Author Topic: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk  (Read 10683 times)

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Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #30 on: December 21, 2015, 06:06:34 PM »

Offline The Oracle

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“He’s a really good complimentary player,” Ainge said Thursday night shortly after the selection. “He’s not a go-to guy, he’s not a star player, but he’s a really good teammate-type player – he compliments other guys.”
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/06/27/celtics-trade-with-mavs-draft-gonzaga-center-kelly-olynyk-13th-overall/

I've been at peace with Kelly ever since I saw this in 2013. I trust Danny's judgement, and it's looking like he was 100% right in his evaluation.

LOL just goes to show it's our expectations that are the problem.
This evaluation no longer holds water.  The value of stretch bigs in today's NBA environment is off the charts and Danny knows it.  Couple that with K.O.'s defensive improvement (which no one thought was possible) and you have a very nice piece to the puzzle.

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #31 on: December 21, 2015, 07:10:51 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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I get the sense that a lot of the frustration with Olynyk is that people look at him as this seven foot guy with some skills that remind them of Dirk.  They expect him to use his size more.  They look at his per-36 numbers and imagine him doing that as a full time starter at power forward.

Accept that he's a role player who will give you wing production at the center spot, and you may find he doesn't bother you so much anymore.

Possibly because he is a seven foot guy?

:P


Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #32 on: December 21, 2015, 07:14:26 PM »

Offline Eja117

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There might not be a player on the Celtics right now who generates more frustration and angst than Kelly Olynyk.  Why won't he shoot?  Why can't he be more consistent?  What's his ceiling?  Why doesn't he play tougher?  What's with his hair?

I was thinking about this, and I realized a good way to come to peace with watching KO as a Celts fan.

Consider the following statlines:

9.0 points, 3.4 rebounds, 0.9 assists, 43.4 / 33.0 / 65.5, 26.7 minutes

8.7 points, 3.1 rebounds, 1.0 assists, 43.0 / 43.1 / 72.7, 17.7 minutes

8.8 points, 3.6 rebounds, 1.5 assists, 43.1 / 36.7 / 73.5, 18.7 minutes

8.8 points, 3.0 rebounds, 1.6 assists, 43.9 / 33.3 / 54.8, 21.7  minutes

8.2 points, 3.8 rebounds, 1.4 assists, 48.2 / 47.9 / 79.4, 26.9 minutes

8.9 points, 2.2 rebounds, 0.7 assists, 44.9 / 42.5 / 81.8, 21.8 minutes



Want to know who those players are?

In order:

Bojan Bogdanovic (6'8'', 216 lbs)

Mirza Teletovic (6'9'' 242 lbs)

Kelly Olynyk (7'0'', 238 lbs)

Chandler Parsons (6'10'' 230 lbs)

Jared Dudley (6'7'' 225 lbs)

Doug McDermott (6'8'' 225 lbs)


Notice anything?

Essentially, you need to look at Kelly like he's a 6'8''-6'10'' combo forward.  His effective size is closer to 6'9'' than his actual 7'0'', and he plays more like a small forward than a center.  His main value is that he can give you small forward type production at the center spot without killing you defensively.

Set your expectations accordingly, and perhaps you can be at peace with Olynyk.
A for effort, but this doesn't help me be at peace with him. He wasn't drafted to be a sf

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #33 on: December 21, 2015, 07:25:26 PM »

Offline crimson_stallion

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“He’s a really good complimentary player,” Ainge said Thursday night shortly after the selection. “He’s not a go-to guy, he’s not a star player, but he’s a really good teammate-type player – he compliments other guys.”
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/06/27/celtics-trade-with-mavs-draft-gonzaga-center-kelly-olynyk-13th-overall/

I've been at peace with Kelly ever since I saw this in 2013. I trust Danny's judgement, and it's looking like he was 100% right in his evaluation.

LOL just goes to show it's our expectations that are the problem.
This evaluation no longer holds water.  The value of stretch bigs in today's NBA environment is off the charts and Danny knows it.  Couple that with K.O.'s defensive improvement (which no one thought was possible) and you have a very nice piece to the puzzle.

The problem I see with this is that the NBA is all about "flavor of the month". 

The Heat probably started the whole "stretch four" ideal when they proved you can win a title without a proper center, and started playing Shane Battier and Chris Bosh in the front court, who mostly gave teams trouble by running out to the line and throwing up threes.  Important to not forget that this team also had Dwyane Wade and Lebron James.

