Bird>James

[Big333223]

Career to career, because of Lebron's longevity and durability, I can see putting his over Bird's.

But if I can have one player, at his peak, for one full season or for one single game, I'm picking Bird over Lebron in both of those scenarios.

[budMovin]

Bird is my favorite player ever, but when it's all said and done, James will have the better career.

[PhoSita]

LeBron has the edge in nearly every statistical category aside from free throw percentage and rebounds per game.

On top of that, he's been to the Finals more times and has the same number of rings.

[loco_91]

I don't like this obsession with ranking. Bird was great, James is great. All I know is that was a hell of a game 7 and that chase-down block was one of the great moments in NBA history.

[Roy H.]

On top of that, he's been to the Finals more times and has the same number of rings.

Winning his conference doesn't impress me that much. The East is extremely weak right now; Lebron has a much easier path than Boston having to face Philly, Detroit, Milwaukee, etc.  Talent was more consolidated in the 23 team league that Larry played in.

[jambr380]

I can see the argument for longevity of careers being in Lebron's favor, but prime vs prime shouldn't really be much of a question. Time and time again Bird came through in the clutch while Lebron has left that duty to his teammates (even though he has generally played well in those big games). Lebron also doesn't have nearly the offensive repertoire that Bird had.

I am obviously biased, but I guess I prefer wizardry over sheer physical dominance.

[rochrist]

Taking longevity into account, James is now unquestionably ahead of Bird and probably Kareem and Magic as well.

The thing is, it's about being a basketball player, not being a physical freak. Bird, Magic, MJ - all better -BB players-. I watched that show on the 86 Cs the other night. That team would smoke either of this year's finalists. It was a reminder of just who weak and insipid the NBA has become.

[oldtype]

Taking longevity into account, James is now unquestionably ahead of Bird and probably Kareem and Magic as well.

The thing is, it's about being a basketball player, not being a physical freak. Bird, Magic, MJ - all better -BB players-. I watched that show on the 86 Cs the other night. That team would smoke either of this year's finalists. It was a reminder of just who weak and insipid the NBA has become.

I don't see how being a physical freak somehow makes you less great than being technically accomplished. Also, it's not as if Lebron doesn't have ridiculous technique in terms of passing and finishing as well as all-time level court vision and basketball IQ.

If you're going to make the "league is watered down these days" argument, then we're going to have to have a conversation about whether Lebron is higher up than Russell.

[PhoSita]

On top of that, he's been to the Finals more times and has the same number of rings.

Winning his conference doesn't impress me that much. The East is extremely weak right now; Lebron has a much easier path than Boston having to face Philly, Detroit, Milwaukee, etc.  Talent was more consolidated in the 23 team league that Larry played in.

I think that's a fair caveat to the number of Finals appearances.  Still, it hardly discounts all the other areas in which LeBron has clearly surpassed Larry.

Let's be honest here, Larry was working with less than half what LeBron has going on physically.  Both extremely gutsy, intelligent players that lead their teams on both ends.  LeBron gets the edge because he has all of that plus a body like Karl Malone crossed with Scottie Pippen.

[Surferdad]

On top of that, he's been to the Finals more times and has the same number of rings.

Winning his conference doesn't impress me that much. The East is extremely weak right now; Lebron has a much easier path than Boston having to face Philly, Detroit, Milwaukee, etc.  Talent was more consolidated in the 23 team league that Larry played in.

I think that's a fair caveat to the number of Finals appearances.  Still, it hardly discounts all the other areas in which LeBron has clearly surpassed Larry.

Let's be honest here, Larry was working with less than half what LeBron has going on physically.  Both extremely gutsy, intelligent players that lead their teams on both ends.  LeBron gets the edge because he has all of that plus a body like Karl Malone crossed with Scottie Pippen.

So is that your reason that LeBron has passed Bird, that he has a great physique??

[ZoneD]

This is an argument that would only be had on a Celtics board  Lebron is both the better player and has had the better career.

On top of that, the NBA is clearly more talented today than it was twenty years ago. Guys are more athletic and the game has evolved to a point where they are more skilled as well. Guys hardly shot three pointers back in the day and now it's almost a required skill to be able to have a reasonably long career.

Someone mentioned Russell too...He wouldn't even be a starting caliber center in today's league. The guys he played against in the league wouldn't be high school players in today's world.

[rochrist]

Taking longevity into account, James is now unquestionably ahead of Bird and probably Kareem and Magic as well.

The thing is, it's about being a basketball player, not being a physical freak. Bird, Magic, MJ - all better -BB players-. I watched that show on the 86 Cs the other night. That team would smoke either of this year's finalists. It was a reminder of just who weak and insipid the NBA has become.

I don't see how being a physical freak somehow makes you less great than being technically accomplished. Also, it's not as if Lebron doesn't have ridiculous technique in terms of passing and finishing as well as all-time level court vision and basketball IQ.

If you're going to make the "league is watered down these days" argument, then we're going to have to have a conversation about whether Lebron is higher up than Russell.

Well, he isn't anywhere in the same universe as Larry was as a shooter, which is kind of a key fundamental. He's a good passer, but he doesn't touch Larry in that category either. Considering how much of a physical specimen James is, you'd have to call rebounding a wash. LeBron goes to the basket, but he also benefits from a league that wants and considers him their face, so he gets the benefit of a lot of questionable calls.

And if you want get get into intangibles, LeBron cried more in this one Finals than Bird did in his entire career.

[Diggles]

Larry Bird was one of the all time Greats... Hebron will be one of the all time greats.....   Its fun for everyone to voice their opinion.   We will never settle this. 

Ask Bird if he was better.....Ask Lebron... they both will say the same thing.  They think their the best. 

Bottom line, different era and different players.   Watching them both I'd give the nudge to Bird. 

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

Taking longevity into account, James is now unquestionably ahead of Bird and probably Kareem and Magic as well.

The thing is, it's about being a basketball player, not being a physical freak. Bird, Magic, MJ - all better -BB players-. I watched that show on the 86 Cs the other night. That team would smoke either of this year's finalists. It was a reminder of just who weak and insipid the NBA has become.

This is something I was thinking about, too. Bird didn't have any of the freakish athletic ability of LeBron, and definitely got more out of his talent than LeBron has. Plus, there's no one I'd rather have taking the last shot with the title on the line than Bird.

[Moranis]

James wasn't quite the shooter Bird was, but let's not pretend Bird was Steph Curry from three either.  Bird only had 6 seasons above 40%, but he was also under 30% four times.  James eclipsed 40% just once, but only his rookie year was he below 30%.  Bird was obviously a beter outside shooter, but it isn't nearly the gap people on here make it out to be, but here is where it gets really interesting.  Bird had just two seasons above 60% in TS%, James has had four such seasons already. 

Bird is a better rebounder no question, but there were a lot more possessions in the 80's than they are today and when you look at TRB%, Bird is about 4% better i.e. he grabbed 4% more of the available rebounds.  However, passing there is a significantly larger gap where James is about 10% better than Bird.  In fact James' rookie year he was 27.8%, Bird was only better than that one time (and that was about 6% lower than James' career average).  They are nearly equal in steal, block, and turnover percentage.  James career average in PER is higher than Bird's best season.

So even with the lower possessions, James has higher career highs in all but rebounds and better efficiency stats basically across the board (again except rebounds).  James not only has had a longer career, he has had a statistically greater career, with more awards and accolades.  Only Celtics fans still put Bird above James and even that list is shrinking as evident by this thread (and a few others). 

James is the greatest SF in NBA history.