if Cleveland beats GSW to win NBA does GSW 2015 chip get an asetrisk

[guava_wrench]

The concept of the OP has no merit whatsoever. Seasons are full of injury. So what?

Also, have the same teams play twice and you can get different outcomes. Even if Cleveland wins this year, that does not mean that they win last year with a healthier team. You just can't know that.

[incoherent]

The concept of the OP has no merit whatsoever. Seasons are full of injury. So what?

Also, have the same teams play twice and you can get different outcomes. Even if Cleveland wins this year, that does not mean that they win last year with a healthier team. You just can't know that.

How does the OPs concept have no merit?  Are you telling me if the Cavs healthy best GSW this year that No one would suggest what the OP is suggesting?
I'm like 100% positive everyone would be making the same point the OP is making. 

[incoherent]

People in this thread:  Acting like a team losing its 2nd and 3rd best players in a Finals is common and happens every season when really it has never happened ever.

[Snakehead]

There are no asterisks but I think it's funny how glossed over it was that the Cavs lost 2 of their 3 best players at the time.

[crimson_stallion]

One would think going on to have the best regular season in league history would be enough to quell such ridiculous naysaying of the Warriors' success, but I guess not.

I don't see any ridiculous naysaying of the Warriors success.  The OP posted a question that could be very relevant if the Cavs win when healthy.

It wont be relevant because the Cavs arent going to win the series.

[celticsclay]

People in this thread:  Acting like a team losing its 2nd and 3rd best players in a Finals is common and happens every season when really it has never happened ever.

Maybe not in the finals because most teams get knocked out earlier. The heat wrapped up their season yesterday without probably their second and 3rd best players in bosh and whiteside. We lost in the first round with probably our 3rd best player (Bradley) and Our second best player crowder severely limited. The raptors have their 3rd best player injured and their second best has been on the verge of sitting with a hand injury. The clippers got knocked out having lost their best and second best player. multiple seasons for the thunder have ended wth then missing their best player and other pieces (I think one year they were without both ibaka and durant). This really does happen every year. The only crazy thing is hat Lebron has never got hurt in playoffs in his career. So yes his just sounds like it would be whining from cavs fan.

[bdm860]

People in this thread:  Acting like a team losing its 2nd and 3rd best players in a Finals is common and happens every season when really it has never happened ever.

Maybe not in the finals because most teams get knocked out earlier. The heat wrapped up their season yesterday without probably their second and 3rd best players in bosh and whiteside. We lost in the first round with probably our 3rd best player (Bradley) and Our second best player crowder severely limited. The raptors have their 3rd best player injured and their second best has been on the verge of sitting with a hand injury. The clippers got knocked out having lost their best and second best player. multiple seasons for the thunder have ended wth then missing their best player and other pieces (I think one year they were without both ibaka and durant). This really does happen every year. The only crazy thing is hat Lebron has never got hurt in playoffs in his career. So yes his just sounds like it would be whining from cavs fan.

Or maybe it actually does happen in the Finals too, I mean just last year Kyrie Irving went down in Game #1 of the Finals.

In 2010, Perk went down in Game 6 (ok not 2nd or 3rd best player, but an important player).

In 2007, Larry Hughes didn't play after Game 2 for the Cavs, he was 2nd on the team in minutes played and points after LeBron.

Karl Malone played injured and didn't play after Game 4 in the 2004 Finals.

Kobe missed most of Game 2 and all of Game 3 in the 2000 Finals with an injury.

Not to mention pretty famous Willis Reed and Kareem injuries in the Finals (when Magic played Center).

I definitely wouldn't say never happens.  It happens.

[PhoSita]

People in this thread:  Acting like a team losing its 2nd and 3rd best players in a Finals is common and happens every season when really it has never happened ever.

Perhaps people are skeptical that two high usage no defense stars with no meaningful playoff experience would have made the difference.

To be honest, I think Cleveland was actually helped by the injuries.  Playing slow, grinding out possessions, and dominating the glass while LeBron did absolutely everything on offense was probably the Cavs' best look against the Warriors.

If Kyrie and Love had been out there, taking possessions from LeBron and getting torched by Curry, Klay, and Dray, I suspect the Finals might have been over in 5 games.


