I wonder - if they didn't have LeBUM would they be a lottery team?
It would be close, but probably. I think they'd be a high lottery team even with Kyrie, though. He and Love haven't looked great together when Lebron has sat.
It would be close to a lottery team starting Derrick Rose and remain a lottery team with Kyrie, as well?
I know the Kyrie you once thought you knew didn't turn out as you hoped (ie - he broke your heart), but there he should be worth at least a couple more wins than Rose.
That 4-23 record in Games Lebron doesn't play is pretty worrisome.
That stat is very disingenuous when talking about Kyrie since Kyrie also sat in 10 of those 23 losses. Kyrie's record in games without Lebron is 4-13, not 4-23. I can't verify that Love actually played in all those 17 games either, but I'd guess he's missed some since he missed 22 this season alone. 4-13 is still bad, but you don't need to twist the facts. Liam already mentioned the lack of any non-Lebron offense the team had in place.
At age 21, Kyrie led the Cavs to a 33-49 record w/o Lebron. Now that ain't much to brag about at a glance either, but his best teammates that season were (in terms of min per game) Luol Deng (for 40 games), a 22 year old Tristan Thompson, Spencer Hawes, and Dion Waiters. That putrid team somehow finished better than 8 other teams in the league which Derrick Rose absolutely could not do right now. So I give Kyrie a little more credit than you are right now.
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