Jae Crowder: Most Improved Player?

[DefenseWinsChamps]

This is Jae's age 25 season, so I think he's probably as good as he'll ever be.  But he's pretty good right now.

I understand that line of thinking, but I read a study one time that players hit their peak at 27 or even 28.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=67429.0

Butler didn't break out until last season, his age 25 season. Carroll didn't break out until his age 26 season. There are other examples.

It seems like CBS is constantly pushing players to add to their game by making them more "skilled."

I think he can add some little parts and continue to up his efficiency. Even this year he has improved throughout the year. He is playing the best basketball of his career in December. Why should we assume that is his peak? He continues to trend upwards. That trajectory will even out, but I'm not sure we have any evidence that he is starting to even out.

[DefenseWinsChamps]

I don't know enough about other teams to say, but Crowder has been great for us. I think he can be a long term solution at the starting 3, I kind of cringe when I see fan posts about how we can upgrade the 3. Also, I thin he was more than filler in the RR trade. Ainge said as much- I guess he would have said that about anyone but I take him at his word there.

For all the stat nuts out there what is our record in games Crowder scores over 15? I feel like that is a magic number for him. Or is there a number where when crowder gets it we win 80% of the time? It feels like when he is in a groove on O we win. Like AB before him, his challange right now is to become a consistant weapon on O. And he is almost there. I'm relly happy with his play and with Smart out for so long, he has become my favorite player.

When Crowder scores under 10 pts. the C's are 1-6.  When he scores 10-15 pts. the C's are 7-6.  When he scores 16+ pts. the C's are 7-1.

Dropping stats!!! TP

[saltlover]

This is Jae's age 25 season, so I think he's probably as good as he'll ever be.  But he's pretty good right now.

I understand that line of thinking, but I read a study one time that players hit their peak at 27 or even 28.

http://forums.celticsblog.com/index.php?topic=67429.0

Butler didn't break out until last season, his age 25 season. Carroll didn't break out until his age 26 season. There are other examples.

It seems like CBS is constantly pushing players to add to their game by making them more "skilled."

I think he can add some little parts and continue to up his efficiency. Even this year he has improved throughout the year. He is playing the best basketball of his career in December. Why should we assume that is his peak? He continues to trend upwards. That trajectory will even out, but I'm not sure we have any evidence that he is starting to even out.

There was an interesting study done almost 6 years ago now, looking at all NBA players who'd played at least 10 seasons and who played some threshold of minutes.  Some people didn't like the gestalt stat used -- I think that's just looking for a point to criticize, and one could use a different stat and come up with something similar. Anyway, that study showed NBA career peaking around age 25, which is where that came from, and what that discussion you linked to was referencing.  However, someone did a neat follow-up, which I can't find at the moment, that showed this peak season age  had increased over time.  As of that time, the peak season for players born in the late 70s had increased to the 27-28 age range.  (Being based on players with 10 years of experience after the season ended in 2009, it didn't talk about players born in the 80s, much less 90s as is the case of Crowder.) One is free to hypothesize on the reasons (that author was a fan of modern medicine, whereas I think the year-round conditioning modern NBA players put themselves through is important), but it was an interesting conclusion.

Of course, this peak age stuff is always fraught with the problem that different players are different, but it is likely that Crowder still has a season or two of improvement left, and maybe more.  Same is true of Bradley.

[esel1000]

Dominated again tonight. I hope he keeps up this level of play

[ImShakHeIsShaq]

bae god

[Denis998]

I just read an article on ESPN and they mentioned IT4 among the players that went from good to great among names like Drummond, Jackson, Ezeli, Lowery, and Zaza.
http://espn.go.com/nba/insider/story/_/id/14425723/andre-drummond-detroit-pistons-paul-george-indiana-pacers-highlight-list-early-season-surprises-nba

[crimson_stallion]

Gotta say he's been impressing me lately.  After a bit of a so-so start to the season (turnover central) he's settled down and started playing some mighty impressive ball.

Curious to see if he can keep this up.

[MJohnnyboy]

The Celtics might be like the Suns were back in 2014. No not with the same style of play obviously but the matter of the fact is just about everyone looks better than they did last year. Crowder, Bradley, Olynyk, Sullinger and Turner to some degree. All of them look like they are fundamentally better than they were last season. The only one that hasn't shown consistent improvement (atleast offensively) is Smart, and even he's had some stand-out performances this season.

When all these guys start clicking, this team could get even more dangerous. Now what to do with our expendable parts like Lee or Jerebko, that remains to be seen.

[crimson_stallion]

The Celtics might be like the Suns were back in 2014. No not with the same style of play obviously but the matter of the fact is just about everyone looks better than they did last year. Crowder, Bradley, Olynyk, Sullinger and Turner to some degree. All of them look like they are fundamentally better than they were last season. The only one that hasn't shown consistent improvement (atleast offensively) is Smart, and even he's had some stand-out performances this season.

When all these guys start clicking, this team could get even more dangerous. Now what to do with our expendable parts like Lee or Jerebko, that remains to be seen.

Based on recent history, I'm stating to see more and more that guys seem to be only starting to really take the first steps to breaking out once they get to that 25 or so age range.  There are obviously exceptions - guys who dominate from the get go - but I think it's more the exception that the rule. 

I would think that once Smart gets to around the age of 23 or 24, then we will start to really get a feel for who he is as a player, and how good he can be.

