Author Topic: marcus and the grooming of superstars  (Read 1643 times)

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marcus and the grooming of superstars
« on: March 03, 2017, 04:54:56 AM »

Offline rollie mass

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was the chemistry that celtics have that is so behind our young players
the development of marcus ,rozier and jaylen even young
i have watched marcus and jaylen playing one on one and then green
i have watched jerebko pat him like a little brother and the joy on the bench as jaylen unfolds
i have watched marcus work ethic  transform his foul shooting,even his taking charges has matured

danny has the pieces for the future and did not want to sacrifice chemistry this mid season

let isaiah be the superstar.let marcus control the 2nd team
why change the balance with some short term fix

danny wanted winslow the trade didn't happen and now he has jaylen,smart and rozier

i think marcus will improve his shooting and balance his aggression even further
marcus is unique in his wingspan to weight disributation ,his core strength and lower body make him unmatchable  as well as unmovable

where are those doubters of his inside game now -another summer then lets judge his shooting
marcus played his rookie and 2nd year hobbled by horrific injuries which delayed his growth

ainge made no moves not to disrupt or lose key pieces for the long term growth of his young core-nobody could have set the celts on this course and it is now cautious danny not trader danny-brad has his future of youth ,draft picks and locker room and management including WYC

i believe that the trade deadline was the cause of the celtics letdown ,the volume and number of rumors-these are players some overachievers who have bonded and embraced TEAM and that was a threatening  week

this west coast trip might be just what the celts need, a team challenge that began against the cav's-
avery said " thanks for trusting me" to isaiah
-could anybody have said it better as avery showed against irving
-one of the best defensive and dribbling displays i remember ever seeing and then avery's humilty after saving the game--




« Last Edit: March 03, 2017, 08:22:32 AM by rollie mass »

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2017, 09:14:27 AM »

Offline CelticPride2016

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That was poetic and well-stated.

While many people get big kicks out of fantasy trading, they miss out on the big story which is the season in itself.

I don't get how anyone couldn't have noticed how such a process hurts team chemistry. Too many fed into it. Why act like a Felger troll?

Unfortunately, players too can act like trolls. First, it was Crowder. Then came Isaiah. I'm talking about their need to tell everyone during the heat of battle that they were going to keep future contract options open. That flew in the face of Celtics Pride.

It could be the reaction of youth who have no appreciation for the past and probably think Celtics' Mystique is mythology. They probably believe the business of basketball is business. Sure, it is, but it is not helpful to talk about it too much.

It's called putting the cart in front of the horse.

What if Evan Turner had gone to Danny and said, you know Portland just offered me $17 million and I understand why you may not want to pay me that. What if Evan asked, how 'bout 3 years at $10 million each?

I don't know why I noticed it, but top actors on The Big Bang Theory sitcom have offered to take pay cuts, so two actors added on in later seasons could get closer to income parity.

Some people would rather make 50 grand/yr over 100 if it means they are happier.

Look at Isaiah. Maybe in a bottom line world, he deserves to make $30 million. But wouldn't Danny lean more to bringing him back if he took a team-friendly contract? What would that be, $22 million? Why would someone leave a great situation providing $22 million just to receive an extra $8 million?

I live in the real world in which silly money is just what it implies- greed, vanity, selfishness and ego.

I think Danny passed on Noel because of the future and the guys already on the team. A year or two ago we had Amir Johnson as the top salary. Most others were a few million behind him like Isaiah, Avery and now Crowder.

Horford has thrown off the balance.

But Danny had to make the move, such as he did trading for the Little Guy.

He is not like Philly, perpetually tanking and selling an unsure future based on top prospects many can already easily label as damaged goods. They also traded decent players from time to time, to roll over "the process" for yet another spin.

Bradley became the new Paul Pierce in the first couple Brad years.

