Woj: Warriors, Durant's inner circle bracing for tough news on knee injury

[crimson_stallion]

Well now I wish we had done something at the deadline .

ya, but you can't bank on injuries


I'm still happy we didn't trade the big assets

Its not about banking on injuries.   It's about doing everything you can possibly do to try and be as competitive as you possibly can,  and going in with a winners attitude rather then being complacent and overvaluing your assets.

Nobody goes from a bottom 5 lottery team to a championship contender overnight.   It takes multiple phases of rebuilding.

First you start by trying you're best to sell high on the assets you have, to trade short term assets for long term assets and flexibility - you aim becomes development,  not winning and Ainge did that as well as I've ever seen any gm do.

Then you reach the point where you start being really competitive, and at this point you stay building the team with the aim is winning games. Ainge apparently missed this school and somehow got his brain frozen in rebuild mode.

You dont get anywhere by sitting idle.  Lebron learnt that when The Heat got beat in the finals by an old Spurs team behind young Kawhi Leonard's mvp caliber play.   The Warriors learnt it last season when they shocked the world by losibg to the Cavs,  so they added Durant.  Thats why Lebron is on a team with the highest payroll and is still whining about them not having enough.   He knows they you can't stand still id your want to be competitive.

Boston could have added Demarcus Cousins, and right now we'd have been seen as having a serious shot at a championship.  They could have added Ibaka while giving up no assets of significant value,  and even that would have taken us one significant step closer to being able to compete with the Cavs and maybe make the finals.

Being competitive is beneficial.   Danny doesn't want to sacrifice assets and cap flexibility,  but what good is cap flexibility if no players want to sign with you as their first choice? 

 If we made the East finals last year, and pushed the Cavs to 6 games, then maybe Durant would have signed here based on the thought that maybe adding him is all this team needs to contend for a title.

But we didnt.  We finished in a tiebreaker for the 3rd seed with 4 other teams which spells playoff mediocrity, and then we got eliminated in the first round by a Hawks team that was arguably no better then we were.  That would have been enough to tell Durant we were more then one start player from a title.  More then 2 even, because adding Horford still want enough to being him here.

So now Boston goes into the trade deadline with more assets then any other GM, every team who is considering dealing their key players are calling him,  and he is not interested in doing anything to importune the team of there is even the slightest hint of risk involved.   He wants somebody to trade him a star for scraps.   So no deal gets done.

Now Toronto adds Ibaka,  which improves their team dramatically.  They'll probably finish above us by the time the playoffs come around,  and i am very confident that if we play then in the playoffs we will lose.

The wizards are creeping up on us,  and are a legit threat.  They're very capable of beating Ius in a 7 game series.

Now let's say finish 3Rd, wizards finish 4Th, and the Wizards eliminate us in the first round.  Now every few agent will be thinking about the fact that we've been knocked out of the first round 3 years in a row, and that were more then 1 guy away from being a championship contender.   Unless they are 100% fixated on Boston,  that's likely enough to convince them to sign elsewhere.

Now let's say it pick at #3 and we miss out on the key prospects.   Suddenly we start next season having not budged freon where we were in a year where we got eliminated in the first round.

But if Aibge made a move - even just a modest one.  Say,  the ibaka trade for a pick and Rozier.   Let's say that's smith for us to finish with the 2nd seed, beat the wizards and raptors,  make the ECF, win 1 or 2 games against Cleveland. That could be all out takes to convince a Hayward or Griffin to sign with Boston, knowing they could put us over the top.

Now let's say ibaka wants to much and we don't resign him.   Who cares?   Our sacrifice of Rozier and a pick just ended up the difference between us being a key free agent who improves the team,  or getting nobody.

And we will get to draft a top 4 guy anyway. But not that prospect has less pressure on him to have to make a huge impact right away.

This is why Ainge frustrates the hell out of me.

Have you forgotten about the 06-08 Celtics? They went from 2nd-worst to champions in one year. The Cavs are another good example, LeBron - a true superstar - took them from garbage to a near-contender in his first season. Same with Larry Bird.

Ainge is waiting for blue-chip talent, cause almost every NBA champion was led by an all-time player.

These incremental moves aren't worth worrying about one way or the other.

Free agents know this is a good organization already. The fact that AInge doesn't make panic trades doesn't hurt that notion, it reinforces it.

so what do you propose?

That of Boston can't very a Lebron / Bird caliber player, then there's no point in even trying to be good, or making any attempt whatsoever to be competitive?

