Author Topic: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay  (Read 19939 times)

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Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #30 on: June 14, 2017, 09:04:42 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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It is times like this Lebron is a bit tough to take. Lebron got his money. Irving got his Money. Love got his money. Smith got his money. Thompson got his money. They added 5 new players throughout the season despite them costing double the salaries cause of the luxury tax. They churned through Bogut, then Sanders than even took a flier on Tavares. They have carried James Jones on their roster who has one NBA skill apparently of being Lebron's friend. I mean at some point enough is enough.
dont forget technical foul specialist Dahntay Jones.

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #31 on: June 14, 2017, 09:09:54 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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LAC signs Lebron.

Re signs CP3

Sign and trade Blake for Melo

Sign Wade on the cheap.

Their dream finally comes true. And they still don't beat GSW.



I hope they do it.  Clips would become the least likable team in the league during the time I've paid attention the NBA, and they would have no shot against the Warriors.
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Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #32 on: June 14, 2017, 09:16:45 PM »

Offline SCeltic34

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I don't trust Woj regarding anything related to Lebron. He's been stirring the pot for years.

That said, Lebron absolutely should play the "upgrade or I'm leaving" card. Gilbert has not spent as much as he could to improve the Cavs, and I'm sure that that doesn't go unnoticed.

Personally, if I'm Lebron I'm signing in Boston next off-season for the MLE, haha. Screw LA, go to a team made for your talents.

Horford / Zizic
Lebron / 2018 BRK #1
Hayward / Crowder
Bradley / Brown
IT / Fultz

That's how you beat Golden State.

Haven't the Cavs had, by far, the highest payroll in the league the last two seasons?

I really don't buy that.
Yea Roy what are you talking about here. They signed his friends to big contracts (thompson, smith) after Lebron provided pressure. They have the highest team salary in league and in the history of the NBA. They still signed Williams and Bogut and Sanders mid season when Lebron wanted more players. Literally what else could they have done for Lebron to keep him happy? Most feel GM Lebron got so much of what he wanted that the team was a bad matchup for the Warriors.

Understandably, you guys don't follow the Cavs that closely, but they've made a number of cost-cutting moves:

1. They traded a #1 to clear Varejao's salary;

2. They let Matt Delladoeva walk in free agency, losing his salary slot as a tradeable asset;

3. They've let multiple trade exceptions expire without attempting to acquire players;

4. They gave up Mike Dunleavy and another #1 to get Kyle Korver and to dump Mo Williams. They could have kept Dunleavy and acquired Korver using a trade exception.

https://www.google.com/amp/deadspin.com/report-lebron-james-wants-the-cavaliers-to-increase-pa-1791658445/amp

I mean these are pretty small potatoes when you  have the highest team salary in the league...
Also nobody on these moves is a difference maker. I guess you could perhaps make the argument that Deron Williams is worse than Delladova. I probably don't believe that and think Lebron would have preferred Williams.

They could have added $9.7 million in salary, and had their #1 to add to it. They didn't. They could have given Delly a contract that could be used to match salaries for a bigger acquisition. They didn't.

Those moves probably don't get Cleveland over the hump, but Gilbert didn't maximize Lebron's chances at a title, either. Not only that, but selling #1s to shed salary means that Cleveland has fewer assets to pursue an upgrade in trade.

None of this is really in dispute. Lebron' spokesman confirmed it.

Quote from: Brian Windhorst
Tension between LeBron James and the Cleveland Cavaliers' leadership is centered on payroll spending, multiple sources told ESPN.

James and team owner Dan Gilbert have different views on the issue, and it has been straining the relationship, sources said.

...

When James was considering a return to the Cavs in 2014, he pressed Gilbert on whether he'd be willing to spend unconditionally on talent, regardless of the luxury-tax cost, sources said. Over the course of several meetings with James and his representatives, Gilbert agreed, and James subsequently signed with the team.

...

James, however, has grown frustrated. He perceives that the Cavaliers have slowed new spending after winning their first championship, sources said.

On Monday night, after a loss in New Orleans, James might have been referring to the team's recent money decisions when he said, "I just hope that we're not satisfied as an organization."

