2 Trade Ideas: Bos-Min & Bos-Was-Utah

[CsBanner18]

Trade # 1

To Bos: Gorgui Dieng & Shabazz Muhammad
To Min: Kelly Olynyk & James Young + 1 or 2 NON-Philly 2nd round picks

Muhammad would play the 3 behind Crowder. Dieng would give us more rim protection, low post defense, and rebounding at C.

Depth Chart after trade:

IT4/Smart/Rozier
Bradley/Turner/Hunter
Crowder/Muhammad/Jerebko
Sully/Lee/Mickey
Amir/Dieng/Zeller

This trade would make it easier to consider trading Turner, Jerebko, Lee & Zeller (all expiring).

Ultimately, I would like to see Lee, Jerebko, & Zeller traded to create more minutes for Crowder at the 4, while giving Turner & Muhammad 20+ minutes as well. We might even be able to get Mickey some playing time if we consolidate the roster enough.


Which brings me to...

Trade # 2

To Bos: Nene, Blair, Johnson, future 2nd round pick (via WAS)
To Utah: Jerebko, 2nd round pick (HEAVILY PROTECTED--unlikely to convey)
To Was: Lee, Zeller

-Washington would get more production out of Lee and Zeller than Nene.

-Utah would get an upgrade at SF/PF in Jerebko. They could guarantee Jerebko's 2nd year and let Booker walk in FA if they don't want to re-sign him.

** The 2nd round pick isn't likely to convey. I just included it in the trade so it seems like we're compensating Utah for taking on $4M more insalary

-Boston gets a 2nd round pick. We replace Lee's expiring w/ Nene's, and get back Dejaun Blair & Chris Johnson who's contracts are both non-guaranteed next season. Blair's $2M contract could be a sneakily good asset to acquire-- if Ainge trades him with a pick for a recently drafted player on a rookie scale contract.

It is also possible both players could be waived so we'd have 13 guys on our roster. That would keep Mickey & Rozier out of the D-league on every night the Celtics play. 

Depth Chart after 2nd trade:

IT4/Smart/Rozier
Bradley/Turner/Hunter
Crowder/Muhammad/Johnson
Sully/Amir/Mickey
Dieng/Nene/Blair

Give Sully, Amir, & Dieng the bulk of minutes at PF/C.
Since Nene is currently averaging 17.4 minutes, we'll give him that many minutes or less. Thus creating some minutes at PF for Crowder, which will give Muhammad & Turner a few more minutes each at SF. Keep in mind Turner will also get minutes at PG/SG.

[Smitty77]

I really do NOT like Trade 2.  Trade 1 is pretty interesting!!

Nice thought on the first one!!

Well done!!

Smitty77

[slamtheking]

Trade 1 -- not enough for Minny.  Dieng > KO & Shabazz >>> Young.  doesn't matter how many seconds you add to that, I can't see Minny taking it.

Trade 2: pointless trade and we're giving up the best asset in Zeller.  Everyone can come off the books next year so not seeing the point.  getting a $2 mill contract isn't nearly enough of an incentive to make this deal and get appreciably worse in the frontcourt.  Like it or not, Lee and Zeller can actually play.  Nene and Blair are pretty much done.  Chris Johnson is an end of bench player still -- certainly inferior to Jerebko.

[pearljammer10]

Like others have said trade 2 is pointless. Lee is better than Nene at this point and can give us more when the time comes. Blair and Johnson would both be insignificant.

I'd love Dieng and would take Muhhamed but that deal doesn't come close to getting it done...You'd need at least a first rounder if not two going to Minn.

[Csfan1984]

So you want to use assets to improve the bench? The team needs starter upgrades not bench upgrades.

[CsBanner18]

Trade 1 -- not enough for Minny.  Dieng > KO & Shabazz >>> Young.  doesn't matter how many seconds you add to that, I can't see Minny taking it.

Trade 2: pointless trade and we're giving up the best asset in Zeller.  Everyone can come off the books next year so not seeing the point.  getting a $2 mill contract isn't nearly enough of an incentive to make this deal and get appreciably worse in the frontcourt.  Like it or not, Lee and Zeller can actually play.  Nene and Blair are pretty much done.  Chris Johnson is an end of bench player still -- certainly inferior to Jerebko.

Right after posting the trade, I realized Boston should be getting an incentive to make trade 2. So I added in a future 2nd round pick coming to us from WAS. I also added in a heavily protected (likely not to convey) 2nd round pick going to Utah to compensate them for taking on Jerebko's extra $4M this year.

