Elephant in the room: where is our rim protector going to come from

[vjcsmoke]

Don't we already have Mickey?

Any chance we can swing a deal for Dieng, Capela, or Gobert or are they pretty much untouchable now?

[Croc Hunter]

For the way we like to play D, i'm down with trying to trade for Willie Cauley-Stein. Sac could do with a big who can stretch the floor so some kind of deal with Sullinger and a pick goig the otherv way would suit me.

[boscel33]

Trade Brooklyn pick for Nerlens Noel.

I just mentioned this in another thread.  I would love to have Noel as a C. 

[LatterDayCelticsfan]

Trade Brooklyn pick for Nerlens Noel.

Yes.

I agree with this. The Philly big I actually want.

Or Willie Caulie Stein

[Ed Hollison]

This conversation belongs to about three years ago. Since then, teams have found ways to isolate and expose pure shot blockers (rim protectors, if you prefer that) by playing 3-point shooters at the 4 and 5 positions. Think back to last year's finals, when the Warriors put Bogut on the bench and started Draymond Green at center, something they've done a lot more of this year. It essentially negated the usefulness of Mozgov.

The question shouldn't be "Where is our rim protector going to come from?" It should be "Where are we gonna find a guy who can block shots, switch onto smaller players in the pick and roll, handle the ball, shoot from the outside, and rebound?" In other words: "Where are we gonna find a player like Draymond Green?"

This is why players like Olynyk should get every opportunity to grow and develop. Olynyk can shoot, handle the ball, pass, defend most 5s, switch on the pick and roll (though you wish he were a bit more nimble). He "protects the rim" according to advanced statistics, even though he doesn't have long arms and block a lot of shots.

Similarly, this is what you *could* have in Mickey, once he's a finished product: A guy who blocks shots at a really high clip, switches onto smaller players on defense, rebounds, and shoots the 3. That's an immensely valuable and very rare collection of skills in today's NBA. Let's see if he can put it all together.

The league has changed. Pure shot blockers (er, rim protectors) who don't do other stuff are not as valuable as they used to be.

[footey]

This conversation belongs to about three years ago. Since then, teams have found ways to isolate and expose pure shot blockers (rim protectors, if you prefer that) by playing 3-point shooters at the 4 and 5 positions. Think back to last year's finals, when the Warriors put Bogut on the bench and started Draymond Green at center, something they've done a lot more of this year. It essentially negated the usefulness of Mozgov.

The question shouldn't be "Where is our rim protector going to come from?" It should be "Where are we gonna find a guy who can block shots, switch onto smaller players in the pick and roll, handle the ball, shoot from the outside, and rebound?" In other words: "Where are we gonna find a player like Draymond Green?"

This is why players like Olynyk should get every opportunity to grow and develop. Olynyk can shoot, handle the ball, pass, defend most 5s, switch on the pick and roll (though you wish he were a bit more nimble). He "protects the rim" according to advanced statistics, even though he doesn't have long arms and block a lot of shots.

Similarly, this is what you *could* have in Mickey, once he's a finished product: A guy who blocks shots at a really high clip, switches onto smaller players on defense, rebounds, and shoots the 3. That's an immensely valuable and very rare collection of skills in today's NBA. Let's see if he can put it all together.

The league has changed. Pure shot blockers (er, rim protectors) who don't do other stuff are not as valuable as they used to be.

TP. Well said.

[spikelovetheCelts]

This conversation belongs to about three years ago. Since then, teams have found ways to isolate and expose pure shot blockers (rim protectors, if you prefer that) by playing 3-point shooters at the 4 and 5 positions. Think back to last year's finals, when the Warriors put Bogut on the bench and started Draymond Green at center, something they've done a lot more of this year. It essentially negated the usefulness of Mozgov.

The question shouldn't be "Where is our rim protector going to come from?" It should be "Where are we gonna find a guy who can block shots, switch onto smaller players in the pick and roll, handle the ball, shoot from the outside, and rebound?" In other words: "Where are we gonna find a player like Draymond Green?"

This is why players like Olynyk should get every opportunity to grow and develop. Olynyk can shoot, handle the ball, pass, defend most 5s, switch on the pick and roll (though you wish he were a bit more nimble). He "protects the rim" according to advanced statistics, even though he doesn't have long arms and block a lot of shots.

Similarly, this is what you *could* have in Mickey, once he's a finished product: A guy who blocks shots at a really high clip, switches onto smaller players on defense, rebounds, and shoots the 3. That's an immensely valuable and very rare collection of skills in today's NBA. Let's see if he can put it all together.

The league has changed. Pure shot blockers (er, rim protectors) who don't do other stuff are not as valuable as they used to be.

I think Steven Adams may have something to say about that in this series. If they can move some they have a great place in the league. We will see how Bismack Biyombo effects the game tonight as well.

[ThePaintedArea]

This conversation belongs to about three years ago. Since then, teams have found ways to isolate and expose pure shot blockers (rim protectors, if you prefer that) by playing 3-point shooters at the 4 and 5 positions. Think back to last year's finals, when the Warriors put Bogut on the bench and started Draymond Green at center, something they've done a lot more of this year. It essentially negated the usefulness of Mozgov.