If that's true, it's understandable if LeBron is upset.  Don't get me wrong - he's a remarkably spoiled by the organizations he's played for, and also by NBA officials.  But Gilbert didn't uphold that promise.

At the same, LeBron could put his money where his mouth is and take a pay cut, ala Tom Brady.  Even Paul Pierce took less money to give Ainge a little more flexibility for roster construction.

In any case, no sympathy here.

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #33 on: June 14, 2017, 09:18:28 PM »

Offline wayupnorth

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To the folks in this thread saying the Cavs should trade him, he has a no trade contract, so that is non starter unless he is in on it and wants it.

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #34 on: June 14, 2017, 09:19:33 PM »

Offline mctyson

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That said, Lebron absolutely should play the "upgrade or I'm leaving" card. Gilbert has not spent as much as he could to improve the Cavs, and I'm sure that that doesn't go unnoticed.

Roy, the Cavs traded the #1 overall pick in the draft at Lebron's request to get a guy that he doesn't even really like.  Come on.

It's fine to say that if the Cavs don't let Lebron be GM he might leave, but I think Lebron is a terrible GM in the same way that Jordan is a terrible one.

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #35 on: June 14, 2017, 09:29:18 PM »

Offline csfansince60s

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Scal was on 98.5 yesterday morning around 9.

He opined that Caves would try to make a Love for George move (don't think that Pacers would, but who knows?) and go all in for one year knowing that BOTH George and Bron Bron would be bolting for LaLa Land the next year, like it was a fore-gone conclusion.

He talked about Bron Bron's house in LA and his kids already being enrolled in a school there, but that that in and of itself didn't mean anything.

Interesting Scal convo.

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #36 on: June 14, 2017, 09:50:25 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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That said, Lebron absolutely should play the "upgrade or I'm leaving" card. Gilbert has not spent as much as he could to improve the Cavs, and I'm sure that that doesn't go unnoticed.

Roy, the Cavs traded the #1 overall pick in the draft at Lebron's request to get a guy that he doesn't even really like.  Come on.

It's fine to say that if the Cavs don't let Lebron be GM he might leave, but I think Lebron is a terrible GM in the same way that Jordan is a terrible one.

Has Gilbert made cost-cutting moves that downgraded Cavs assets?

I think that's indisputable. What that has to do with Kevin love, I'm not completely sure.


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Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #37 on: June 14, 2017, 09:54:48 PM »

Offline Moranis

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That said, Lebron absolutely should play the "upgrade or I'm leaving" card. Gilbert has not spent as much as he could to improve the Cavs, and I'm sure that that doesn't go unnoticed.

Roy, the Cavs traded the #1 overall pick in the draft at Lebron's request to get a guy that he doesn't even really like.  Come on.

It's fine to say that if the Cavs don't let Lebron be GM he might leave, but I think Lebron is a terrible GM in the same way that Jordan is a terrible one.

Has Gilbert made cost-cutting moves that downgraded Cavs assets?

I think that's indisputable. What that has to do with Kevin love, I'm not completely sure.
and frankly that us just silly. I mean what were they suppos3d to do waste James' last good years waiting for Wiggins.  Never would happen as that team wasn't good enough to win a title so why even bother bringing James back if you weren't going to maximize his window.
2025 Historical Draft - Cleveland Cavaliers - 1st pick

Starters - Luka, JB, Lebron, Wemby, Shaq
Rotation - D. Daniels, Mitchell, G. Wallace, Melo, Noah
Deep Bench - Korver, Turner

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #38 on: June 14, 2017, 10:00:07 PM »

Offline GetLucky

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I don't trust Woj regarding anything related to Lebron. He's been stirring the pot for years.

That said, Lebron absolutely should play the "upgrade or I'm leaving" card. Gilbert has not spent as much as he could to improve the Cavs, and I'm sure that that doesn't go unnoticed.

Personally, if I'm Lebron I'm signing in Boston next off-season for the MLE, haha. Screw LA, go to a team made for your talents.