The Golden State Warriors probably cemented this "small ball" concept when they dominated and won the title last year, with Draymond Green making that impact as a smaller PF who can defend the perimeter and also step out and hit threes.  Important to note that the Warriors also had Steph Curry, Klay Thompson and also had Iggy (a borderline all star not long ego) as their sixth man.

It's a natural reaction thing.  In the past, every team was all about size, and dominating the post.  So then 'big' guys were all the rage, and the teams who had great bigs (Boston with KG, Lakers with Gasol, Spurs with Duncan, etc) dominated.

Eventually you find that there just aren't enough great bigs out there to go around, so one team out there gets clever and says "we don't have the great big - we'll need to find another way".  If you can't beat them at their own game, then play a different game! 

So then a team comes along, decides to go small.  Suddenly this team starts to dominate, because every other team in the NBA has been built to dominate the inside with this huge, hulking big man who cannot move well, and so this new team (with it's small-ball style) runs rings around the opposition by creating mismatches with their speed and outside shooting.

Now every other team sees this, so every other team that doesn't have a great big starts going small too.  Before you know it every team in the NBA starts going away from traditional bigs, and moving towards smaller and more mobile big men who can step out and hit the three.

Eventually you'll find all big men will start working on their perimeter game and athleticism so that they can fit in to today's NBA, and you're going to have a league flooded with stretch fours / fives who's greatest skills are outside shooting, passing and mobility (defending multiple positions).  The position will get smaller.  Traditional 7 foot bigs who rebound, protect the paint and score in the post will fade away, and become a rarity.

One day all of the best stretch fours will be on teams, and some team will come along and say "we can't beat them at their one game, we need to do something different". This team will go out and sign the biggest, strongest, angriest and most post-dominant big man they can find.  Then they will go out and steamroll every team out there, because nobody is going to have a big man big enough or strong enough to defend said beastly man, and so this team will dominate everybody. 

Now all the guys who can't get a great stretch big will say "[dang], I'm going to try this post up big man thing too" and they will find great success as well.

Before you know it the whole NBA will go back to huge 7 foot monsters again, and the traditional (as it will be at the time) stretch four will become useless, because they will be incapable of defending any of the dominate post up bigs around the league.

And then it will go full circle again.

:)

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #34 on: December 21, 2015, 08:17:36 PM »

Offline PhoSita

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A for effort, but this doesn't help me be at peace with him. He wasn't drafted to be a sf

Well that's the thing, I think he actually kinda was drafted to give the team SF production, just at PF / C.  That was his statistical profile in college, so it's not a surprise he's skewed that way in the NBA, as well.
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Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #35 on: December 21, 2015, 08:27:49 PM »

Offline Eja117

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A for effort, but this doesn't help me be at peace with him. He wasn't drafted to be a sf

Well that's the thing, I think he actually kinda was drafted to give the team SF production, just at PF / C.  That was his statistical profile in college, so it's not a surprise he's skewed that way in the NBA, as well.
Almost all those players are much smaller than him. If he's going to get 3 rebs a game, who gets them? Crowder?  Even Jeff Green should have been getting more than that, and he wasn't, which is why he had to go.
It did seem a little like in what was supposedly a weak draft he was brought in to just be good, but I don't think he was brought in to be Jared Dudley. Not as a ceiling anyway.

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #36 on: December 21, 2015, 08:49:48 PM »

Offline clover

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“He’s a really good complimentary player,” Ainge said Thursday night shortly after the selection. “He’s not a go-to guy, he’s not a star player, but he’s a really good teammate-type player – he compliments other guys.”
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/06/27/celtics-trade-with-mavs-draft-gonzaga-center-kelly-olynyk-13th-overall/

I've been at peace with Kelly ever since I saw this in 2013. I trust Danny's judgement, and it's looking like he was 100% right in his evaluation.

No, it shows how stupid Danny can be being too blunt sometimes. He essentially trashed KO as a draft pick--and now his organization has spent the last 2 1/2 years trying to convince Kelly to play like more of a star player.

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #37 on: December 21, 2015, 08:53:25 PM »

Offline tarheelsxxiii

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“He’s a really good complimentary player,” Ainge said Thursday night shortly after the selection. “He’s not a go-to guy, he’s not a star player, but he’s a really good teammate-type player – he compliments other guys.”
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/06/27/celtics-trade-with-mavs-draft-gonzaga-center-kelly-olynyk-13th-overall/

I've been at peace with Kelly ever since I saw this in 2013. I trust Danny's judgement, and it's looking like he was 100% right in his evaluation.

