Marcus Smart's historical shooting ranking

[TheTruth]

I sort of agree with Lefty.

Let the mods decide what is acceptable or not.

[Boris Badenov]

If you replied to my point about smart - that would be one thing

Instead you trolled on the "fanboy"

Now you made 3 comments irrelevant to the topic

So all we know is that you think it's your job to flash your badge of indignation

Please stick to Facebook or Twitter or something else

Did I seem indignant haha? I was making a joke.

I'm entitled to my opinion, which is that "fanboy" is about the laziest, most inane label someone can use on a board like this. I'm not trolling at all. I suspect that those using the word "fanboy" more often warrant that description.

If you want to read the content of my posts about Smart they're back there earlier in the thread. I'd submit that they offer a bit more food for thought than a simplistic "reality vs. fanboys" drawing of the lines. You might think that's a point worthy of reply, but I don't.

[PhoSita]

The mods are the only ones who can hand out actual punishments.  Nothing stopping regular posters from trying to enforce posting norms, as long as it's done respectfully.

lefty12, I don't recognize you.  Not sure what you've brought to the table in the past. 

What I do know is Boris Badenov is one of the most reasonable and articulate posters around here, and he's been here a while.

This thread was about something else, now we're talking about reasonable posting behavior.  I trace that to lefty's poor reaction to a dry bit of wit that almost certainly wasn't intended as anything more than a mild joke to lighten the mood, which was growing antagonistic.


Drawing puerile, black-and-white distinctions between posters based on opinions on certain touchstone topics is old hat around here, and I can usually pick out who is worth listening to and who is likely to simply derail good conversations by noting who engages in that kind of behavior and who sidesteps it, or makes light of it without resorting to more name calling.

[TheTruth]

He said fanboys in general.

Boris was the one who is trying to act superior by knocking lefty's supposed lack of articulation.

If we are going to criticize lefty, let's not ignore those who think they are superior and feel they need to tell others.

[alldaboston]

He said fanboys in general.

Boris was the one who is trying to act superior by knocking lefty's supposed lack of articulation.

If we are going to criticize lefty, let's not ignore those who think they are superior and feel they need to tell others.

Is that including or not including you?

[PhoSita]

Let's get back on topic.

Good news is the Celtics aren't in a situation that they need him to be any type of saviour.

In his role if he can even approach average offensive numbers imagine how much of a boost that would be to a team on a major upswing already.

I think this is right. 

The Celts don't need Smart to become a ball-dominant star.  Given what he's able to do in every facet other than scoring, if he can just become an average offensive player as a combo guard, he can provide a major boost to the team.

The counter is that Smart is a long way off from average right now, especially if we are talking about the "average" for starter-level guards across the league.  I think it makes sense to talk in terms of the average production for starters, because it's reasonable to expect that the #6 pick in the draft will turn into a capable starter.

[Big333223]

Let's get back on topic.

Good news is the Celtics aren't in a situation that they need him to be any type of saviour.

In his role if he can even approach average offensive numbers imagine how much of a boost that would be to a team on a major upswing already.

I think this is right. 

The Celts don't need Smart to become a ball-dominant star.  Given what he's able to do in every facet other than scoring, if he can just become an average offensive player as a combo guard, he can provide a major boost to the team.

The counter is that Smart is a long way off from average right now, especially if we are talking about the "average" for starter-level guards across the league.  I think it makes sense to talk in terms of the average production for starters, because it's reasonable to expect that the #6 pick in the draft will turn into a capable starter.

This.

He's gotta lock himself in a gym this summer and figure out how to finish around the rim (or, with his strength, come up with a post game when he's guarded by PG's) but if he tops out as a 14-5-4 guy with 42-33-75 shooting splits and he plays All-NBA defense, then he was worth the #6 pick. I think that scenario is well within reach.

[Denis998]

I think his shot is broken. Cocks it back too far, and his shot seems rushed. Same with his free throws. Just notice how fast his shooting motion is when he shoots a free throw.