The Celtics should just sit around and do nothing,  until a Lebron comes along?  That's rediculous.

Demarcus Cousins is the best center to play this game since Shaq, issues or not.  We could have had him, but passed.

Making trades for established superstars like Cousins, Butler and George are not what I would refer to as 'panic moves'.

Making a trade for Melo - that could be called a panic move.   But those other guys are all legit superstars,  they're all young,  and they're all guys who could be a part of the core of this team for years to come.

You say we shouldn't make panic moves,  but how else would you describe Ainge throwing a max contact at the metaphorical corpse that is Al Horford? I don't know if ive ever seen a more panic move then that.   The only reason  Ainge signed him was as a desperate hope that it would be enough to convince Durant to sign here.  That went down in flames,  and now we're stuck with a $120M or so paperweight.

Ibaka would impact this team just as much as Horford,  and woukd much rather get ibaka on a one year rental for the cost of Rozier anda pick...then gey Horford stuck here for the mext 4 years at a cost of $26m - $30m a year.

So please, dont try to sell the idea that Danny doesn't make moves because hes patient.   Danny didnt make moves because he's greedy,  and eber simce he pulled off a couple of fluke bargain deals,  he now believes anything less then a fluke bargain deal isnt his enough.

Problem is that flukes are flukes for a reason.  Ainge got lucky a couple of times,  and he should cash in before his luck runs out.   Which will probably happen on draft lottery night when the Brooklyn pick lands 3rd, loses about 70% of its value,  and ends up getting us a prospect like Otto Porter.

[playdream]

lol we don't have to make stupid moves because we are improving every day(IT/Smart/Brown ect)
and we can sign any player we want for free this summer and add two top5 picks in 2 years

[RockinRyA]

Well now I wish we had done something at the deadline .

ya, but you can't bank on injuries


I'm still happy we didn't trade the big assets

Its not about banking on injuries.   It's about doing everything you can possibly do to try and be as competitive as you possibly can,  and going in with a winners attitude rather then being complacent and overvaluing your assets.

Nobody goes from a bottom 5 lottery team to a championship contender overnight.   It takes multiple phases of rebuilding.

First you start by trying you're best to sell high on the assets you have, to trade short term assets for long term assets and flexibility - you aim becomes development,  not winning and Ainge did that as well as I've ever seen any gm do.

Then you reach the point where you start being really competitive, and at this point you stay building the team with the aim is winning games. Ainge apparently missed this school and somehow got his brain frozen in rebuild mode.

You dont get anywhere by sitting idle.  Lebron learnt that when The Heat got beat in the finals by an old Spurs team behind young Kawhi Leonard's mvp caliber play.   The Warriors learnt it last season when they shocked the world by losibg to the Cavs,  so they added Durant.  Thats why Lebron is on a team with the highest payroll and is still whining about them not having enough.   He knows they you can't stand still id your want to be competitive.

Boston could have added Demarcus Cousins, and right now we'd have been seen as having a serious shot at a championship.  They could have added Ibaka while giving up no assets of significant value,  and even that would have taken us one significant step closer to being able to compete with the Cavs and maybe make the finals.

Being competitive is beneficial.   Danny doesn't want to sacrifice assets and cap flexibility,  but what good is cap flexibility if no players want to sign with you as their first choice? 

 If we made the East finals last year, and pushed the Cavs to 6 games, then maybe Durant would have signed here based on the thought that maybe adding him is all this team needs to contend for a title.

But we didnt.  We finished in a tiebreaker for the 3rd seed with 4 other teams which spells playoff mediocrity, and then we got eliminated in the first round by a Hawks team that was arguably no better then we were.  That would have been enough to tell Durant we were more then one start player from a title.  More then 2 even, because adding Horford still want enough to being him here.

So now Boston goes into the trade deadline with more assets then any other GM, every team who is considering dealing their key players are calling him,  and he is not interested in doing anything to importune the team of there is even the slightest hint of risk involved.   He wants somebody to trade him a star for scraps.   So no deal gets done.

Now Toronto adds Ibaka,  which improves their team dramatically.  They'll probably finish above us by the time the playoffs come around,  and i am very confident that if we play then in the playoffs we will lose.

The wizards are creeping up on us,  and are a legit threat.  They're very capable of beating Ius in a 7 game series.

