Original Deal vs Final Deal

[Redz]

Comparing the original deal with the assumption that iT would be ready in a month or two vs the final deal where all sides now assume he'll be out for up to 4 months, the added second rounder seems like a bargain.  Having a lost season would be bad for the Celtics.  I tend to think iT isn't going to get back to the guy we fell in love with this season - period.

Add in the near certainty that IT would be out of here after this season and it seems like a no brainer. 

Looking at the trade in a vacuum of just this season, Irving isn't replacing IT, he's likely replacing Smart or Rozier at PG.  Never mind the fact that Irving will be around after this year, the fact that he is replacing some very heavy dead weight makes the immediate value of the trade well worth it.

[CelticsElite]

whether IT was healthy or not, i feel like he peaked. part of it is because of stevens system. the fact that hes now damaged goods is even worse.

[footey]

It was obvious to me that IT really struggled in play-offs, especially vs. Wizards.  He just couldn't explode through double teams the way he could with ease during the regular season.  I was leary about how he would return before this trade was a rumor.

I sincerely hope he returns to full strength, even if it jeopardizes how far we go in the play-offs next season. He deserves a max contract.   He remains, to me, one of the most inspirational players I have ever watched play.

[Roy H.]

4 months from today, or 4 months into the season?  I haven't seen any substantiated reports giving a definitive timeline.

The immediate return of the trade will be increased regular season wins. Those aren't worth the price we paid. The longer term return may be worth it, but there's also substantial risk.

[Jon]

The only thing I really think has changed is how likely the Cavs will be able to keep LeBron after this year given the fact that IT may not come close to filling Irving's role. 

Still, the Cavs could go out and trade the Brooklyn pick for an established star to replace Irving and persuade LeBron to stay.  So I'm not even sure that it impacts that fact that much. 

As for the long term for both teams, until we see what the Brooklyn pick and Irving become for their respective teams, it will be tough to draw any conclusions about this deal. 

[Surferdad]

I think it tells you that the Cavs were more desperate to close the deal, not that the C's weren't highly motivated either (IT expiring contract), but DA knew exactly where he would draw the line.

[Redz]

4 months from today, or 4 months into the season?  I haven't seen any substantiated reports giving a definitive timeline.

The immediate return of the trade will be increased regular season wins. Those aren't worth the price we paid. The longer term return may be worth it, but there's also substantial risk.

Just my gut feeling based on the delay in diagnosis and surgery, but I really feel like he is going to have little impact this season.

Which would indeed suck for the Little Guy..

[mctyson]

Comparing the original deal with the assumption that iT would be ready in a month or two vs the final deal where all sides now assume he'll be out for up to 4 months, the added second rounder seems like a bargain.  Having a lost season would be bad for the Celtics.  I tend to think iT isn't going to get back to the guy we fell in love with this season - period.

Add in the near certainty that IT would be out of here after this season and it seems like a no brainer. 

Looking at the trade in a vacuum of just this season, Irving isn't replacing IT, he's likely replacing Smart or Rozier at PG.  Never mind the fact that Irving will be around after this year, the fact that he is replacing some very heavy dead weight makes the immediate value of the trade well worth it.

I don't think the lost season was an issue for Boston, it is that he was on the last year of his deal and they really couldn't afford to sign him to $25M+ in free agency.

To put it another way, if IT was locked up at $25M+ for 3 years now, this trade probably never happens.

[drogbagarnett]

4 months from today, or 4 months into the season?  I haven't seen any substantiated reports giving a definitive timeline.

The immediate return of the trade will be increased regular season wins. Those aren't worth the price we paid. The longer term return may be worth it, but there's also substantial risk.

Some are talking down the trade mentioning "risks"...

How about the risk of IT injury lasting longer?
or the risk of him not returning to his peak?
or the risk that he leaves for nothing running after the brinks truck?
or the risk of Brooklyn competing hard and actually winning more games than the numerous tankers fighting for the top 5 spots in the draft?
or the risk of Crowder blocking tatum/brown development?
or the risk of him being not happy with a reduced role due to those young studs and Hayward? how about the risk of Zizic not living up to the expectations?

We can talk about substantial risk but there is risk in every decision we take. I like our timeline. pushing it out would have been wasting Horford's good years. Lets go for banner 18 and push the Warriors to a game 7 in the NBA finals!! this trade gets us closer to it, no matter the risk...

[Roy H.]

4 months from today, or 4 months into the season?  I haven't seen any substantiated reports giving a definitive timeline.

The immediate return of the trade will be increased regular season wins. Those aren't worth the price we paid. The longer term return may be worth it, but there's also substantial risk.

Some are talking down the trade mentioning "risks"...

How about the risk of IT injury lasting longer?
or the risk of him not returning to his peak?
or the risk that he leaves for nothing running after the brinks truck?
or the risk of Brooklyn competing hard and actually winning more games than the numerous tankers fighting for the top 5 spots in the draft?
or the risk of Crowder blocking tatum/brown development?
or the risk of him being not happy with a reduced role due to those young studs and Hayward? how about the risk of Zizic not living up to the expectations?

We can talk about substantial risk but there is risk in every decision we take. I like our timeline. pushing it out would have been wasting Horford's good years. Lets go for banner 18 and push the Warriors to a game 7 in the NBA finals!! this trade gets us closer to it, no matter the risk...

Well, no, this trade probably puts us further away from winning. We traded two "win now" players for one, and me moved our biggest trade asset.

[Fafnir]

This trade is a huge bet on Brown/Tatum being really good players in the next two years.

[Vermont Green]

I don't think we have a real good idea of the state of IT's hip.  He says he will be fine and that is what his Doctor's have been telling him.  This is probably true.  If Cleveland thought otherwise, I don't think they would asked for just some additional compensation, I think they would have rescinded the trade.    This is only a good deal for Cleveland if they are able to contend for the title this season.  They only do that with a healthy IT.  They probably are not expecting to resign him so if he ends up needing surgery after the season, there is no impact to them.

Adding this second round pick was so dumb.  It makes Cleveland look bad for what?  A second round pick.  What did it prove?  To me all it proved is that Cleveland is Bush-league to deal with and cast a lot of unnecessary doubt on IT.

[86MaxwellSmart]

This trade is a huge bet on Brown/Tatum being really good players in the next two years.

I would bet on this.

[Jon]

This trade is a huge bet on Brown/Tatum being really good players in the next two years.

Well, at least one of them, though both would certainly be huge.

[Celtics4ever]

We traded two "win now" players for one, and me moved our biggest trade asset.

We got to the ECF finals those guys were never going to get further.

We replaced Crowder with Hayward, I am sorry but can you with a straight face really claim that Crowder is better than Hayward.

I get you loved these guys and losing the pick stinks.   But Hayward and Irving are greater win now guys than Crowder and IT, who are regular season warriors.   They did well this offseason but Irving shone in the finals big time.   He might also have had to give up elements of his game to suit LeBron and be capable of much more.

I trust Ainge, he is not perfect but he is very good at what it does.   Stevens has never had a top flight talent now he does.   Give them a chance.   

This trade is a huge bet on Brown/Tatum being really good players in the next two years.

I want them both to do well but I think Tatum will be the better of the two.   Brown was very inconsistent in the summer league when he should have dominated every game.   He still was good but Tatum was solid every game.