The term "rim-protector" was coined a couple of years ago in the analytics world to encompass exactly what you're talking about in this excellent post; but it is often mistakenly equated with "shot-blocker".  You mention Bogut in the context of offense here; in fact Bogut is one of the premier rim-protectors in the league.

The question shouldn't be "Where is our rim protector going to come from?" It should be "Where are we gonna find a guy who can block shots, switch onto smaller players in the pick and roll, handle the ball, shoot from the outside, and rebound?" In other words: "Where are we gonna find a player like Draymond Green?"

Point taken - let's take the next logical step and (leaving out the virtues on offense you've listed) say, "How is the ^team^ going to accomplish these things?", since we don't really care, in the end, if it's one player or five that gets the job done.  And in fact let's take the next step beyond that: we don't even really care if shots get blocked at all, as long as the rim is protected.

Which leads us to...

This is why players like Olynyk should get every opportunity to grow and develop. Olynyk can shoot, handle the ball, pass, defend most 5s, switch on the pick and roll (though you wish he were a bit more nimble). He "protects the rim" according to advanced statistics, even though he doesn't have long arms and block a lot of shots.

Thank you for the Olynyk defensive props (sometimes I feel like I'm the voice crying in the wilderness...)!

He's got his issues, to be sure - the image of him getting eaten up trying to stop Jordan Hill postups is seared into my memory - but this young man is a major reason why Boston's team defense has been so good for two years now.

Similarly, this is what you *could* have in Mickey, once he's a finished product: A guy who blocks shots at a really high clip, switches onto smaller players on defense, rebounds, and shoots the 3. That's an immensely valuable and very rare collection of skills in today's NBA. Let's see if he can put it all together.

Aha. Yes. Good lateral movement and wingspan. Quick shoulders, gets off the floor. Now if he can learn to move the ball in the team game.  He's 21...

The league has changed. Pure shot blockers (er, rim protectors) who don't do other stuff are not as valuable as they used to be.

Bullseye.

Noel and Cauley-Stein could both be special rim-protectors - but at this point do they even have the upside of starters on a contender?

[The Oracle]

This conversation belongs to about three years ago. Since then, teams have found ways to isolate and expose pure shot blockers (rim protectors, if you prefer that) by playing 3-point shooters at the 4 and 5 positions. Think back to last year's finals, when the Warriors put Bogut on the bench and started Draymond Green at center, something they've done a lot more of this year. It essentially negated the usefulness of Mozgov.

The term "rim-protector" was coined a couple of years ago in the analytics world to encompass exactly what you're talking about in this excellent post; but it is often mistakenly equated with "shot-blocker".  You mention Bogut in the context of offense here; in fact Bogut is one of the premier rim-protectors in the league.

The question shouldn't be "Where is our rim protector going to come from?" It should be "Where are we gonna find a guy who can block shots, switch onto smaller players in the pick and roll, handle the ball, shoot from the outside, and rebound?" In other words: "Where are we gonna find a player like Draymond Green?"

Point taken - let's take the next logical step and (leaving out the virtues on offense you've listed) say, "How is the ^team^ going to accomplish these things?", since we don't really care, in the end, if it's one player or five that gets the job done.  And in fact let's take the next step beyond that: we don't even really care if shots get blocked at all, as long as the rim is protected.

Which leads us to...

This is why players like Olynyk should get every opportunity to grow and develop. Olynyk can shoot, handle the ball, pass, defend most 5s, switch on the pick and roll (though you wish he were a bit more nimble). He "protects the rim" according to advanced statistics, even though he doesn't have long arms and block a lot of shots.

Thank you for the Olynyk defensive props (sometimes I feel like I'm the voice crying in the wilderness...)!

He's got his issues, to be sure - the image of him getting eaten up trying to stop Jordan Hill postups is seared into my memory - but this young man is a major reason why Boston's team defense has been so good for two years now.

Similarly, this is what you *could* have in Mickey, once he's a finished product: A guy who blocks shots at a really high clip, switches onto smaller players on defense, rebounds, and shoots the 3. That's an immensely valuable and very rare collection of skills in today's NBA. Let's see if he can put it all together.

Aha. Yes. Good lateral movement and wingspan. Quick shoulders, gets off the floor. Now if he can learn to move the ball in the team game.  He's 21...

The league has changed. Pure shot blockers (er, rim protectors) who don't do other stuff are not as valuable as they used to be.

Bullseye.

Noel and Cauley-Stein could both be special rim-protectors - but at this point do they even have the upside of starters on a contender?

Excellent post by Ed and PaintedArea you are not alone on Olynyk as I have posted many times over the last 3 years about Olynyk.  I have pretty much given up trying to explain why he is so valuable in today's NBA.  His defensive impact is just explained away by the masses.  Traditional "rim protectors" hold a lot less value then they used to as they are often very poor defenders away from the hoop and are being exploited by being drug away from the paint.  It is much better to have bigs that can defend the entire floor than to have bigs that can protect the rim and not much else.  Speed, mobility and intelligence is at a premium defensively.

[dreamgreen]

Rim protection is the most over rated need in the game right now. Try watching the playoffs!!