Now let's say finish 3Rd, wizards finish 4Th, and the Wizards eliminate us in the first round.  Now every few agent will be thinking about the fact that we've been knocked out of the first round 3 years in a row, and that were more then 1 guy away from being a championship contender.   Unless they are 100% fixated on Boston,  that's likely enough to convince them to sign elsewhere.

Now let's say it pick at #3 and we miss out on the key prospects.   Suddenly we start next season having not budged freon where we were in a year where we got eliminated in the first round.

But if Aibge made a move - even just a modest one.  Say,  the ibaka trade for a pick and Rozier.   Let's say that's smith for us to finish with the 2nd seed, beat the wizards and raptors,  make the ECF, win 1 or 2 games against Cleveland. That could be all out takes to convince a Hayward or Griffin to sign with Boston, knowing they could put us over the top.

Now let's say ibaka wants to much and we don't resign him.   Who cares?   Our sacrifice of Rozier and a pick just ended up the difference between us being a key free agent who improves the team,  or getting nobody.

And we will get to draft a top 4 guy anyway. But not that prospect has less pressure on him to have to make a huge impact right away.

This is why Ainge frustrates the hell out of me.

Have you forgotten about the 06-08 Celtics? They went from 2nd-worst to champions in one year. The Cavs are another good example, LeBron - a true superstar - took them from garbage to a near-contender in his first season. Same with Larry Bird.

Ainge is waiting for blue-chip talent, cause almost every NBA champion was led by an all-time player.

These incremental moves aren't worth worrying about one way or the other.

Free agents know this is a good organization already. The fact that AInge doesn't make panic trades doesn't hurt that notion, it reinforces it.

so what do you propose?

That of Boston can't very a Lebron / Bird caliber player, then there's no point in even trying to be good, or making any attempt whatsoever to be competitive?

The Celtics should just sit around and do nothing,  until a Lebron comes along?  That's rediculous.

Demarcus Cousins is the best center to play this game since Shaq, issues or not.  We could have had him, but passed.

Making trades for established superstars like Cousins, Butler and George are not what I would refer to as 'panic moves'.

Making a trade for Melo - that could be called a panic move.   But those other guys are all legit superstars,  they're all young,  and they're all guys who could be a part of the core of this team for years to come.

You say we shouldn't make panic moves,  but how else would you describe Ainge throwing a max contact at the metaphorical corpse that is Al Horford? I don't know if ive ever seen a more panic move then that.   The only reason  Ainge signed him was as a desperate hope that it would be enough to convince Durant to sign here.  That went down in flames,  and now we're stuck with a $120M or so paperweight.

Ibaka would impact this team just as much as Horford,  and woukd much rather get ibaka on a one year rental for the cost of Rozier anda pick...then gey Horford stuck here for the mext 4 years at a cost of $26m - $30m a year.

So please, dont try to sell the idea that Danny doesn't make moves because hes patient.   Danny didnt make moves because he's greedy,  and eber simce he pulled off a couple of fluke bargain deals,  he now believes anything less then a fluke bargain deal isnt his enough.

Problem is that flukes are flukes for a reason.  Ainge got lucky a couple of times,  and he should cash in before his luck runs out.   Which will probably happen on draft lottery night when the Brooklyn pick lands 3rd, loses about 70% of its value,  and ends up getting us a prospect like Otto Porter.

That's the thing. We are competitive. Why the heck do we sacrifice a lot more to be nothing more than what we already are? Ainge got lucky.. What a baloney. You are one of those arrogant Edited for profanity.  Please do not do it again.s who think it was all luck. Ainge worked hard for those deals. He studied the CBA, planned ahead, talked to agents, to owners, to coaches, to scouts. Its not luck, its a skill. If you cannot see that, then there's no use taking you seriously.

[crimson_stallion]

lol we don't have to make stupid moves because we are improving every day(IT/Smart/Brown ect)
and we can sign any player we want for free this summer and add two top5 picks in 2 years

You do realise that IT is as good as he's ever going to be right now,  right?

That smart will never be more then a good role player / solid starter!?

That Brown had no assurances of ever being a start?

That we can only we can't sign any player we want,  because we can only son a player if they choose our team qs the  #1 choice above all other 30 teams?

There's a reason deron and Bogut flocked straight to Cleveland.   Veterans want success.  Sometimes people forget that it's the players who choose their team in free agency,  not the other way around.   For example,  we had the cap space to sign Durant or Aldridge - yet they aren't here.  Player chooses where they go,  not Danny Ainge.