Horford / Zizic
Lebron / 2018 BRK #1
Hayward / Crowder
Bradley / Brown
IT / Fultz

That's how you beat Golden State.

Haven't the Cavs had, by far, the highest payroll in the league the last two seasons?

I really don't buy that.
Yea Roy what are you talking about here. They signed his friends to big contracts (thompson, smith) after Lebron provided pressure. They have the highest team salary in league and in the history of the NBA. They still signed Williams and Bogut and Sanders mid season when Lebron wanted more players. Literally what else could they have done for Lebron to keep him happy? Most feel GM Lebron got so much of what he wanted that the team was a bad matchup for the Warriors.

Understandably, you guys don't follow the Cavs that closely, but they've made a number of cost-cutting moves:

1. They traded a #1 to clear Varejao's salary;

2. They let Matt Delladoeva walk in free agency, losing his salary slot as a tradeable asset;

3. They've let multiple trade exceptions expire without attempting to acquire players;

4. They gave up Mike Dunleavy and another #1 to get Kyle Korver and to dump Mo Williams. They could have kept Dunleavy and acquired Korver using a trade exception.

https://www.google.com/amp/deadspin.com/report-lebron-james-wants-the-cavaliers-to-increase-pa-1791658445/amp

I mean these are pretty small potatoes when you  have the highest team salary in the league...
Also nobody on these moves is a difference maker. I guess you could perhaps make the argument that Deron Williams is worse than Delladova. I probably don't believe that and think Lebron would have preferred Williams.

They could have added $9.7 million in salary, and had their #1 to add to it. They didn't. They could have given Delly a contract that could be used to match salaries for a bigger acquisition. They didn't.

Those moves probably don't get Cleveland over the hump, but Gilbert didn't maximize Lebron's chances at a title, either. Not only that, but selling #1s to shed salary means that Cleveland has fewer assets to pursue an upgrade in trade.

None of this is really in dispute. Lebron' spokesman confirmed it.

Quote from: Brian Windhorst
Tension between LeBron James and the Cleveland Cavaliers' leadership is centered on payroll spending, multiple sources told ESPN.

James and team owner Dan Gilbert have different views on the issue, and it has been straining the relationship, sources said.

...

When James was considering a return to the Cavs in 2014, he pressed Gilbert on whether he'd be willing to spend unconditionally on talent, regardless of the luxury-tax cost, sources said. Over the course of several meetings with James and his representatives, Gilbert agreed, and James subsequently signed with the team.

...

James, however, has grown frustrated. He perceives that the Cavaliers have slowed new spending after winning their first championship, sources said.

On Monday night, after a loss in New Orleans, James might have been referring to the team's recent money decisions when he said, "I just hope that we're not satisfied as an organization."

If that's true, it's understandable if LeBron is upset.  Don't get me wrong - he's a remarkably spoiled by the organizations he's played for, and also by NBA officials.  But Gilbert didn't uphold that promise.

At the same, LeBron could put his money where his mouth is and take a pay cut, ala Tom Brady.  Even Paul Pierce took less money to give Ainge a little more flexibility for roster construction.

In any case, no sympathy here.

I'm pretty sure the Cavs have the highest payroll in NBA history (base salaries right around $125 million, if I recall correctly). Gilbert (over)payed all of LeBron's favorite players, including Tristan Thompson and JR Smith, effectively capping what the team could do in free agency or through trades. To get help this year, Gilbert signed the cream-of-the-crop buyout veterans (Williams, Bogut) and traded a first rounder for Kyle Korver.

LeBron is a great player with a fantastic BBIQ, but he's no capologist. I don't know if he fully understands the fact that the Cavs WANT to load up, but it's just not possible under the CBA. They have no cap space, and they have no trade assets; their team is made up of appropriately-payed LeBron, underpaid stars (Kyrie, Love), overpayed role players (JR Smith, Thompson), and vet-minimum or rookie-scale players (Jefferson, Korver, Felder, etc). That is not exactly conducive to salary matching, which is necessary becacause the Cavs are over the soft cap.

It also doesn't help that LeBron structured his first contract as a two-year deal so that he got his and was paid the highest possible salary after the cap jump.