Maybe that's not how it would have gone.  We'll never know -- though perhaps the Finals this year will give us a clue.  The bottom line is, the Warriors won in 6.  Rather convincingly, too, once Kerr made his lineup adjustments.

The playoffs always involve injuries.  The Cavs still had LeBron, and they played tough and close with the Warriors for the first few games by playing a style the Warriors didn't expect, and by taking advantage of the fact that the Warriors were inexperienced and unused to the Finals stage.

The Warriors were the best team in the league last year in the regular season.  They earned a Finals win.  Then they went on to dominate the league even more completely in the regular season this year.  They've made the Western Conference Finals again.

Why there are still those who question the validity of their accomplishments is beyond me.

[incoherent]

Or maybe it actually does happen in the Finals too, I mean just last year Kyrie Irving went down in Game #1 of the Finals.

In 2010, Perk went down in Game 6 (ok not 2nd or 3rd best player, but an important player).

In 2007, Larry Hughes didn't play after Game 2 for the Cavs, he was 2nd on the team in minutes played and points after LeBron.

Karl Malone played injured and didn't play after Game 4 in the 2004 Finals.

Kobe missed most of Game 2 and all of Game 3 in the 2000 Finals with an injury.

Not to mention pretty famous Willis Reed and Kareem injuries in the Finals (when Magic played Center).

I definitely wouldn't say never happens.  It happens.

None of the examples you gave are remotely close to the Cavs situation in the finals last year.

[incoherent]

People in this thread:  Acting like a team losing its 2nd and 3rd best players in a Finals is common and happens every season when really it has never happened ever.

Perhaps people are skeptical that two high usage no defense stars with no meaningful playoff experience would have made the difference.

To be honest, I think Cleveland was actually helped by the injuries.  Playing slow, grinding out possessions, and dominating the glass while LeBron did absolutely everything on offense was probably the Cavs' best look against the Warriors.

If Kyrie and Love had been out there, taking possessions from LeBron and getting torched by Curry, Klay, and Dray, I suspect the Finals might have been over in 5 games.


Maybe that's not how it would have gone.  We'll never know -- though perhaps the Finals this year will give us a clue.  The bottom line is, the Warriors won in 6.  Rather convincingly, too, once Kerr made his lineup adjustments.

The playoffs always involve injuries.  The Cavs still had LeBron, and they played tough and close with the Warriors for the first few games by playing a style the Warriors didn't expect, and by taking advantage of the fact that the Warriors were inexperienced and unused to the Finals stage.

The Warriors were the best team in the league last year in the regular season.  They earned a Finals win.  Then they went on to dominate the league even more completely in the regular season this year.  They've made the Western Conference Finals again.

Why there are still those who question the validity of their accomplishments is beyond me.

As far as I can tell, the OP is talking about if a hypothetical situation actaully happened how would we view last years finals differently. 

You are talking about how we view them right now not factoring in the OPs hypothetical.

[jpotter33]

People in this thread:  Acting like a team losing its 2nd and 3rd best players in a Finals is common and happens every season when really it has never happened ever.

Perhaps people are skeptical that two high usage no defense stars with no meaningful playoff experience would have made the difference.

To be honest, I think Cleveland was actually helped by the injuries.  Playing slow, grinding out possessions, and dominating the glass while LeBron did absolutely everything on offense was probably the Cavs' best look against the Warriors.

If Kyrie and Love had been out there, taking possessions from LeBron and getting torched by Curry, Klay, and Dray, I suspect the Finals might have been over in 5 games.


Maybe that's not how it would have gone.  We'll never know -- though perhaps the Finals this year will give us a clue.  The bottom line is, the Warriors won in 6.  Rather convincingly, too, once Kerr made his lineup adjustments.

The playoffs always involve injuries.  The Cavs still had LeBron, and they played tough and close with the Warriors for the first few games by playing a style the Warriors didn't expect, and by taking advantage of the fact that the Warriors were inexperienced and unused to the Finals stage.

The Warriors were the best team in the league last year in the regular season.  They earned a Finals win.  Then they went on to dominate the league even more completely in the regular season this year.  They've made the Western Conference Finals again.

Why there are still those who question the validity of their accomplishments is beyond me.

No, I think the Finals this year is an entirely different story. The Cavs are playing on a level now that they never did all last year, mostly because they figured out how to make Love useful as a third option now.