And who cares about two top 5 picks?   How many top 5 picks over the years have proven to be complete duds?  How many have become stars?  The only draft position that has an overwhelmingly high chance at stardom is the #1 pick,  and we have a 75% chance at not getting that.

[crimson_stallion]

Well now I wish we had done something at the deadline .

ya, but you can't bank on injuries


I'm still happy we didn't trade the big assets

Its not about banking on injuries.   It's about doing everything you can possibly do to try and be as competitive as you possibly can,  and going in with a winners attitude rather then being complacent and overvaluing your assets.

Nobody goes from a bottom 5 lottery team to a championship contender overnight.   It takes multiple phases of rebuilding.

First you start by trying you're best to sell high on the assets you have, to trade short term assets for long term assets and flexibility - you aim becomes development,  not winning and Ainge did that as well as I've ever seen any gm do.

Then you reach the point where you start being really competitive, and at this point you stay building the team with the aim is winning games. Ainge apparently missed this school and somehow got his brain frozen in rebuild mode.

You dont get anywhere by sitting idle.  Lebron learnt that when The Heat got beat in the finals by an old Spurs team behind young Kawhi Leonard's mvp caliber play.   The Warriors learnt it last season when they shocked the world by losibg to the Cavs,  so they added Durant.  Thats why Lebron is on a team with the highest payroll and is still whining about them not having enough.   He knows they you can't stand still id your want to be competitive.

Boston could have added Demarcus Cousins, and right now we'd have been seen as having a serious shot at a championship.  They could have added Ibaka while giving up no assets of significant value,  and even that would have taken us one significant step closer to being able to compete with the Cavs and maybe make the finals.

Being competitive is beneficial.   Danny doesn't want to sacrifice assets and cap flexibility,  but what good is cap flexibility if no players want to sign with you as their first choice? 

 If we made the East finals last year, and pushed the Cavs to 6 games, then maybe Durant would have signed here based on the thought that maybe adding him is all this team needs to contend for a title.

But we didnt.  We finished in a tiebreaker for the 3rd seed with 4 other teams which spells playoff mediocrity, and then we got eliminated in the first round by a Hawks team that was arguably no better then we were.  That would have been enough to tell Durant we were more then one start player from a title.  More then 2 even, because adding Horford still want enough to being him here.

So now Boston goes into the trade deadline with more assets then any other GM, every team who is considering dealing their key players are calling him,  and he is not interested in doing anything to importune the team of there is even the slightest hint of risk involved.   He wants somebody to trade him a star for scraps.   So no deal gets done.

Now Toronto adds Ibaka,  which improves their team dramatically.  They'll probably finish above us by the time the playoffs come around,  and i am very confident that if we play then in the playoffs we will lose.

The wizards are creeping up on us,  and are a legit threat.  They're very capable of beating Ius in a 7 game series.

Now let's say finish 3Rd, wizards finish 4Th, and the Wizards eliminate us in the first round.  Now every few agent will be thinking about the fact that we've been knocked out of the first round 3 years in a row, and that were more then 1 guy away from being a championship contender.   Unless they are 100% fixated on Boston,  that's likely enough to convince them to sign elsewhere.

Now let's say it pick at #3 and we miss out on the key prospects.   Suddenly we start next season having not budged freon where we were in a year where we got eliminated in the first round.

But if Aibge made a move - even just a modest one.  Say,  the ibaka trade for a pick and Rozier.   Let's say that's smith for us to finish with the 2nd seed, beat the wizards and raptors,  make the ECF, win 1 or 2 games against Cleveland. That could be all out takes to convince a Hayward or Griffin to sign with Boston, knowing they could put us over the top.

Now let's say ibaka wants to much and we don't resign him.   Who cares?   Our sacrifice of Rozier and a pick just ended up the difference between us being a key free agent who improves the team,  or getting nobody.

And we will get to draft a top 4 guy anyway. But not that prospect has less pressure on him to have to make a huge impact right away.

This is why Ainge frustrates the hell out of me.

Have you forgotten about the 06-08 Celtics? They went from 2nd-worst to champions in one year. The Cavs are another good example, LeBron - a true superstar - took them from garbage to a near-contender in his first season. Same with Larry Bird.

Ainge is waiting for blue-chip talent, cause almost every NBA champion was led by an all-time player.

These incremental moves aren't worth worrying about one way or the other.