[Chris22]

At least tonight Marcus stopped throwing up threes.
Shot selection is the problem, I think.

[Dino Pitino]

http://bkref.com/tiny/BgYnJ

Most of the players on this list range from pretty good to All Star peak to Hall of Famer. If this is the historical company he keeps, then we should be bullish on his future.

And while I haven't done the clicking, I'm betting few of them had as marked an improvement in their FT% from year 1 to year 2, from .646 to .757, a jump of .111 points, a qualitative leap from bad to good. That proves he has the ability to improve his shot. Better shooting control shows up at the free throw line first, like weight loss shows first in the face.

He sank those two free throws like a boss. He wants to be a good shooter, and he has the mindset to be a clutch shooter. When this starts applying to his threes, too, and if he can start to make most of his layups, watch out.

[tomrod]

http://bkref.com/tiny/BgYnJ

Most of the players on this list range from pretty good to All Star peak to Hall of Famer. If this is the historical company he keeps, then we should be bullish on his future.

And while I haven't done the clicking, I'm betting few of them had as marked an improvement in their FT% from year 1 to year 2, from .646 to .757, a jump of .111 points, a qualitative leap from bad to good. That proves he has the ability to improve his shot. Better shooting control shows up at the free throw line first, like weight loss shows first in the face.

He sank those two free throws like a boss. He wants to be a good shooter, and he has the mindset to be a clutch shooter. When this starts applying to his threes, too, and if he can start to make most of his layups, watch out.

That list proves that Smart still has a great chance at being good. Guys like Joe Johnson and Westbrook shot not much better, and Elfrid Payton and Rubio shot worse. If he falls between those guys offensively then great, and he shot very similarly to Jason Kidd and thats fine.

[inverselock]

http://bkref.com/tiny/BgYnJ

Most of the players on this list range from pretty good to All Star peak to Hall of Famer. If this is the historical company he keeps, then we should be bullish on his future.

And while I haven't done the clicking, I'm betting few of them had as marked an improvement in their FT% from year 1 to year 2, from .646 to .757, a jump of .111 points, a qualitative leap from bad to good. That proves he has the ability to improve his shot. Better shooting control shows up at the free throw line first, like weight loss shows first in the face.

He sank those two free throws like a boss. He wants to be a good shooter, and he has the mindset to be a clutch shooter. When this starts applying to his threes, too, and if he can start to make most of his layups, watch out.

I think that list shows a very small chance of Smart being good offensively in the future.  None of them are similar to Smart.   Not many were good offensively.  Lots of average there.

[Dino Pitino]

http://bkref.com/tiny/BgYnJ

Most of the players on this list range from pretty good to All Star peak to Hall of Famer. If this is the historical company he keeps, then we should be bullish on his future.

And while I haven't done the clicking, I'm betting few of them had as marked an improvement in their FT% from year 1 to year 2, from .646 to .757, a jump of .111 points, a qualitative leap from bad to good. That proves he has the ability to improve his shot. Better shooting control shows up at the free throw line first, like weight loss shows first in the face.

He sank those two free throws like a boss. He wants to be a good shooter, and he has the mindset to be a clutch shooter. When this starts applying to his threes, too, and if he can start to make most of his layups, watch out.

I think that list shows a very small chance of Smart being good offensively in the future.  None of them are similar to Smart.   Not many were good offensively.  Lots of average there.

The point isn't to show a high chance of being good offensively but to show a not-so-bad chance of being good period, plus a not-unprecedented outside chance of also becoming a good shooter. I'd like to see how you classify all the players on that page, the first 40 to 60. Some had average careers but All Star peaks. I would consider that a positive comp.

[PAOBoston]

Let's get back on topic.

Good news is the Celtics aren't in a situation that they need him to be any type of saviour.

In his role if he can even approach average offensive numbers imagine how much of a boost that would be to a team on a major upswing already.

I think this is right. 