What LeBron does know is how to manipulate the media. With the recent "Gilbert is a cheapo who insulted my mom and wife" campaigns, I'm inclined to think that LeBron is setting up an exit from Cleveland.

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #39 on: June 14, 2017, 10:04:18 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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In short, LeBron (player/coach/GM) is yet again pointing fingers after his most recent failure.  Nothing new to see here.
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Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #40 on: June 14, 2017, 10:09:55 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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I don't trust Woj regarding anything related to Lebron. He's been stirring the pot for years.

That said, Lebron absolutely should play the "upgrade or I'm leaving" card. Gilbert has not spent as much as he could to improve the Cavs, and I'm sure that that doesn't go unnoticed.

Personally, if I'm Lebron I'm signing in Boston next off-season for the MLE, haha. Screw LA, go to a team made for your talents.

Horford / Zizic
Lebron / 2018 BRK #1
Hayward / Crowder
Bradley / Brown
IT / Fultz

That's how you beat Golden State.

Haven't the Cavs had, by far, the highest payroll in the league the last two seasons?

I really don't buy that.
Yea Roy what are you talking about here. They signed his friends to big contracts (thompson, smith) after Lebron provided pressure. They have the highest team salary in league and in the history of the NBA. They still signed Williams and Bogut and Sanders mid season when Lebron wanted more players. Literally what else could they have done for Lebron to keep him happy? Most feel GM Lebron got so much of what he wanted that the team was a bad matchup for the Warriors.

Understandably, you guys don't follow the Cavs that closely, but they've made a number of cost-cutting moves:

1. They traded a #1 to clear Varejao's salary;

2. They let Matt Delladoeva walk in free agency, losing his salary slot as a tradeable asset;

3. They've let multiple trade exceptions expire without attempting to acquire players;

4. They gave up Mike Dunleavy and another #1 to get Kyle Korver and to dump Mo Williams. They could have kept Dunleavy and acquired Korver using a trade exception.

https://www.google.com/amp/deadspin.com/report-lebron-james-wants-the-cavaliers-to-increase-pa-1791658445/amp

I mean these are pretty small potatoes when you  have the highest team salary in the league...
Also nobody on these moves is a difference maker. I guess you could perhaps make the argument that Deron Williams is worse than Delladova. I probably don't believe that and think Lebron would have preferred Williams.

They could have added $9.7 million in salary, and had their #1 to add to it. They didn't. They could have given Delly a contract that could be used to match salaries for a bigger acquisition. They didn't.

Those moves probably don't get Cleveland over the hump, but Gilbert didn't maximize Lebron's chances at a title, either. Not only that, but selling #1s to shed salary means that Cleveland has fewer assets to pursue an upgrade in trade.

None of this is really in dispute. Lebron' spokesman confirmed it.

Quote from: Brian Windhorst
Tension between LeBron James and the Cleveland Cavaliers' leadership is centered on payroll spending, multiple sources told ESPN.

James and team owner Dan Gilbert have different views on the issue, and it has been straining the relationship, sources said.

...

When James was considering a return to the Cavs in 2014, he pressed Gilbert on whether he'd be willing to spend unconditionally on talent, regardless of the luxury-tax cost, sources said. Over the course of several meetings with James and his representatives, Gilbert agreed, and James subsequently signed with the team.

...

James, however, has grown frustrated. He perceives that the Cavaliers have slowed new spending after winning their first championship, sources said.

On Monday night, after a loss in New Orleans, James might have been referring to the team's recent money decisions when he said, "I just hope that we're not satisfied as an organization."

If that's true, it's understandable if LeBron is upset.  Don't get me wrong - he's a remarkably spoiled by the organizations he's played for, and also by NBA officials.  But Gilbert didn't uphold that promise.

At the same, LeBron could put his money where his mouth is and take a pay cut, ala Tom Brady.  Even Paul Pierce took less money to give Ainge a little more flexibility for roster construction.

In any case, no sympathy here.