Free agents know this is a good organization already. The fact that AInge doesn't make panic trades doesn't hurt that notion, it reinforces it.

so what do you propose?

That of Boston can't very a Lebron / Bird caliber player, then there's no point in even trying to be good, or making any attempt whatsoever to be competitive?

The Celtics should just sit around and do nothing,  until a Lebron comes along?  That's rediculous.

Demarcus Cousins is the best center to play this game since Shaq, issues or not.  We could have had him, but passed.

Making trades for established superstars like Cousins, Butler and George are not what I would refer to as 'panic moves'.

Making a trade for Melo - that could be called a panic move.   But those other guys are all legit superstars,  they're all young,  and they're all guys who could be a part of the core of this team for years to come.

You say we shouldn't make panic moves,  but how else would you describe Ainge throwing a max contact at the metaphorical corpse that is Al Horford? I don't know if ive ever seen a more panic move then that.   The only reason  Ainge signed him was as a desperate hope that it would be enough to convince Durant to sign here.  That went down in flames,  and now we're stuck with a $120M or so paperweight.

Ibaka would impact this team just as much as Horford,  and woukd much rather get ibaka on a one year rental for the cost of Rozier anda pick...then gey Horford stuck here for the mext 4 years at a cost of $26m - $30m a year.

So please, dont try to sell the idea that Danny doesn't make moves because hes patient.   Danny didnt make moves because he's greedy,  and eber simce he pulled off a couple of fluke bargain deals,  he now believes anything less then a fluke bargain deal isnt his enough.

Problem is that flukes are flukes for a reason.  Ainge got lucky a couple of times,  and he should cash in before his luck runs out.   Which will probably happen on draft lottery night when the Brooklyn pick lands 3rd, loses about 70% of its value,  and ends up getting us a prospect like Otto Porter.

That's the thing. We are competitive. Why the heck do we sacrifice a lot more to be nothing more than what we already are? Ainge got lucky.. What a baloney. You are one of those arrogant ****s who think it was all luck. Ainge worked hard for those deals. He studied the CBA, planned ahead, talked to agents, to owners, to coaches, to scouts. Its not luck, its a skill. If you cannot see that, then there's no use taking you seriously.

If you can't see that those deals are more then 50% luck them you're absolutely blinded by green goggles.

You really think that Danny expected to get the haul he did in return for Pierce and KG? If course not.  It was right place,  right time...and it never woukd habe happened if not for the fact that he was dealing with a brand new team with a billionaire owner that had an abdolute wet dream obsession with doing anything to ' win now ' - even if it meant giving up the entire future for two ex stars in theur mid 30s.

You think Ainge want lucky as hell to have the ray and KG deals fall in his lap?   If course he was.  Two teams who hearkened to be selling their superstar players right at the opportune time.  That barely ever happens.

Ainge has practicality admitted himself that those deals were half flukes - just right place,  right time.

You think Ainge serious predicted that Thomas was going to ne the NBAs 2Nd leading scorer at 29 PPG a couple of years after he graced for him?  Of course he didnt.  Maybe he thought he'd get lucky and IT would end up a 22 or 23 PPG scorer, but nobody could have predicted this.

Or that Crowder was going to develop in a really good starter,  in the day he traded for him?  No way.   In sure he liked Crowder,  probability thought he'd be a nice 6tg man or defensive role player,  but I asure you he didn't predict he'd be this good.

Or the that the Nets would be so bad. He probably thought he had a solid shot at the Nets picks falling in the lottery,  maybe even top 10.   But three top 3 picks?  Guarantee he didn't foresee that.

He's picked his opportunities well, but luck has given him more then a little bit of help along the way. A few of those moves go a bit less in the "wow doesn't see that coming"  direction and everything changes.

Hell is his foresight was that good he woukdnt have signed Horford....

And you say we are competitive,  I beg to differ.   The goal in this nba is to win a championship.   If the team doesn't have any real chance as a championship,  then as far as im concerned that team is not competitive.  Which is fine...long as said team is making changes necessary to try and BECOME competitive.   Which Danny Ainge right now absolutely is not doing.

Which players were available potentially at the deadline?   Demarcus Cousins?  Jimmy Butler? Paul George?

Danny passed on those guys,  so how about this.   Let's se who he does get over the next year, and then we can meet up back here again,  and we'll evaluate to see if those guys that he gets end up any better then Cousins, Butler and George. 

I'll take that bet any time.

