Simmons agent might try and hold him out this year. Is that a good idea?

[Clench123]

It's an outstanding idea.

- Let's them feed developmental minutes into Saric
- Let's them focus on figuring out their center log jam.  Put the focus on the bigs this season so they can make a decision on which one they want to keep.
- Let's them tank again this year for potentially two Top 5 picks in a draft toploaded with PG's and SF's.
- Delays the need to field a competitive team this year.  They can push back the start of Phase 2 until next season.
- Takes pressure off Simmons to immediately be a savior.  They can bring him back slowly with low expectations.

A win all around.

The 76ers still haven't approved your résumé, huh?  With the amount of work you've put in this offseason, you'd probably get the job.

[bdm860]

It's an outstanding idea.

- Let's them feed developmental minutes into Saric
- Let's them focus on figuring out their center log jam.  Put the focus on the bigs this season so they can make a decision on which one they want to keep.
- Let's them tank again this year for potentially two Top 5 picks in a draft toploaded with PG's and SF's.
- Delays the need to field a competitive team this year.  They can push back the start of Phase 2 until next season.
- Takes pressure off Simmons to immediately be a savior.  They can bring him back slowly with low expectations.

A win all around.

I pretty much have the opposite take on all of this.

- Let's them feed developmental minutes into Saric

At the cost of developing Simmons.  There's already going to be overlap with those two players playing together (playing Simmons at PG or SG or SF with Saric at SF or PF or C).  Sure Saric will get a few more minutes (maybe going from 20-25mpg to 30-35mpg, but would you rather have developed Simmons 100% and Saric 75-80%, or Simmons 0% and Saric 100%?  This one is a no brainer to me.

- Let's them focus on figuring out their center log jam.  Put the focus on the bigs this season so they can make a decision on which one they want to keep.

Can you really figure out the logjam with a key cog missing?  If one of Noel/Okafor/Embiid plays better with Simmons than the others, wouldn't you want to know that?  Isn't that a key part of the evaluation?  Also couldn't a player like Simmons make all other players look better, potentailly raising the trade value for the odd man out?

- Takes pressure off Simmons to immediately be a savior.  They can bring him back slowly with low expectations.

Wouldn't this just shift the pressure from this year to next year while adding even more pressure next season as he would theoretically be playing with a better team/more developed players in 2018?  If anything I really think playing a partial season takes all the pressure off, because it gives him an excuse for playing bad and/or not turning the Sixers around. Nobody expects much from a guy who missed most of training camp coming back from a major injury in January/February/March and joining a 15-45 team at the bottom of the standings.  People would expect a lot more from a guy was cleared to come back in January but decided to take an extra 4 months off just to be extra ready.

- Let's them tank again this year for potentially two Top 5 picks in a draft toploaded with PG's and SF's.
- Delays the need to field a competitive team this year.  They can push back the start of Phase 2 until next season.

Sure it helps Philly tank again, so that could be nice and help them nab another nice pick.  That's really the only positive I see for Philly.  But it also comes at the expense of another year of losing which can be toxic for the players they want to keep around.


I really think the ideal situation for most rookies would be to come in and play half a season with no pressure to get adjusted to the NBA then really break out that next year.  This could also help Simmons avoid hitting that rookie wall.  Also can't imagine sitting out that whole year could help from an endorsement standpoint.  Sure he already has the shoe deal, but put some highlight plays together in the 2nd half of the season and you can be in a few more commercials over the summer pimping Kia's or State Farm or whatever.

The only benefit I see for Simmons is it keeps him in the running for ROY next year if he sits out this whole season (while possibly delaying that first All-Star berth or All-NBA appearance).  Is that one piece of hardware really worth it?

[celticsclay]

It's an outstanding idea.

