Is Crowder being moved so everyone else can stay?

[jay]

Interesting idea on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/theivpointplay/status/883288739979476993

If Crowder is moved for a draft pick, it would be possible to keep Bradley, Smart, Rozier, and even Jackson and Mickey. He even suggests Yabusele may be coming over.

IT. Rozier. Jackson
Bradley. Smart
Hayward Brown
(Room Exception). Tatum. Yabusele
Horford. Theis Zizic.  Mickey

They may be wanting to keep the roster intact as much as possible. Bring in a PF with the room exception, like Jerebko maybe? Or a stretch 4 that can play a litte defense. Then they would have one more roster spot for a minimum contract. Use the Two 2-way contracts for 2nd rounders like Ojeleye and Nader that you don't want other teams to sign.

[kozlodoev]

Crowder is moved because (a) he's obsolete, and (b) he's got attitude issues.

[dreamgreen]

Who do they have for bigs right now Horford, Ziczic and Mickey? They need more than that.

[chilidawg]

Crowder is moved because (a) he's obsolete, and (b) he's got attitude issues.

How is he obsolete?  He's a guy who defends well at 3 positions and can hit the 3 at a good percentage.  That's not obsolete in today's NBA.  And how much do we really know about his "attitude" issues?

[Chris22]

Interesting idea on Twitter:

https://twitter.com/theivpointplay/status/883288739979476993

If Crowder is moved for a draft pick, it would be possible to keep Bradley, Smart, Rozier, and even Jackson and Mickey. He even suggests Yabusele may be coming over.

IT. Rozier. Jackson
Bradley. Smart
Hayward Brown
(Room Exception). Tatum. Yabusele
Horford. Theis Zizic.  Mickey

They may be wanting to keep the roster intact as much as possible. Bring in a PF with the room exception, like Jerebko maybe? Or a stretch 4 that can play a litte defense. Then they would have one more roster spot for a minimum contract. Use the Two 2-way contracts for 2nd rounders like Ojeleye and Nader that you don't want other teams to sign.

If this is possible, it makes perfect sense.

[D Dub]

Crowder is moved because (a) he's obsolete, and (b) he's got attitude issues.

How is he obsolete?  He's a guy who defends well at 3 positions and can hit the 3 at a good percentage.  That's not obsolete in today's NBA.  And how much do we really know about his "attitude" issues?

Well they did have to separate he and Terry's lockers during the first round of the playoffs, for an unknown reason...  and then there are all the twitter-tantrums

[jambr380]

Who do they have for bigs right now Horford, Ziczic and Mickey? They need more than that.

You forgot our current  2nd best big in Theis...and I'm not kidding.

I imagine we will pick up a vet min guy to give us some back up minutes, though. I don't see a scenario where Mickey is still with the team next season.

As for Crowder - man, that contract. Don't let him go, Danny!

[SHAQATTACK]

i ll go with attitude issues first. He is a sulker .

He pretty much has to go .....because he will resent too much playing behind Hayward ,  stuff he said is out there now , you can't take it back at this point.  His play is too erratic based on how he feels about his job . Great on days he is happy with the Celtics .  Not so much effort when things are not going his way.  Opposite is true with IT ..always positive.

He has to go , to clear the air , so the rest of the Celtics can bond with Gordon , and not feel Crowders emotions of discontent.   

Second, he is a more role player type ,  and i don't think he views himself anymore as a team first player and willing to sit on the bench behind Gordon.


i like AB,  fits the team, but i see no way he can stay , he and IT want huge contracts , and both can't be paid .   Best to part ways now .

[kozlodoev]

Crowder is moved because (a) he's obsolete, and (b) he's got attitude issues.

How is he obsolete?  He's a guy who defends well at 3 positions and can hit the 3 at a good percentage.  That's not obsolete in today's NBA.  And how much do we really know about his "attitude" issues?

Right now, he's a guy that defends well at zero positions, mostly because he decided that giving full effort is beneath him. But even when giving full effort, he's only  SF that can take very occasion spot duty at the PF position. He has never been asked, not can he be counted for to guard SGs -- remember that he came from Dallas with question marks about whether he is quick enough to guard SFs full time.

He's absolutely obsolete on our team, where there are 3 to 4 other guys that should be getting the SF minutes ahead of him (Hayward, Brown, Tatum, and even Smart). And even if you assume that he'll leapfrog the latter three, I have zero confidence that he will handle demotion to the bench well, which leads me to the issue of...

Attitude problems -- Crowder has provided a good amount of eyebrow-raisers this seasons, including criticizing the fans, multiple other Twitter outbursts, and a visibly reduced attention to defense. Pretty much every time I hear from him these days, he seems to put his foot in his mouth...

The guy could have been the second coming of James Posey, yet he chose to be the second coming of Ricky Davis instead. I loved the 2015-16 version of Crowder, the 2016-17 one I have no use for.