[Ilikesports17]

If Ainge getting KG was a fluke and then Ainge getting the Nets picks was a fluke and then getting Isaiah and Croweder were all flukes then I say Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline. it lets wait for another fluke!

[adam8]

Well now I wish we had done something at the deadline .

ya, but you can't bank on injuries


I'm still happy we didn't trade the big assets

Its not about banking on injuries.   It's about doing everything you can possibly do to try and be as competitive as you possibly can,  and going in with a winners attitude rather then being complacent and overvaluing your assets.

Nobody goes from a bottom 5 lottery team to a championship contender overnight.   It takes multiple phases of rebuilding.

First you start by trying you're best to sell high on the assets you have, to trade short term assets for long term assets and flexibility - you aim becomes development,  not winning and Ainge did that as well as I've ever seen any gm do.

Then you reach the point where you start being really competitive, and at this point you stay building the team with the aim is winning games. Ainge apparently missed this school and somehow got his brain frozen in rebuild mode.

You dont get anywhere by sitting idle.  Lebron learnt that when The Heat got beat in the finals by an old Spurs team behind young Kawhi Leonard's mvp caliber play.   The Warriors learnt it last season when they shocked the world by losibg to the Cavs,  so they added Durant.  Thats why Lebron is on a team with the highest payroll and is still whining about them not having enough.   He knows they you can't stand still id your want to be competitive.

Boston could have added Demarcus Cousins, and right now we'd have been seen as having a serious shot at a championship.  They could have added Ibaka while giving up no assets of significant value,  and even that would have taken us one significant step closer to being able to compete with the Cavs and maybe make the finals.

Being competitive is beneficial.   Danny doesn't want to sacrifice assets and cap flexibility,  but what good is cap flexibility if no players want to sign with you as their first choice? 

 If we made the East finals last year, and pushed the Cavs to 6 games, then maybe Durant would have signed here based on the thought that maybe adding him is all this team needs to contend for a title.

But we didnt.  We finished in a tiebreaker for the 3rd seed with 4 other teams which spells playoff mediocrity, and then we got eliminated in the first round by a Hawks team that was arguably no better then we were.  That would have been enough to tell Durant we were more then one start player from a title.  More then 2 even, because adding Horford still want enough to being him here.

So now Boston goes into the trade deadline with more assets then any other GM, every team who is considering dealing their key players are calling him,  and he is not interested in doing anything to importune the team of there is even the slightest hint of risk involved.   He wants somebody to trade him a star for scraps.   So no deal gets done.

Now Toronto adds Ibaka,  which improves their team dramatically.  They'll probably finish above us by the time the playoffs come around,  and i am very confident that if we play then in the playoffs we will lose.

The wizards are creeping up on us,  and are a legit threat.  They're very capable of beating Ius in a 7 game series.

Now let's say finish 3Rd, wizards finish 4Th, and the Wizards eliminate us in the first round.  Now every few agent will be thinking about the fact that we've been knocked out of the first round 3 years in a row, and that were more then 1 guy away from being a championship contender.   Unless they are 100% fixated on Boston,  that's likely enough to convince them to sign elsewhere.

Now let's say it pick at #3 and we miss out on the key prospects.   Suddenly we start next season having not budged freon where we were in a year where we got eliminated in the first round.

But if Aibge made a move - even just a modest one.  Say,  the ibaka trade for a pick and Rozier.   Let's say that's smith for us to finish with the 2nd seed, beat the wizards and raptors,  make the ECF, win 1 or 2 games against Cleveland. That could be all out takes to convince a Hayward or Griffin to sign with Boston, knowing they could put us over the top.

Now let's say ibaka wants to much and we don't resign him.   Who cares?   Our sacrifice of Rozier and a pick just ended up the difference between us being a key free agent who improves the team,  or getting nobody.

And we will get to draft a top 4 guy anyway. But not that prospect has less pressure on him to have to make a huge impact right away.

This is why Ainge frustrates the hell out of me.

Have you forgotten about the 06-08 Celtics? They went from 2nd-worst to champions in one year. The Cavs are another good example, LeBron - a true superstar - took them from garbage to a near-contender in his first season. Same with Larry Bird.

Ainge is waiting for blue-chip talent, cause almost every NBA champion was led by an all-time player.

These incremental moves aren't worth worrying about one way or the other.

Free agents know this is a good organization already. The fact that AInge doesn't make panic trades doesn't hurt that notion, it reinforces it.

so what do you propose?