The Celts don't need Smart to become a ball-dominant star.  Given what he's able to do in every facet other than scoring, if he can just become an average offensive player as a combo guard, he can provide a major boost to the team.

The counter is that Smart is a long way off from average right now, especially if we are talking about the "average" for starter-level guards across the league.  I think it makes sense to talk in terms of the average production for starters, because it's reasonable to expect that the #6 pick in the draft will turn into a capable starter.

This.

He's gotta lock himself in a gym this summer and figure out how to finish around the rim (or, with his strength, come up with a post game when he's guarded by PG's) but if he tops out as a 14-5-4 guy with 42-33-75 shooting splits and he plays All-NBA defense, then he was worth the #6 pick. I think that scenario is well within reach.

I agree with this. The post thing is interesting. I'm not sure why they don't do it more often with him, at least earlier in games to get him on a positive note. I feel like he's a confidence player on offense. J Kidd and Deron had that PG post game as a bread and butter in their games.

[GreenFaith1819]

I've read posts from the last page of the thread, only.

But I'll drop this article off right here:

From ESPN's Chris Forsberg - "Brad Stevens on Marcus Smart - "He impacts Winning.""

http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/celtics/post/_/id/4722601/brad-stevens-on-marcus-smart-he-impacts-winning

When Boston Celtics guard Marcus Smart left his feet to chase a fourth-quarter offensive rebound there were four Phoenix Suns players surrounding him, including 7-foot-1 Alex Len crashing from behind, and Smart essentially got swallowed up in a sea of gray jerseys.

Somehow, it was Smart with the ball in front of him when the pack returned to the ground, but he didn't have control quite yet. So with about six arms swiping at the ball in front of him, Smart managed to gain control as the ball slipped behind his back. He wasn't out of the woods though, as three Suns players trapped him on the baseline. Smart somehow reversed his direction, tip-toed the baseline, and sneaked a bounce pass through two defenders to a wide open Jonas Jerebko beyond the 3-point arc.

As the Boston bench stood in unison, Jerebko got a defender to fly by with a pump fake then calmly drained the 3-pointer that pushed Boston's lead to nine with 6:34 to play. The Celtics held off the Suns for a 102-99 triumph at Talking Stick Resort Arena, and the sequence proved to be an important part of helping Boston escape with its fourth straight victory.

In a week in which pundits have stood atop their soap boxes and picked apart Smart's game amid his post-All-Star shooting slump, Smart's hustle sequence served as yet another reminder of why he's so important to this Celtics team.

Smart finished with nine points on 2-of-7 shooting with eight rebounds, four assists, a steal, and a block. He played 32 minutes, 37 seconds off the bench, the third highest total on the team behind only starters Isaiah Thomas and Evan Turner. Smart finished plus-seven in plus/minus, the second best number on the team behind Jerebko's plus-12.

In Smart's floor time, the Celtics owned an offensive rating of 109.3, or 5.1 points higher than the team's game average. For all the laments about his individual shooting woes, Boston's team production remains excellent during Smart's slump. His post-All-Star net rating of plus-4 points per 100 possessions is the third best mark on the team behind only injured Jae Crowder (plus-5.1) and Thomas (plus-4.1).

Celtics coach Brad Stevens singled out Smart's offensive rebound after Saturday's win.

"Those are the things that make Marcus special," Stevens told reporters in Phoenix. "Sometimes those go in a box score, sometimes they don't. But he does them every game. That's why I don't get too caught up in the box score stuff with him. He impacts winning and tonight was a good example of that."

Smart caused at least three Phoenix turnovers by drawing offensive fouls. And he played his typically feisty defense, doing many of the little things that won't show up in the box score.

Look, I hope and expect him to come out of his shooting slump. Some would argue that he's been in a slump since he was drafted.

But Marcus Smart is KG-Like, to me - in that much of the stuff he does WILL NOT show up in the box score.

As long as CBS supports him and RECOGNIZES this - I'm happy.

I love the guy.