The big difference is that this time Danny had much better "assets" and not just Paul. Big Al Jefferson was starting to emerge, but that was about it, unless you want to add Tony, Rajon, Delonte and Perk and say that is a comparable pu pu platter to today's roster.

Nah. Jaylen Brown is not Anthony Bennett. Marcus Smart is much better than Delonte was, at least looking at ceilings and trajectories.

Yes, Marcus Smart got it done with free throws when his shot was hurting. He is now our best post player. Horford is pretty bad whenever they try to force it inside. Al just isn't an offensive force. But he doesn't have to be. It's not like he is a stone hands Kendrick Perkins.

Jaylen Brown has provided us with a phew.

Phew!

That is what we need, more of those.

Phew, Marcus can nail free throws, post up guys, pile up assists at times and is a consistent menace on defense.

Phew, Jaylen's handle is improving. He looks like he will become an unstoppable piece on offense and does not seem out of his elements for defense.

Phew, Bradley can now finish at the rim. He seems to have learned later in life how to dribble. I still wouldn't want him playing point guard, but he has fixed nearly every flaw in his game, except for perhaps passing - those stupid telegraphed passes.

Phew, Horford recovered from the concussion. He is three more years. He is decent. If his contract does become an eventual albatross, it will probably be nearing its conclusion. It won't be, ouch, we won't be going anywhere for at least three years when the Gerald Wallace contract wraps up.

Phew, for this year at least, Amir and Olynyk look relatively fresh and healthy.

I agree with Rollie's post. Danny is similar to a doctor. At a minimum, don't make things worse. And look at the patient as an individual with its own ecosystem. We have a coach who is adept at every aspect of the job. He can teach young players. He can strategize and compete with more traditional coaching. He is a modern thinking coach.

Brad Stevens is the best possible coach to have for the way Brooklyn has provided us with top picks, and they are just beginning.

James Young making a big leap has me thinking he's coming back or getting traded, that he won't just walk.

So the negativity of bombing on the first Nets' pick has turned into a possible asset. I am so happy I was thoroughly wrong about James Young. I am not sure if he will make it into an NBA rotation any time soon, but before the last month or two, I thought his future spoke Chinese or European basketball.

But the true meat and potatoes of our future is Smart and Brown. To repeat myself from another time, talent cannot be taught.

Common sense says it will be very difficult to bring back everyone year after year. Common sense can wreak havoc on a team's chemistry. The Red Sox won it all and broke the curse by becoming idiots. They were stupid enough to forget about everything other than the actual games.

And I am a stupid enough fan to believe in Smart, Brown and two more Nets' picks as the future core.

Bradley will become the next Paul Pierce or not. Sure, they play different positions and do different things. I am thinking of Celtics Tradition and the flow of basketball history.

The win over Cleveland was extra huge.

Yes, this upcoming road trip should be the last big challenge.

Five straight on the road. The first two should be wins. At Lakers and Phoenix. Then the Clippers. They'll want revenge and that should be fun. Then Golden State. That will be our last true extremely challenging game. Then we should beat Denver. We should on paper go at least 3-2 with 4-1 a fair goal and 5-0 not impossible.

Then two at home against mediocre teams - Bulls, Minnesota.

Two on the road against the worst of the worst - Brooklyn and Philly.

The only tough games left in addition to Golden State and the Clippers will be Washington at home on March 20th, Cleveland at home on April 5th, and perhaps April 6th at Atlanta.

I see only five tough barometer games left.

I'm not sure if we can catch Cleveland, but just even pushing towards that will force LeBron to continue to play big minutes. LeBron is now the same age Paul, Ray and KG were when they dropped from Hall of Fame status to mortal all-star dinosaur quality. King James as one of the all-time greats gets some benefit of the doubt, but no one beats Father Time.

As a fan, I am watching the rest of the games with the hope that we stay healthy and get the two seed.

There are only 21 games left! We'd have to fall apart to get anything less than the three seed. Ending with a sports cliche, the Celtics' destiny for 2016-17 is completely in their own hands.