That of Boston can't very a Lebron / Bird caliber player, then there's no point in even trying to be good, or making any attempt whatsoever to be competitive?

The Celtics should just sit around and do nothing,  until a Lebron comes along?  That's rediculous.

Demarcus Cousins is the best center to play this game since Shaq, issues or not.  We could have had him, but passed.

Making trades for established superstars like Cousins, Butler and George are not what I would refer to as 'panic moves'.

Making a trade for Melo - that could be called a panic move.   But those other guys are all legit superstars,  they're all young,  and they're all guys who could be a part of the core of this team for years to come.

You say we shouldn't make panic moves,  but how else would you describe Ainge throwing a max contact at the metaphorical corpse that is Al Horford? I don't know if ive ever seen a more panic move then that.   The only reason  Ainge signed him was as a desperate hope that it would be enough to convince Durant to sign here.  That went down in flames,  and now we're stuck with a $120M or so paperweight.

Ibaka would impact this team just as much as Horford,  and woukd much rather get ibaka on a one year rental for the cost of Rozier anda pick...then gey Horford stuck here for the mext 4 years at a cost of $26m - $30m a year.

So please, dont try to sell the idea that Danny doesn't make moves because hes patient.   Danny didnt make moves because he's greedy,  and eber simce he pulled off a couple of fluke bargain deals,  he now believes anything less then a fluke bargain deal isnt his enough.

Problem is that flukes are flukes for a reason.  Ainge got lucky a couple of times,  and he should cash in before his luck runs out.   Which will probably happen on draft lottery night when the Brooklyn pick lands 3rd, loses about 70% of its value,  and ends up getting us a prospect like Otto Porter.

That's the thing. We are competitive. Why the heck do we sacrifice a lot more to be nothing more than what we already are? Ainge got lucky.. What a baloney. You are one of those arrogant ****s who think it was all luck. Ainge worked hard for those deals. He studied the CBA, planned ahead, talked to agents, to owners, to coaches, to scouts. Its not luck, its a skill. If you cannot see that, then there's no use taking you seriously.

If you can't see that those deals are more then 50% luck them you're absolutely blinded by green goggles.

You really think that Danny expected to get the haul he did in return for Pierce and KG? If course not.  It was right place,  right time...and it never woukd habe happened if not for the fact that he was dealing with a brand new team with a billionaire owner that had an abdolute wet dream obsession with doing anything to ' win now ' - even if it meant giving up the entire future for two ex stars in theur mid 30s.

You think Ainge want lucky as hell to have the ray and KG deals fall in his lap?   If course he was.  Two teams who hearkened to be selling their superstar players right at the opportune time.  That barely ever happens.

Ainge has practicality admitted himself that those deals were half flukes - just right place,  right time.

You think Ainge serious predicted that Thomas was going to ne the NBAs 2Nd leading scorer at 29 PPG a couple of years after he graced for him?  Of course he didnt.  Maybe he thought he'd get lucky and IT would end up a 22 or 23 PPG scorer, but nobody could have predicted this.

Or that Crowder was going to develop in a really good starter,  in the day he traded for him?  No way.   In sure he liked Crowder,  probability thought he'd be a nice 6tg man or defensive role player,  but I asure you he didn't predict he'd be this good.

Or the that the Nets would be so bad. He probably thought he had a solid shot at the Nets picks falling in the lottery,  maybe even top 10.   But three top 3 picks?  Guarantee he didn't foresee that.

He's picked his opportunities well, but luck has given him more then a little bit of help along the way. A few of those moves go a bit less in the "wow doesn't see that coming"  direction and everything changes.

Hell is his foresight was that good he woukdnt have signed Horford....

And you say we are competitive,  I beg to differ.   The goal in this nba is to win a championship.   If the team doesn't have any real chance as a championship,  then as far as im concerned that team is not competitive.  Which is fine...long as said team is making changes necessary to try and BECOME competitive.   Which Danny Ainge right now absolutely is not doing.

Which players were available potentially at the deadline?   Demarcus Cousins?  Jimmy Butler? Paul George?

Danny passed on those guys,  so how about this.   Let's se who he does get over the next year, and then we can meet up back here again,  and we'll evaluate to see if those guys that he gets end up any better then Cousins, Butler and George. 

I'll take that bet any time.

Let me sum this up, Danny Ainge can't see the future.