[KGBirdBias]

It's time to waive DJax and Mickey and let either Theis or Yabu stay stashed. Then try and trade Crowder and AB for Nerlens Noel in a sign and trade. Their salary totals $14M per. Sign Noel to a 1 year deal to get his Bird rights and then next year he can sign his big deal.

This addresses our big man issues.

Can this be done?

[footey]

Crowder is moved because (a) he's obsolete, and (b) he's got attitude issues.

How is he obsolete?  He's a guy who defends well at 3 positions and can hit the 3 at a good percentage.  That's not obsolete in today's NBA.  And how much do we really know about his "attitude" issues?

Right now, he's a guy that defends well at zero positions, mostly because he decided that giving full effort is beneath him. But even when giving full effort, he's only  SF that can take very occasion spot duty at the PF position. He has never been asked, not can he be counted for to guard SGs -- remember that he came from Dallas with question marks about whether he is quick enough to guard SFs full time.

He's absolutely obsolete on our team, where there are 3 to 4 other guys that should be getting the SF minutes ahead of him (Hayward, Brown, Tatum, and even Smart). And even if you assume that he'll leapfrog the latter three, I have zero confidence that he will handle demotion to the bench well, which leads me to the issue of...

Attitude problems -- Crowder has provided a good amount of eyebrow-raisers this seasons, including criticizing the fans, multiple other Twitter outbursts, and a visibly reduced attention to defense. Pretty much every time I hear from him these days, he seems to put his foot in his mouth...

The guy could have been the second coming of James Posey, yet he chose to be the second coming of Ricky Davis instead. I loved the 2015-16 version of Crowder, the 2016-17 one I have no use for.

I think you exaggerate the differences in his performance each of those years. In fact, was he not a more efficient scorer this past season, especially from 3 point range?

[kozlodoev]

I think you exaggerate the differences in his performance each of those years. In fact, was he not a more efficient scorer this past season, especially from 3 point range?

He was. That's when decided he'll be a star.

[RLewis35]

i ll go with attitude issues first. He is a sulker .

He pretty much has to go .....because he will resent too much playing behind Hayward ,  stuff he said is out there now , you can't take it back at this point.  His play is too erratic based on how he feels about his job . Great on days he is happy with the Celtics .  Not so much effort when things are not going his way.  Opposite is true with IT ..always positive.

He has to go , to clear the air , so the rest of the Celtics can bond with Gordon , and not feel Crowders emotions of discontent.   

Second, he is a more role player type ,  and i don't think he views himself anymore as a team first player and willing to sit on the bench behind Gordon.


i like AB,  fits the team, but i see no way he can stay , he and IT want huge contracts , and both can't be paid .   Best to part ways now .

Great analysis on Jae. 

I disagree with you about Avery.  I would keep him through year end.  With Isaiah hip we have no idea if this could really limit him.  I'd prefer see how IT does this season before just giving up on AB unless we get an excellent return. For all we know we may prefer to sign AB at years end.

[jambr380]

If Crowder gets moved, it should either be part of a bigger package for a star (like the proposed George trade) or for another player, likely on a rookie contract, with multiple years left at a bargain rate.

Trading Crowder for an expiring (or salary dump) would be a short-sighted move by Ainge. It is possible Danny still has hopes of assembling a two or three for one deal down the line (trade deadline), but we already have AB, Smart, and IT up for new deals next year. It would be really strange to add another player to that group when we already have a very good player in Crowder with 3 years left at an incredible bargain.

If he is unhappy, oh well - he will get over it when we are in ECF and finals every year. Where else is he going to get an opportunity to win?

[Ed Hollison]

We are far too negative on Crowder of late on these forums and too eager to show him the exit. With that said, of him, Bradley, and Smart, I'd prefer he goes.

First, that contract is valuable and should be able to fetch something valuable in a trade. Not sure about Bradley or Smart's expiring deals.

Second, beyond this season I'm not sure how much of a role Crowder has on this team. By the start of next year we'll have at Crowder's position: 1) one of the best SFs in the game in Hayward, 2) Jaylen Brown entering his 3rd season, and 3) Jayson Tatum entering his 2nd season. If you want to re-sign IT (and maybe one of Bradley or Smart) in the offseason, you can't have two lottery picks as your backup small forwards, plus another guy. Even though Crowder's cheap for the player that he is, that's not an efficient allocation of resources.

Third, Crowder is not big or physical enough to play heavy minutes at the 4, especially alongside an undersized 5 in Horford. Eventually I'd like to see Tatum put on some muscle and play that position, even if it's not full time.

Fourth, and this is the most important... Crowder is not the same defender that he was in his first couple years in Boston. I don't think it's related to effort or falling in love with his offense. It's probably more related to his ankle injuries. Who knows. All I can tell you is that his defensive reputation is better than his actual defensive prowess at this point.

Lastly... Crowder has some major "dog" in him. I couldn't care less that he's been salty on Twitter and takes everything personal. He's highly competitive, accountable, and by all accounts a team player. Every team needs Crowders. You'd definitely miss that attitude, but then again, you'd miss it even more if you lost Smart instead.