- Let's them feed developmental minutes into Saric
- Let's them focus on figuring out their center log jam.  Put the focus on the bigs this season so they can make a decision on which one they want to keep.
- Let's them tank again this year for potentially two Top 5 picks in a draft toploaded with PG's and SF's.
- Delays the need to field a competitive team this year.  They can push back the start of Phase 2 until next season.
- Takes pressure off Simmons to immediately be a savior.  They can bring him back slowly with low expectations.

A win all around.

I pretty much have the opposite take on all of this.

- Let's them feed developmental minutes into Saric

At the cost of developing Simmons.  There's already going to be overlap with those two players playing together (playing Simmons at PG or SG or SF with Saric at SF or PF or C).  Sure Saric will get a few more minutes (maybe going from 20-25mpg to 30-35mpg, but would you rather have developed Simmons 100% and Saric 75-80%, or Simmons 0% and Saric 100%?  This one is a no brainer to me.

- Let's them focus on figuring out their center log jam.  Put the focus on the bigs this season so they can make a decision on which one they want to keep.

Can you really figure out the logjam with a key cog missing?  If one of Noel/Okafor/Embiid plays better with Simmons than the others, wouldn't you want to know that?  Isn't that a key part of the evaluation?  Also couldn't a player like Simmons make all other players look better, potentailly raising the trade value for the odd man out?

- Takes pressure off Simmons to immediately be a savior.  They can bring him back slowly with low expectations.

Wouldn't this just shift the pressure from this year to next year while adding even more pressure next season as he would theoretically be playing with a better team/more developed players in 2018?  If anything I really think playing a partial season takes all the pressure off, because it gives him an excuse for playing bad and/or not turning the Sixers around. Nobody expects much from a guy who missed most of training camp coming back from a major injury in January/February/March and joining a 15-45 team at the bottom of the standings.  People would expect a lot more from a guy was cleared to come back in January but decided to take an extra 4 months off just to be extra ready.

- Let's them tank again this year for potentially two Top 5 picks in a draft toploaded with PG's and SF's.
- Delays the need to field a competitive team this year.  They can push back the start of Phase 2 until next season.

Sure it helps Philly tank again, so that could be nice and help them nab another nice pick.  That's really the only positive I see for Philly.  But it also comes at the expense of another year of losing which can be toxic for the players they want to keep around.


I really think the ideal situation for most rookies would be to come in and play half a season with no pressure to get adjusted to the NBA then really break out that next year.  This could also help Simmons avoid hitting that rookie wall.  Also can't imagine sitting out that whole year could help from an endorsement standpoint.  Sure he already has the shoe deal, but put some highlight plays together in the 2nd half of the season and you can be in a few more commercials over the summer pimping Kia's or State Farm or whatever.

The only benefit I see for Simmons is it keeps him in the running for ROY next year if he sits out this whole season (while possibly delaying that first All-Star berth or All-NBA appearance).  Is that one piece of hardware really worth it?

I'm sure lb was being tongue in cheek when he said it was a win all around. Obviously having your potential franchise player have a serious injury is not really a win. The only time I remember that happening was David Robinson 18 years ago (that was a pretty different and fluky situation though)

[nickagneta]

It's an outstanding idea.

- Let's them feed developmental minutes into Saric
- Let's them focus on figuring out their center log jam.  Put the focus on the bigs this season so they can make a decision on which one they want to keep.
- Let's them tank again this year for potentially two Top 5 picks in a draft toploaded with PG's and SF's.
- Delays the need to field a competitive team this year.  They can push back the start of Phase 2 until next season.
- Takes pressure off Simmons to immediately be a savior.  They can bring him back slowly with low expectations.

A win all around.

I know its your shtick to turn bad news and stupid decisions made by the Sixers into some sort of all knowing plan to eventually, someday, maybe, one day, possibly have one 50 win season(not a chip just a 50 win season), but come on, even you can not spin this into good news with any type of sincerity.

Another great and very high draft pick, who didnt want to be in Philly in the first place like others before him, gets hurt and is now thinking about sitting out a year. The Sixers have sucked for years, the will suck another year and will never know just how good their young talent will ever develop together.