You do realize when you break it down like this every team got lucky, did the Warriors expect Curry to be as good as he was as an undersized not super athletic kid playing at a lower tier school, maybe a decent offensive role player, how about Draymond Green in the 2nd round they thougt maybe a solid third big who can be a bit of a Swiss Army knife but not big enough to be a difference maker.

Basically with your logic there are no good or bad GMs just he ones that got lucky and had Higgs fall in their lap and he ones that didn't, who cares what teams set themselves up to be ready to pounce at a good opportunity like Danny has so many times now, it was just pure luck that the opportunity arose.

[Surferdad]

lol we don't have to make stupid moves because we are improving every day(IT/Smart/Brown ect)
and we can sign any player we want for free this summer and add two top5 picks in 2 years

You do realise that IT is as good as he's ever going to be right now,  right?

That smart will never be more then a good role player / solid starter!?

That Brown had no assurances of ever being a start?

That we can only we can't sign any player we want,  because we can only son a player if they choose our team qs the  #1 choice above all other 30 teams?

There's a reason deron and Bogut flocked straight to Cleveland.   Veterans want success.  Sometimes people forget that it's the players who choose their team in free agency,  not the other way around.   For example,  we had the cap space to sign Durant or Aldridge - yet they aren't here.  Player chooses where they go,  not Danny Ainge.

And who cares about two top 5 picks?   How many top 5 picks over the years have proven to be complete duds?  How many have become stars?  The only draft position that has an overwhelmingly high chance at stardom is the #1 pick,  and we have a 75% chance at not getting that.

There are so many things in this post that I disagree with, but let's first focus on your assertion that IT, Smart and Brown are not going to get better.  Where's the evidence?  IMO, all three are playing much better this season (for Brown compare his current play to the beginning of the season).  IT has become an elite scorer and legit 2-time all-star.  Smart has established himself as the ultimate energy guy that no one in the league likes to face.

About free agents, you mentioned Bogut and D-Will, but FORGOT TO MENTION AL HORFORD CNOSE BOSTON.  Also, Durant did consider Boston, very seriously.

About lottery picks, I suggest you do the research to answer your own questions.  I would bet that the majority of stars in the NBA were picked in the top 5.  That doesn't mean there aren't some that are outside the top-5 or that there are occasionally a few duds in the top-5, but it's always better to have a higher pick.  Celtics have a 25% chance at the number-1 pick and close to 50% chance at the top-3, so please look at the glass half-full, not half-empty..

[ThaPreacher]

If Ainge getting KG was a fluke and then Ainge getting the Nets picks was a fluke and then getting Isaiah and Croweder were all flukes then I say **** it lets wait for another fluke!

What the fluke?
Fluke on, Danny, Fluke on!

[saltlover]

lol we don't have to make stupid moves because we are improving every day(IT/Smart/Brown ect)
and we can sign any player we want for free this summer and add two top5 picks in 2 years

You do realise that IT is as good as he's ever going to be right now,  right?

That smart will never be more then a good role player / solid starter!?

That Brown had no assurances of ever being a start?

That we can only we can't sign any player we want,  because we can only son a player if they choose our team qs the  #1 choice above all other 30 teams?

There's a reason deron and Bogut flocked straight to Cleveland.   Veterans want success.  Sometimes people forget that it's the players who choose their team in free agency,  not the other way around.   For example,  we had the cap space to sign Durant or Aldridge - yet they aren't here.  Player chooses where they go,  not Danny Ainge.

And who cares about two top 5 picks?   How many top 5 picks over the years have proven to be complete duds?  How many have become stars?  The only draft position that has an overwhelmingly high chance at stardom is the #1 pick,  and we have a 75% chance at not getting that.

Aren't you a New Orleans fan now?

[RockinRyA]

A lot of thought came with the decisions Ainge has to make. To assume its luck is comical. I mean why do teams even have to consider who to hire as GMs. Just hire Crimson here and wish he has great luck!

To generalize draft success at each slot is dumb. Very dumb. Not all drafts are created equal, and while you cannot accurately see how a guy would develop, you can use educated thinking using several factors to lessen the odds of failure.

Again, there are several studies that show how in general draft picks perform depending on where they are picked. And while there are outliers (for example, no. 3 outperforming no. 2) that is expected in the world of statistics.

But hey, its all luck anyway according to you Crimson. Let's just trade our pick for a second rounder. Its all luck anyway, at least a second rounder has lower salary.