The silly in-season trading deadline has ended and now we can concentrate on the games alone. The other stuff can recede to the background until the draft lottery.

I am trying to appreciate the moment. There will be plenty of time before 2017-18 gets going with Summer Leagues when we'll all get to rush to a new Rollie thread dissecting Zizic's NBA game and the new Nets' pick's game. We'll find out if Kelly, Amir, Jerebko, Young, Mickey and Zeller are coming back. We'll know if Isaiah will have a new phenom point guard as his backup. We'll know better if Marcus has noticeably improved on his shooting and point guard skills.

This is the biggest Celtics blog, no doubt. I wouldn't be surprised if Celtics people and players read some of this junk. Danny needs to figure out who believes in Celtics Pride and who doesn't. Because that is what's going on here. Nearly every other team is stuck in an oppressive situation with divas getting dramatic and making it all about them. Their exorbitant salaries make it near impossible for GM's to build great teams around them. Many of them are so egotistical that they make it near impossible for coaches to put together all the pieces.

I love Isaiah, but he's forcing me to keep open my options. Loyalty is a two-way street.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2017, 11:57:28 PM by CelticPride2016 »

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2017, 09:42:25 AM »

Offline positivitize

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I feel as if Walt Whitman just hopped on the Celticsblog forums to write these posts.

#ifSongOfMyselfWereAboutTheCeltics
My biases, in order of fervor:
Pro:
Smart, Brown, Hayward, Tatum, Kemba, Grant Williams, Sleepy Williams, Edwards!

Anti:
Kanter, Semi, Theis, Poierier

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2017, 09:45:07 AM »

Offline manl_lui

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good article but i was also reading somewhere on reddit and someone called Marcus unique and that he is transforming the position, they call him a power guard...i quite like it :)

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2017, 09:59:29 AM »

Offline TheTruthFot18

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Quote
I don't know why I noticed it, but top actors on The Big Bang Theory sitcom have offered to take pay cuts, so two actors added on in later seasons could get closer to income parity.

The Big Bang Theory has no cap structure. They can afford to pay the actors whatever they want. This example doesn't relate to the soft, but not real soft, cap in the NBA. The actors chose to allocate their pay elsewhere out of fairness, not to increase cap space to bring in additional talent.
The Nets will finish with the worst record and the Celtics will end up with the 4th pick.

- Me (sometime in January)

--------------------------------------------------------

Guess I was wrong (May 23rd)

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2017, 10:05:27 AM »

Offline wdleehi

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Quote
I don't know why I noticed it, but top actors on The Big Bang Theory sitcom have offered to take pay cuts, so two actors added on in later seasons could get closer to income parity.

The Big Bang Theory has no cap structure. They can afford to pay the actors whatever they want. This example doesn't relate to the soft, but not real soft, cap in the NBA. The actors chose to allocate their pay elsewhere out of fairness, not to increase cap space to bring in additional talent.


Not to mention this show isn't their last job. 

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2017, 10:12:18 AM »

Offline timpiker

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I really really like this team BUT, they have to fight for every win.  There are never any easy games and they rely on IT way way too much.  Looking at the standings, even when we get home court during the 1st round it won't be easy.  We should win the 1st round in 6 games maybe.  The Bulls, the Heat and whatever's slotted 5-8 will not be easy.  And the 2nd round?  Toronto or the Wizards?  Not easy by any means.  I'm afraid depending on IT to have great games is going to be our downfall.

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2017, 02:06:32 PM »

Offline Chris22

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I really really like this team BUT, they have to fight for every win.  There are never any easy games and they rely on IT way way too much.  Looking at the standings, even when we get home court during the 1st round it won't be easy.  We should win the 1st round in 6 games maybe.  The Bulls, the Heat and whatever's slotted 5-8 will not be easy.  And the 2nd round?  Toronto or the Wizards?  Not easy by any means.  I'm afraid depending on IT to have great games is going to be our downfall.