This isnt good news nor can it be spun to be.

I hate the Sixers but their fans deserve better than the stupid Hinkie plan continuing on indefinitely.

[tazzmaniac]

feel bad for Simmons (and not just for being drafted by Philly) but karma's a **** and she's biting Philly's butt for all that blatant tanking.  no sympathy there.   yet another example why a franchise can't afford to put all its eggs in the 'draft' basket.  they need to keep all options open for improving.

as for the agent, he should have no say in this.  it's up to the team when they put their new franchise savior on the court.    it would behoove them to do so this year to avoid having another prize player lose a year off their rookie deal (hello Embiid) and also see which big man he gels with (if any).  if Simmons is out for the year, I fully expect Noel to do whatever he has to to hit the free agent market as soon as possible which would be yet another kick in the teeth to Philly and one more demonstration why banking on the draft exclusively isn't a prudent path.

By building through the draft the Sixers have kept all their options open.  They have young players and picks to trade if a desirable star becomes available (not likely).  If not they can develop their young players this year and get one or two more top 5 players in next year's draft.  They also have the most cap space to sign free agents.  That's flexibility. 

Regardless of Simmons injury, Noel will be a restricted free agent next year but the Sixers can match any offer unless he decides to play for his minimum qualifying offer for one more year. 

[celticsclay]

feel bad for Simmons (and not just for being drafted by Philly) but karma's a **** and she's biting Philly's butt for all that blatant tanking.  no sympathy there.   yet another example why a franchise can't afford to put all its eggs in the 'draft' basket.  they need to keep all options open for improving.

as for the agent, he should have no say in this.  it's up to the team when they put their new franchise savior on the court.    it would behoove them to do so this year to avoid having another prize player lose a year off their rookie deal (hello Embiid) and also see which big man he gels with (if any).  if Simmons is out for the year, I fully expect Noel to do whatever he has to to hit the free agent market as soon as possible which would be yet another kick in the teeth to Philly and one more demonstration why banking on the draft exclusively isn't a prudent path.

By building through the draft the Sixers have kept all their options open.  They have young players and picks to trade if a desirable star becomes available (not likely).  If not they can develop their young players this year and get one or two more top 5 players in next year's draft.  They also have the most cap space to sign free agents.  That's flexibility. 

Regardless of Simmons injury, Noel will be a restricted free agent next year but the Sixers can match any offer unless he decides to play for his minimum qualifying offer for one more year.

Well it does seem regrettable that they will have to make a big decision on Noel without ever seeing him play with the future of their franchise. Presumably to keep Noel he would get close to a max. Then you got to start thinking about embiid being a free agent before too long. They obviously have some interesting pieces and I'm not gonna pretend it is a bad situation. This injury, if it is the whole year, will force them to make some decisions with a lot less information than they would like.

[Fan from VT]

Stupid for the agent to say that now. What he should say is "Ben has a long career ahead if him, and is looking forward to returning Philly to the playoffs. Even if he were healthy this year, that was pribably not going to hallen this year, so I would advise Ben to work on healing and rehabbing until he is 100% and our doctirs agree there is no long term harm when he is ready to play, whenever that may be, 1 month, 3 months, 1 year."

I think there would be some major repercussions if the docs said he was healthy and the agent tild him to sit, especially in year 1 of a 4 year guaranteed deal, not even an impending free afent

[celticsclay]

Stupid for the agent to say that now. What he should say is "Ben has a long career ahead if him, and is looking forward to returning Philly to the playoffs. Even if he were healthy this year, that was pribably not going to hallen this year, so I would advise Ben to work on healing and rehabbing until he is 100% and our doctirs agree there is no long term harm when he is ready to play, whenever that may be, 1 month, 3 months, 1 year."

