Brown to play SG, who along with Irving were all added after Brown joined the team).

Going by your logic does that mean Fultz is a bust after 4 games?
Who said anything about Brown being bust?  And including the playoffs, Fultz has played 20 games in his career.  If you can't see the difference, I don't know what to tell you.

And if you're so eager to compare brown to green after 4 games then you need to reevaluate. Give it time.
I compared their first 2 years, not 4 games.  I'm not sure what you are getting at.

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #39 on: October 23, 2018, 02:24:23 PM »

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The idea that you can judge Jaylen Brown's entire third year and determine he has leveled off as a player 4 games into his third year is pretty stunning. I am using the word stunning to be respectful.

A 4 game sample size is not a large enough sample size to judge a player's entire year. I am very surprised by the very intelligent posters on this board that are doing so.

Brown developed from raw talent to very exciting as a rookie when he started for a hurt Avery Bradley. He came back his sophomore year and had amazing development in all phases of his game. In the playoffs, even though he got hurt and played so for the last games in the series, he grew again and was the best Celtics on the floor most nights, even scoring 30+ points in two games becoming the youngest Celtic to ever score 30 points in a playoff game.

He has struggled through 4 games. I am going to wait and see before making declarative statements on any of the Celtic players this year and the team as a whole. Let's not forget, this team was 2-2 after 4 games last year as well.
I didn't mean to imply I was writing off Brown's 3rd year, just 4 games in, but a lot of what I mentioned in a post after this has to be concerning. 

No it doesn't mean it has to be concerning. You are just using your confirmation bias to make a silly comparison. As was pointed out, you can use Kobe's first two years and say he will be the next Kobe. You can use Jimmy Butler's first two years and say he will be better than Jimmy Butler. You can use James Harden's first two years and say he will be the next Harden.

Also, your concerns about him guarding SG's makes zero sense. Jaylen Brown finished 9th for DPOY, ahead of defensive star Marcus Smart. Ahead of great SG defenders like Klay Thompson and Victor Oladipo. Brown's defensive FG% guarded was like a -6 something, one of the best in the league.

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #40 on: October 23, 2018, 02:25:39 PM »

Offline greenrunsdeep41

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Kobe also came out of high school and didn't have 2 or 3 years of college.

Quote
(by year 2, Brown and Green were full time starters playing in the 30 mpg range, Kobe started 1 game his 2nd year).

You understand you're talking out of both sides of your mouth, right?

Brown didn't have 2 or 3 years of college, either.  He played one year, which is closer to Kobe's zero than to Green's three.

Similarly, all three players became starters at different times:  Green was force fed minutes as a rookie, Jaylen earned his minutes as a sophomore, and Kobe became a full-time starter in year three.  Notably, though, Kobe and Jaylen played fairly similar minutes their first two years (17 mins / 31 minutes for Jaylen, 16 mins / 26 mins for Kobe).

And, despite being more similar to Kobe in career arc, he's no more likely to turn into Kobe than he is into Green.

Thanks, Roy. Couldn’t agree more with this assessment.

Outside of the way Brown runs with his arms strait and your poorly developed political arguments, I couldn’t be happier that Celtics basketball is back. 😂 TP

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #41 on: October 23, 2018, 02:45:51 PM »

Offline Moranis

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The idea that you can judge Jaylen Brown's entire third year and determine he has leveled off as a player 4 games into his third year is pretty stunning. I am using the word stunning to be respectful.

A 4 game sample size is not a large enough sample size to judge a player's entire year. I am very surprised by the very intelligent posters on this board that are doing so.

Brown developed from raw talent to very exciting as a rookie when he started for a hurt Avery Bradley. He came back his sophomore year and had amazing development in all phases of his game. In the playoffs, even though he got hurt and played so for the last games in the series, he grew again and was the best Celtics on the floor most nights, even scoring 30+ points in two games becoming the youngest Celtic to ever score 30 points in a playoff game.

He has struggled through 4 games. I am going to wait and see before making declarative statements on any of the Celtic players this year and the team as a whole. Let's not forget, this team was 2-2 after 4 games last year as well.
I didn't mean to imply I was writing off Brown's 3rd year, just 4 games in, but a lot of what I mentioned in a post after this has to be concerning. 

No it doesn't mean it has to be concerning. You are just using your confirmation bias to make a silly comparison. As was pointed out, you can use Kobe's first two years and say he will be the next Kobe. You can use Jimmy Butler's first two years and say he will be better than Jimmy Butler. You can use James Harden's first two years and say he will be the next Harden.

Also, your concerns about him guarding SG's makes zero sense. Jaylen Brown finished 9th for DPOY, ahead of defensive star Marcus Smart. Ahead of great SG defenders like Klay Thompson and Victor Oladipo. Brown's defensive FG% guarded was like a -6 something, one of the best in the league.
half his time last year he was a SF.  he was worse at SG.  In the playoffs, he had the worst DRTG of all of the starters in the 2 series he was a starter, playing the SG position, and to be clear it isn't like the Cavs and Bucks have great SG's.  Time will of course bear all of this out, but I really don't like Brown at SG.  I think he is a much better player at SF, and I would expect to see him to continue to struggle playing SG basically full time (especially when Hayward is back to a full load minutes wise).  I'd love to be wrong, but Brown just feels like a SF to me when I watch him play, both offensively and defensively, and that is never going to be his role on a team that has 2 better players at the SF then he is (even if Tatum spends most of his time at PF, which I don't think is ideal, but I have far more confidence in Tatum at PF then I do then Brown at SG). 