I'm pretty sure the Cavs have the highest payroll in NBA history (base salaries right around $125 million, if I recall correctly). Gilbert (over)payed all of LeBron's favorite players, including Tristan Thompson and JR Smith, effectively capping what the team could do in free agency or through trades. To get help this year, Gilbert signed the cream-of-the-crop buyout veterans (Williams, Bogut) and traded a first rounder for Kyle Korver.

LeBron is a great player with a fantastic BBIQ, but he's no capologist. I don't know if he fully understands the fact that the Cavs WANT to load up, but it's just not possible under the CBA. They have no cap space, and they have no trade assets; their team is made up of appropriately-payed LeBron, underpaid stars (Kyrie, Love), overpayed role players (JR Smith, Thompson), and vet-minimum or rookie-scale players (Jefferson, Korver, Felder, etc). That is not exactly conducive to salary matching, which is necessary becacause the Cavs are over the soft cap.

It also doesn't help that LeBron structured his first contract as a two-year deal so that he got his and was paid the highest possible salary after the cap jump.

What LeBron does know is how to manipulate the media. With the recent "Gilbert is a cheapo who insulted my mom and wife" campaigns, I'm inclined to think that LeBron is setting up an exit from Cleveland.

Lebron wouldn't make a good GM, but the Cavs have had flexibility that they haven't utilized. They've had multiple sizeable trade exceptions, they've traded picks to cut salary, they declined to match Delly's contract, etc. Those are budgetary concerns more than basketball ones, which seems at odds with a promise to spend unconditionally.


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER... AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!

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Sabonis / Brand / A. Thompson / Oladipo / Brunson
Jordan / Bowen

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Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #41 on: June 14, 2017, 10:15:12 PM »

Offline csfansince60s

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In short, LeBron (player/coach/GM) is yet again pointing fingers after his most recent failure.  Nothing new to see here.

Exactly.....but those fingers ONLY point outward....NEVER inward.


He's gone after next year........why?...........it's like the fable about the snake and the fox halfway across the river both drowning because the snake bit the fox, knowing they would both drown...."why did you do it" implored the fox......and Bron Bron the snake answered "'cause I'm a snake!"

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #42 on: June 14, 2017, 10:20:10 PM »

Offline Roy H.

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In short, LeBron (player/coach/GM) is yet again pointing fingers after his most recent failure.  Nothing new to see here.

Exactly.....but those fingers ONLY point outward....NEVER inward.


He's gone after next year........why?...........it's like the fable about the snake and the fox halfway across the river both drowning because the snake bit the fox, knowing they would both drown...."why did you do it" implored the fox......and Bron Bron the snake answered "'cause I'm a snake!"

Frog / turtle and the scorpion.

Foxes are much too sly to be tricked like that, haha.


I'M THE SILVERBACK GORILLA IN THIS MOTHER... AND DON'T NONE OF YA'LL EVER FORGET IT!

KP / Giannis / Turkuglu / Jrue / Curry
Sabonis / Brand / A. Thompson / Oladipo / Brunson
Jordan / Bowen

Redshirt:  Cooper Flagg

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #43 on: June 14, 2017, 10:40:26 PM »

Offline GreenEnvy

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I think it's easy to say Gilber could have done more, but when is enough enough? They already had the largest team salary ever plus the luxury tax component. They use all their trade exceptions for what? More players teams are looking to dump? They get their payroll to $140M, now what? Let's keep cutting guys til we find the right mix?

They gave LeBron a little too much of a say in personnel matters.

When all is said and done, if Cleveland walks away without any more titles, they were a very, very big failure as an organization. They had FOUR top picks in an 11 year span, picking up an all-time great, a superstar, a bust, and trading for an all-star.

That says something about both the Cavs and LeBron (Jordan denied many ATG players their shot at rings, while many of James' contemporaries went right through him to get theirs).
CELTICS 2024

Re: Woj on Lebron: Cavs are unsure if he will stay
« Reply #44 on: June 14, 2017, 10:58:07 PM »

Offline No Nickname

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Clearly lots of smoke but Woj notoriously hates James so who knows on this particular story

Not saying I don't believe you but I'm curious what examples you could share. Thanks!