[slamtheking]

I'll go along with "he's improving" but I'm still not sold on him being the starting SF on our next championship team.  love the idea of him as our back up SF right now.

[crimson_stallion]

I'll go along with "he's improving" but I'm still not sold on him being the starting SF on our next championship team.  love the idea of him as our back up SF right now.

I kinda have felt this way as well, though right now he's averaging 15/6/2 Per 36 while shooting 37% from three and playing some "All-Defensive Team" caliber D. 

The key for me is the three point shooting, and the defense.

If he can keep up the playing the caliber of D he's been playing so far, and can continue hitting 2 threes a game at >35%, then that will considerably change how I evaluate both his value and his potential upside. 

After all, he is still only 25 years old.

[MJohnnyboy]

The Celtics might be like the Suns were back in 2014. No not with the same style of play obviously but the matter of the fact is just about everyone looks better than they did last year. Crowder, Bradley, Olynyk, Sullinger and Turner to some degree. All of them look like they are fundamentally better than they were last season. The only one that hasn't shown consistent improvement (atleast offensively) is Smart, and even he's had some stand-out performances this season.

When all these guys start clicking, this team could get even more dangerous. Now what to do with our expendable parts like Lee or Jerebko, that remains to be seen.

Based on recent history, I'm stating to see more and more that guys seem to be only starting to really take the first steps to breaking out once they get to that 25 or so age range.  There are obviously exceptions - guys who dominate from the get go - but I think it's more the exception that the rule. 

I would think that once Smart gets to around the age of 23 or 24, then we will start to really get a feel for who he is as a player, and how good he can be.

The shame of it is the lack of patience some fans have. Some of the more recent outcries have been stuff like "Smart's playing just about the same as last year! He clearly won't be anything more than Tony Allen 2.0!" Just like the general population thought Bradley was never going to be a knockdown 3-D kind of guy back just two years ago.

To those people, all I say is give it some time. The whole point with young players is that making your mark on the NBA usually takes a little while. Best of all, the Celtics aren't in win-now mode so they have the time and coach to let the young guys work out their kinks.

[spikelovetheCelts]

The Celtics might be like the Suns were back in 2014. No not with the same style of play obviously but the matter of the fact is just about everyone looks better than they did last year. Crowder, Bradley, Olynyk, Sullinger and Turner to some degree. All of them look like they are fundamentally better than they were last season. The only one that hasn't shown consistent improvement (atleast offensively) is Smart, and even he's had some stand-out performances this season.

When all these guys start clicking, this team could get even more dangerous. Now what to do with our expendable parts like Lee or Jerebko, that remains to be seen.

Based on recent history, I'm stating to see more and more that guys seem to be only starting to really take the first steps to breaking out once they get to that 25 or so age range.  There are obviously exceptions - guys who dominate from the get go - but I think it's more the exception that the rule. 

I would think that once Smart gets to around the age of 23 or 24, then we will start to really get a feel for who he is as a player, and how good he can be.

The shame of it is the lack of patience some fans have. Some of the more recent outcries have been stuff like "Smart's playing just about the same as last year! He clearly won't be anything more than Tony Allen 2.0!" Just like the general population thought Bradley was never going to be a knockdown 3-D kind of guy back just two years ago.

To those people, all I say is give it some time. The whole point with young players is that making your mark on the NBA usually takes a little while. Best of all, the Celtics aren't in win-now mode so they have the time and coach to let the young guys work out their kinks.

Crowder has shown the most growth this year. I thini all of our young players have been getting better. The future is very bright. I still think AB will make an All Star game and I can now see Crowder as well.

[Denis998]

The Celtics might be like the Suns were back in 2014. No not with the same style of play obviously but the matter of the fact is just about everyone looks better than they did last year. Crowder, Bradley, Olynyk, Sullinger and Turner to some degree. All of them look like they are fundamentally better than they were last season. The only one that hasn't shown consistent improvement (atleast offensively) is Smart, and even he's had some stand-out performances this season.

When all these guys start clicking, this team could get even more dangerous. Now what to do with our expendable parts like Lee or Jerebko, that remains to be seen.

Based on recent history, I'm stating to see more and more that guys seem to be only starting to really take the first steps to breaking out once they get to that 25 or so age range.  There are obviously exceptions - guys who dominate from the get go - but I think it's more the exception that the rule. 

I would think that once Smart gets to around the age of 23 or 24, then we will start to really get a feel for who he is as a player, and how good he can be.

The shame of it is the lack of patience some fans have. Some of the more recent outcries have been stuff like "Smart's playing just about the same as last year! He clearly won't be anything more than Tony Allen 2.0!" Just like the general population thought Bradley was never going to be a knockdown 3-D kind of guy back just two years ago.

To those people, all I say is give it some time. The whole point with young players is that making your mark on the NBA usually takes a little while. Best of all, the Celtics aren't in win-now mode so they have the time and coach to let the young guys work out their kinks.

Crowder has shown the most growth this year. I thini all of our young players have been getting better. The future is very bright. I still think AB will make an All Star game and I can now see Crowder as well.

considering the abundance of great players in both the west and east, I think Isaiah is the only one with a chance.

[Hemingway]

great point about AB. Honest question, i you currently think Crowder is as good now as he ever will be, did you also think resigning AB was a mistake? I bet you did.