No, it shows how stupid Danny can be being too blunt sometimes. He essentially trashed KO as a draft pick--and now his organization has spent the last 2 1/2 years trying to convince Kelly to play like more of a star player.

TP, hadn't read that before. There's no reasonable explanation for saying that... more of a reflection on him/his frustration than the player imo.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2015, 09:02:56 PM by tarheelsxxiii »
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Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #38 on: December 21, 2015, 08:54:22 PM »

Offline pearljammer10

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Are people expecting KO to be more than a role player? If so, that's where you lost me.

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #39 on: December 21, 2015, 08:59:05 PM »

Offline Eja117

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Are people expecting KO to be more than a role player? If so, that's where you lost me.
I'm fine with him being a role player if he's a good role player. 

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #40 on: December 21, 2015, 09:04:10 PM »

Offline inverselock

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“He’s a really good complimentary player,” Ainge said Thursday night shortly after the selection. “He’s not a go-to guy, he’s not a star player, but he’s a really good teammate-type player – he compliments other guys.”
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/06/27/celtics-trade-with-mavs-draft-gonzaga-center-kelly-olynyk-13th-overall/

I've been at peace with Kelly ever since I saw this in 2013. I trust Danny's judgement, and it's looking like he was 100% right in his evaluation.

No, it shows how stupid Danny can be being too blunt sometimes. He essentially trashed KO as a draft pick--and now his organization has spent the last 2 1/2 years trying to convince Kelly to play like more of a star player.

Stars tend to have driven personalities that respond when challenged.

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #41 on: December 21, 2015, 09:09:20 PM »

Offline nopassbass

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Kelly is fine who he is. I am glad he is a Celtic.

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #42 on: December 21, 2015, 09:21:01 PM »

Offline rocknrollforyoursoul

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Other than wishing he'd be a bit more aggressive at times, KO's been about what I expected—a guy who can and does contribute in several ways.

And as a fellow long-haired white guy, I'll always throw my support to KO. ;D
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Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #43 on: December 21, 2015, 09:29:16 PM »

Offline clover

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“He’s a really good complimentary player,” Ainge said Thursday night shortly after the selection. “He’s not a go-to guy, he’s not a star player, but he’s a really good teammate-type player – he compliments other guys.”
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/06/27/celtics-trade-with-mavs-draft-gonzaga-center-kelly-olynyk-13th-overall/

I've been at peace with Kelly ever since I saw this in 2013. I trust Danny's judgement, and it's looking like he was 100% right in his evaluation.

No, it shows how stupid Danny can be being too blunt sometimes. He essentially trashed KO as a draft pick--and now his organization has spent the last 2 1/2 years trying to convince Kelly to play like more of a star player.

Stars tend to have driven personalities that respond when challenged.

They need KO to shoot like a star. Look at how KO has improved his body and D in 2+ years and I think it's pretty clear he's driven to be good. But he still has some wrong ideas IMO on how he best helps the team.

Re: How to Find Peace Watching Kelly Olynyk
« Reply #44 on: December 21, 2015, 09:57:57 PM »

Offline inverselock

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“He’s a really good complimentary player,” Ainge said Thursday night shortly after the selection. “He’s not a go-to guy, he’s not a star player, but he’s a really good teammate-type player – he compliments other guys.”
http://boston.cbslocal.com/2013/06/27/celtics-trade-with-mavs-draft-gonzaga-center-kelly-olynyk-13th-overall/

I've been at peace with Kelly ever since I saw this in 2013. I trust Danny's judgement, and it's looking like he was 100% right in his evaluation.

No, it shows how stupid Danny can be being too blunt sometimes. He essentially trashed KO as a draft pick--and now his organization has spent the last 2 1/2 years trying to convince Kelly to play like more of a star player.

Stars tend to have driven personalities that respond when challenged.

They need KO to shoot like a star. Look at how KO has improved his body and D in 2+ years and I think it's pretty clear he's driven to be good. But he still has some wrong ideas IMO on how he best helps the team.

He was a PG before the growth spurt IIRC.   The pass first PG mentality is still there.   24, so there's time.  Hopefully can improve. 

Needs some swag.  Could do with a coupe of celebrity girlfriends and a gold Lambo.