As far as trade #1 goes...here's how I see things: Olynyk brings more offense and floor spacing to Minny. Pekovic will be back soon and they'll need to create minutes for him at C. Pekovic may or may not (probably not)  be in Minny's long term plans, so it'd be wise to immediately showcase that he's healthy and ready to contribute. Besides Olynyk & Pekovic, Minny also has Towns, KG, Bjelica, & Payne to play minutes at the 4 or 5.

Nonetheless, Muhammad is an upgrade over Young. Therefore, I'm sure Ainge would be willing to up the ante to make the deal happen.

How about we give Minny back their 1st round pick (likely to become 2 seconds). Also, we can add in a NON PHILLY 2nd round pick or two. So essentially three or four 2nd round picks--plus Olynyk and Young for Dieng & Muhammad.

That's 3 or 4 more opportunities to draft players who can make an impact for the future and potential become a steal (like getting Mickey at #33 will do for us). Not to mention there have been plenty of productive players found later in the 2nd round as well.

[CsBanner18]

Like others have said trade 2 is pointless. Lee is better than Nene at this point and can give us more when the time comes. Blair and Johnson would both be insignificant.

I'd love Dieng and would take Muhhamed but that deal doesn't come close to getting it done...You'd need at least a first rounder if not two going to Minn.

Here's why I think trade 1 isn't pointless:

-As a result of trade #1, more minutes at the 4 will be available for Lee. Instead of giving Lee 25 minutes max- we're flipping him for a player who's injury prone who we can give less minutes to.

Sully- 28-30 mins
Dieng- 28-30 mins
Amir- 25-28 mins
Nene- 10-20 minutes give or take depending on the matchup and his health. Nene will defend the basket better than Lee.

Crowder or anyone else can take Nenes minutes on any given night if Brad decides to go small.

Lee expects to play a decent amount of minutes and he'd get that on the Wizards too.

- Zeller isn't getting any playing time here, so he'd be a good fit for the Wizards as Gortat's backup C.

To sum things up: We get a 2nd round pick as incentive & more minutes for Crowder at PF. The only reason I could see us not doing the trade is if we've become too attached to Lee and Danny Ainge figures he's already got enough 2nd round picks

[CsBanner18]

So you want to use assets to improve the bench? The team needs starter upgrades not bench upgrades.

You're thinking short term. Think big picture. These trades can be made Dec. 15th. Nene could always be flipped to add a starter if this trade is made before the deadline. For example we could do Nene and picks for Gallinari, Harris, or Middleton at the deadline.

If Ainge wants to hold off on trading Lee to include him in a blockbuster deal at the deadline then that would be smart considering once you trade a player you can't re-trade him along with other players

[The Oracle]

  So you want to trade away all of the Celtics floor spacing for a bunch of junk and guys that are terrible defensively and can't shoot?  Dieng is awful in every way,  Nene serves no purpose and Muhammed no thanks.  After these trades would be completed Sully would be forced back to playing PF where he is much much less effective and the spacing would be unbelievably bad.  The C's struggle to score as is and if you put Dieng and Nene on the floor there would be next to no access to the hoop. An already poor jump shooting team would get way worse at doing so and forced at the same time to shoot many more jump shots.  How would I.T. ever be able to penetrate when Dieng and Nene's defenders would be standing there waiting for him at every turn?  This is a really bad trade idea!

[CsBanner18]

  So you want to trade away all of the Celtics floor spacing for a bunch of junk and guys that are terrible defensively and can't shoot?  Dieng is awful in every way,  Nene serves no purpose and Muhammed no thanks.  After these trades would be completed Sully would be forced back to playing PF where he is much much less effective and the spacing would be unbelievably bad.  The C's struggle to score as is and if you put Dieng and Nene on the floor there would be next to no access to the hoop. An already poor jump shooting team would get way worse at doing so and forced at the same time to shoot many more jump shots.  How would I.T. ever be able to penetrate when Dieng and Nene's defenders would be standing there waiting for him at every turn?  This is a really bad trade idea!

Dieng and Muhammad are not junk. Crowder, Sully, Amir, & Mickey are bigs who can space the floor. Nene would play the least amount of minutes in the front court, which opens up more minutes for small ball with Crowder at PF...

Dieng would likely start at center. He can run the floor and get easy points because our team plays unselfish and moves the ball well. He's a good rebounder as well. Nene would get limited minutes behind Sully, Dieng, & Amir. And I'm sure Brad Stevens would NEVER insert Nene & Dieng into the same line up.