Good point.

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2017, 02:12:22 PM »

Offline apc

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Quote
I don't know why I noticed it, but top actors on The Big Bang Theory sitcom have offered to take pay cuts, so two actors added on in later seasons could get closer to income parity.

The Big Bang Theory has no cap structure. They can afford to pay the actors whatever they want. This example doesn't relate to the soft, but not real soft, cap in the NBA. The actors chose to allocate their pay elsewhere out of fairness, not to increase cap space to bring in additional talent.
Funny but from what i read the show did have some "cap structure" that wouldn't allow them to offer the other two more money.

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2017, 12:03:18 AM »

Offline CelticPride2016

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good article but i was also reading somewhere on reddit and someone called Marcus unique and that he is transforming the position, they call him a power guard...i quite like it :)

Marcus Smart shows point guard potential. Jaylen Brown can play some shooting guard. So Brad is able to throw a lot of different combos at the opponents. It's the front court which needs to start carrying it's weight. And on cue, hello Amir Johnson. I started praying for him a while back and it seems to be paying dividends. When he is springy, he's a better defender than Horford. I usually hate it when athletes thank their conception of a lord, but we were hurting upfront, and something had to be done.

Re: marcus and the grooming of superstars
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2017, 12:30:12 AM »

Offline CelticPride2016

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Quote
I don't know why I noticed it, but top actors on The Big Bang Theory sitcom have offered to take pay cuts, so two actors added on in later seasons could get closer to income parity.

The Big Bang Theory has no cap structure. They can afford to pay the actors whatever they want. This example doesn't relate to the soft, but not real soft, cap in the NBA. The actors chose to allocate their pay elsewhere out of fairness, not to increase cap space to bring in additional talent.
Funny but from what i read the show did have some "cap structure" that wouldn't allow them to offer the other two more money.

At some point the money runs out. Tim Duncan took less money, so the Spurs could keep Kawhi and sign LaMarcus Aldridge.

Rollie pointed out elsewhere that Boston provides a place where players become legends, get endorsements. McHale was on an episode of Cheers. Pierce could someday take over for Danny as GM. That might sound crazy, but there are perks (not Perkins) to being a great Boston pro athlete.

Isaiah is a tough one to pin down. He is obviously explosive and Hall of Fame quality for offense, but his height hurts us on the other end.

Horford is clearly not worth a max.

Danny might be thinking of long-term keeping players who can play more than one position.

That means guys like Bradley and Isaiah will potentially be less valuable than Brown and Smart.

It could get extremely awkward if Danny drafts a point guard.

The other option seems to be a small forward and we don't need one of those.

I could see the pick traded or the more awkward way it looks like it is headed.

If we do draft a phenom pg, then I will definitely have to avoid this forum next year. It will become all speculation, all the time.

The Celtics are only up 24 points deep into the 3rd quarter.  8)

It's kind of surreal to watch. Each player represents all his pros and cons to go with a future money number.

It changes up and down like the price of silver.

If Olynyk plays too well, he will become Evan Turner and gone. If he plays himself into no contract leverage, Danny resigns him for Crowder money. Probably more because of NBA inflation. Bring Amir back for $5 million. I would if he'd accept it.

I never imagined we'd get this good, so fast. Regardless of how scrappy we have to be nearly every game to win, we do win a lot. We are the 2nd seed with 20 to go.

I'm telling you. Steal that game in Golden State and we might win say, 16 out of the last 20. That probably wouldn't be enough to catch LeBron (they own us in the tiebreakers, too), but it might mean the 2nd seed is probably a done deal.

Take care of these kind of Laker cupcakes, beat the mediocre because we're good, and hold our own against very good teams and we are #2 in the East. That will be a huge accomplishment if they can hold on to it. There are only five tough games left, imho.