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #42 on: October 23, 2018, 02:49:13 PM »

Offline slamtheking

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Morphing into Jeff Green before our eyes.

Not close.
Promising first two years and then completely leveled off and disappears at key moments.  That is Jeff Green.  So far that is Jaylen Brown.  Brown certainly can turn it around, but 4 games into year 3, he is following the Jeff Green path pretty darn well.
says the guy who proclaimed Fultz to be a highly valuable trade chip in the Kawhi sweepstakes as well as the same guy who treats everyone in Celtic green as a scrub while players on other teams are always so much better than the ones we have.

your talent evaluation isn't the greatest.

at some point Brown will get his mojo back.   if nothing else, he'll be better than Green if for no other reason than he'll put more effort in on defense every night
Come on, I was merely talking about what was reported i.e. that had the Sixers included Fultz, Leonard would have been in Philadelphia right now.  That isn't my opinion on that at all.  I think the red flags with Fultz are absolutely there and he may never recover and live up to the potential, but as I said in my previous post, Fultz has played just 20 games in his career.  That is a bit early to write off his talent. 
to give you the benefit of the doubt that this is really what you meant, allow me to let you know that what you just posted is not what came across in any of your posts on that topic. 

that aside, Brown a better defender than Green and tends to show effort a lot more often than Green.  his shot is off so far this year but barring unanticipated PTSD from game 7 in the ECF where his offense was total crap, he should break out of this funk at some point (hopefully very soon).

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #43 on: October 23, 2018, 05:26:58 PM »

Offline smokeablount

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Morphing into Jeff Green before our eyes.

Not close.
Promising first two years and then completely leveled off and disappears at key moments.  That is Jeff Green.  So far that is Jaylen Brown.  Brown certainly can turn it around, but 4 games into year 3, he is following the Jeff Green path pretty darn well.

Did Green ever average 18 / 5 / .549 eFG% in the playoffs, falling one game short of the Finals?  All before age 22?
You know as well as I do that the Thunder did not make the playoffs in either of Green's first 2 seasons in the league.

And we've gone through these comparisons before, but here are their first two seasons per 36 (and they had similar roles and minutes).

Year 1
13.8 p, 5.9 r, 1.7 a, 0.9 s, 0.5 b, 1.8 t, 3.8 f - 50.7 2PT, 34.1 3PT, 68.5 FT (53.9 TS)
13.4 p, 6.1 r, 1.9 a, 0.7 s, 0.8 b, 2.5 t, 3.2 f - 44.4 2PT, 27.6 3PT, 74.4 FT (49.1 TS)

Year 2
17.0 p, 5.8 r, 1.9 a, 1.2 s, 0.4 b, 2.1 t, 3.0 f - 50.7 2PT, 39.5 3PT, 64.4 FT (56.2 TS)
16.2 p, 6.5 r, 1.9 a, 1.0 s, 0.4 b, 2.2 t, 2.5 f - 46.3 2PT, 38.9 3PT, 78.8 FT (53.6 TS)

Fairly similar numbers in year 1 and year 2 for both them.  Similar jumps in production.  Green leveled off completely and never got any better.  Brown was about a year younger in each season, so he has that going for him and he has been the better shooter. 

I believe Brown will continue to grow because that is what most players do, but Jeff Green did not and he is not the only player that peaked very early in his career.  Couple that with their overall first 2 years numbers being similar.  And like Green, Brown is being squeezed out for better players that weren't around his first couple of seasons and also is arguably being forced to play out of position to accommodate those better players (Durant forced Green to play PF and Russ, Harden, and Ibaka were all added after Green - similarly Hayward/Tatum are forcing Brown to play SG, who along with Irving were all added after Brown joined the team).

Going by your logic does that mean Fultz is a bust after 4 games?
Who said anything about Brown being bust?  And including the playoffs, Fultz has played 20 games in his career.  If you can't see the difference, I don't know what to tell you.

Except you’re using 4 games to discount Jaylens whole last year and make the claim that he’s ‘turning into Jeff Green in front of our eyes.’

If you think 4 recent games is all you need to overrule the last 100 games before that, then why don’t you let us know why we can’t decide Fultz is a bust after 20 games (5x more games than you used for your hot take), which coincidentally is also his whole career and not 3% of it like your focus on Jaylen.
Give us this pick, Almighty Red
And forgive us our tanking
As we forgive those who tanked against us
And lead us not into the lottery
But deliver us from losing

-Sexyscottish

Re: Is Jaylen Brown still a Celtic?
« Reply #44 on: October 23, 2018, 05:47:16 PM »

Offline tstorey_97

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No one of the starting 5 Celtics have anything going anywhere anyhow on offense.

The extra pass count has gotten to the point that the players don't know what to do when they get the ball. Brown trots into the corner and watches Irving Iso's for better or for worse.

Last year the Celtics struggled early with Irving's presence on the floor and they straightened it out.  Brown, early in his rookie season, was prone to "watching the game" which is possible with the Celtics as Horford/Irving and Tatum have massive punch.

The bench rotations have been awful too. Rozier has had energy but, nothing else and Hayward just hasn't ever played with any of these guys before...this is his fifth game as a Celtic?

Last night was rough, but, it was an endless stream of deferred chances at the rim. Half of the drives down the lane ended with a crazy chuck to the perimeter to a player who didn't want the ball.

Get a picture of Brown in the corner with his hands on his knees watching the top of the key...put a thought bubble over his head..."why the hell are we losing to these guys?"

 

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