They were going to get creamed last year no matter what. I totally agree with you that those two injuries actually made them even better as a team, because that offense with Lebron and Kyrie after Love went down was some of the worst streetball offense that had ever been seen in NBA Playoffs history. It was either Kyrie or Lebron going iso every possession down the floor and nothing else.

When the Warriors run through the Cavs this year, there should be absolutely no doubt that they've been the better team the last two years, though of course there still will be doubts and naysayers.

[bdm860]

Or maybe it actually does happen in the Finals too, I mean just last year Kyrie Irving went down in Game #1 of the Finals.

In 2010, Perk went down in Game 6 (ok not 2nd or 3rd best player, but an important player).

In 2007, Larry Hughes didn't play after Game 2 for the Cavs, he was 2nd on the team in minutes played and points after LeBron.

Karl Malone played injured and didn't play after Game 4 in the 2004 Finals.

Kobe missed most of Game 2 and all of Game 3 in the 2000 Finals with an injury.

Not to mention pretty famous Willis Reed and Kareem injuries in the Finals (when Magic played Center).

I definitely wouldn't say never happens.  It happens.

None of the examples you gave are remotely close to the Cavs situation in the finals last year.

You said and I quote:

People in this thread:  Acting like a team losing its 2nd and 3rd best players in a Finals is common and happens every season when really it has never happened ever.

Which one of those examples I gave is not even remotely close to that statement?  The statement that teams NEVER EVER lose one of their 2nd or 3rd best players in the Finals.

[celticsclay]

Or maybe it actually does happen in the Finals too, I mean just last year Kyrie Irving went down in Game #1 of the Finals.

In 2010, Perk went down in Game 6 (ok not 2nd or 3rd best player, but an important player).

In 2007, Larry Hughes didn't play after Game 2 for the Cavs, he was 2nd on the team in minutes played and points after LeBron.

Karl Malone played injured and didn't play after Game 4 in the 2004 Finals.

Kobe missed most of Game 2 and all of Game 3 in the 2000 Finals with an injury.

Not to mention pretty famous Willis Reed and Kareem injuries in the Finals (when Magic played Center).

I definitely wouldn't say never happens.  It happens.

None of the examples you gave are remotely close to the Cavs situation in the finals last year.

Are you going to try to argue my examples are the same? The Clippers lost Blake and Paul this year. Their best and second best player. The Heat just had their season end missing their second and third best player in Whiteside and Bosh. That is twice this season alone. Not to mention the Raptors are missing their third best player and have another starter running on fumes.  The thunder have had multiple seasons end with Durant or Westbrook healthy. One of the primary teams that could compete with the Cavs the past few seasons has seen multiple seasons end with their best player in street clothes (Rose). The grizzlies, a team that pushed the Warriors to 6 games last year, were missing key players in their own right losing their leader in Conley and if memory served correct Tony Allen also missed time. It is unusual that the Cavs were able to make the finals through a combination of a weak East at the top, having Irving for most of the run to the finals and tremendous play from Lebron. However, lets not kid ourselves that they are the only team that has had a season with serious injuries. It happens every single season. If we start getting into asterisks to champion because of some injuries every single team will have one and nothing will have been decided in the history of the NBA. If the Cavs win this year, which I still view as unlikely, they have won this year. Let's not complain and whine about what could have happened without injuries. For what it is worth, they are also the most healthy team (along with OKC) left in the playoffs.

[incoherent]

Neither the Heat or the Clippers even made it to the Conference Finals so no ... They don't even come close to a Finals team missing two of top three players.

[celticsclay]

Neither the Heat or the Clippers even made it to the Conference Finals so no ... They don't even come close to a Finals team missing two of top three players.

Is this a serious reply? You are saying the Cavaliers should get some sort of special note because they lost in the finals with injuries? But all these other teams it doesn't matter if their injuries happen because they happen earlier in the finals and kill the teams chances of making it to the finals? That really doesn't make any sense.

The point is that every single season teams lose their best players to injuries. Sometimes, unfortunately it is even their best and second best players or second and third best players. Whether it happens in the regular season or the first or second round this makes things easier for the team that plays them and harder for the team suffering injuries. Nobody is going to get some sort of special award or note for when the injuries occur.