I think there would be some major repercussions if the docs said he was healthy and the agent tild him to sit, especially in year 1 of a 4 year guaranteed deal, not even an impending free afent

I mean I don't think anyone thinks the agent should be saying this stuff

[tazzmaniac]

feel bad for Simmons (and not just for being drafted by Philly) but karma's a **** and she's biting Philly's butt for all that blatant tanking.  no sympathy there.   yet another example why a franchise can't afford to put all its eggs in the 'draft' basket.  they need to keep all options open for improving.

as for the agent, he should have no say in this.  it's up to the team when they put their new franchise savior on the court.    it would behoove them to do so this year to avoid having another prize player lose a year off their rookie deal (hello Embiid) and also see which big man he gels with (if any).  if Simmons is out for the year, I fully expect Noel to do whatever he has to to hit the free agent market as soon as possible which would be yet another kick in the teeth to Philly and one more demonstration why banking on the draft exclusively isn't a prudent path.

By building through the draft the Sixers have kept all their options open.  They have young players and picks to trade if a desirable star becomes available (not likely).  If not they can develop their young players this year and get one or two more top 5 players in next year's draft.  They also have the most cap space to sign free agents.  That's flexibility. 

Regardless of Simmons injury, Noel will be a restricted free agent next year but the Sixers can match any offer unless he decides to play for his minimum qualifying offer for one more year.

Well it does seem regrettable that they will have to make a big decision on Noel without ever seeing him play with the future of their franchise. Presumably to keep Noel he would get close to a max. Then you got to start thinking about embiid being a free agent before too long. They obviously have some interesting pieces and I'm not gonna pretend it is a bad situation. This injury, if it is the whole year, will force them to make some decisions with a lot less information than they would like.

If Simmons misses the whole season that would be a setback for his development but the medical info seems to indicate he should just miss a few months.  I don't think Simmons factors much into their decision on Noel or Okafor.  If Embiid proves to be healthy this season, I think they'll try to move Okafor and retain Noel.  Embiid and Noel are better fits for the fast pace defensive style they'd prefer to play. 

Wouldn't a max contract for Noel be over 25mil?  I can't see him getting close to that.  My guess would be 4yr/60-72mil range.  I don't see many teams having both the cap space and the need/desire for Noel.   

[TheSundanceKid]

Basically the agent and Simmons want to win ROY and realise that isn't going to happen with this injury. So holding him out for the year makes sense.
For Philly, he plays when he is ready, even if that is only for 10 games this year. At the trade deadline they may have cleared the logjam of bigs and want to get moving with their core players together.

Also what's all this karma is a Edited.  Profanity and masked profanity are against forum rules and may result in discipline. talk about? There's no bad karma owed to Philly. They played the system just like other teams have in the past. The only thing they messed up was not having a veteran presence around to nurture the kids through the losing. The picks they made were all fine at the times they were made and they didn't get their building block until Simmons. If anything they were unlucky they had to rebuild for so long.

[Csfan1984]

Absolutely hold off the year look how great it worked for Griffin. If the player has great work ethic, you don't have to worry about delaying the start of his playing career a single year. Get him healthy.

[Moranis]

He shouldn't turn into Derrick Rose.  That is a bad look.  If he is healthy and cleared he should play.  Makes no difference when that is.  Every bit of work will make him a better player down the line.

[Eja117]

Peace of mind should matter a lot here. For both the Sixers and Ben.

If he totally heals he could play some minutes in the D League then play some relatively meaningless minutes at the big club just to get a feel for teammates and the speed of the league.

But even then the cons might outweigh the pros.

The injury has to be like 110% healed before taking any risks. There's just no reason. Holding him out could solve so many problems.

[gift]

Depends on the injury. Like someone said, if he's not coming back until March or so, yeah just stay out (but practice with the team).

If he could really come back in January, that's a lot of growth and experience he could gain over the course of the rest of the season. I think he'd be a better player in year 2 for playing a partial year 1.

[GratefulCs]

I feel terrible for the philly fans