Stop making it seem like losing Olymyk and Jerebko will make our team hopeless and incapable of playing well. That is far from the truth. Olynyk is only averaging 18 mins this season. And Jerebko is barely playing at all.  God forbid we had to replace Olynyks 18 minutes of floor spacing/production...it would just ruin our team!

Btw Muhammad, Dieng, & Nene would be considered DEFENSIVE upgrades over Young, Olynyk, Lee, & Zeller. No more seeing Zeller get abused my dominant Centers.

Sully is naturally at PF, so playing at PF twould NOT make him less effective. He shoots 3s and can knock them down which creates space when he plays with Dieng...

[CFAN38]

Trade # 1

To Bos: Gorgui Dieng & Shabazz Muhammad
To Min: Kelly Olynyk & James Young + 1 or 2 NON-Philly 2nd round picks

Muhammad would play the 3 behind Crowder. Dieng would give us more rim protection, low post defense, and rebounding at C.

Depth Chart after trade:

IT4/Smart/Rozier
Bradley/Turner/Hunter
Crowder/Muhammad/Jerebko
Sully/Lee/Mickey
Amir/Dieng/Zeller

This trade would make it easier to consider trading Turner, Jerebko, Lee & Zeller (all expiring).

Ultimately, I would like to see Lee, Jerebko, & Zeller traded to create more minutes for Crowder at the 4, while giving Turner & Muhammad 20+ minutes as well. We might even be able to get Mickey some playing time if we consolidate the roster enough.


Which brings me to...

Trade # 2

To Bos: Nene, Blair, Johnson, future 2nd round pick (via WAS)
To Utah: Jerebko, 2nd round pick (HEAVILY PROTECTED--unlikely to convey)
To Was: Lee, Zeller

-Washington would get more production out of Lee and Zeller than Nene.

-Utah would get an upgrade at SF/PF in Jerebko. They could guarantee Jerebko's 2nd year and let Booker walk in FA if they don't want to re-sign him.

** The 2nd round pick isn't likely to convey. I just included it in the trade so it seems like we're compensating Utah for taking on $4M more insalary

-Boston gets a 2nd round pick. We replace Lee's expiring w/ Nene's, and get back Dejaun Blair & Chris Johnson who's contracts are both non-guaranteed next season. Blair's $2M contract could be a sneakily good asset to acquire-- if Ainge trades him with a pick for a recently drafted player on a rookie scale contract.

It is also possible both players could be waived so we'd have 13 guys on our roster. That would keep Mickey & Rozier out of the D-league on every night the Celtics play. 

Depth Chart after 2nd trade:

IT4/Smart/Rozier
Bradley/Turner/Hunter
Crowder/Muhammad/Johnson
Sully/Amir/Mickey
Dieng/Nene/Blair

Give Sully, Amir, & Dieng the bulk of minutes at PF/C.
Since Nene is currently averaging 17.4 minutes, we'll give him that many minutes or less. Thus creating some minutes at PF for Crowder, which will give Muhammad & Turner a few more minutes each at SF. Keep in mind Turner will also get minutes at PG/SG.

Trade 1 I like the idea of getting Dieng and Muhammad but I doubt DA moves KO in a trade that nets two bench players. KO is a great system fit and his absence would likely cause more harm then good.

Trade 2 I see very little value in simply shaking up a roster that seems to have good chemistry.

[slamtheking]

Trade 1 -- not enough for Minny.  Dieng > KO & Shabazz >>> Young.  doesn't matter how many seconds you add to that, I can't see Minny taking it.

Trade 2: pointless trade and we're giving up the best asset in Zeller.  Everyone can come off the books next year so not seeing the point.  getting a $2 mill contract isn't nearly enough of an incentive to make this deal and get appreciably worse in the frontcourt.  Like it or not, Lee and Zeller can actually play.  Nene and Blair are pretty much done.  Chris Johnson is an end of bench player still -- certainly inferior to Jerebko.

Right after posting the trade, I realized Boston should be getting an incentive to make trade 2. So I added in a future 2nd round pick coming to us from WAS. I also added in a heavily protected (likely not to convey) 2nd round pick going to Utah to compensate them for taking on Jerebko's extra $4M this year.

As far as trade #1 goes...here's how I see things: Olynyk brings more offense and floor spacing to Minny. Pekovic will be back soon and they'll need to create minutes for him at C. Pekovic may or may not (probably not)  be in Minny's long term plans, so it'd be wise to immediately showcase that he's healthy and ready to contribute. Besides Olynyk & Pekovic, Minny also has Towns, KG, Bjelica, & Payne to play minutes at the 4 or 5.

Nonetheless, Muhammad is an upgrade over Young. Therefore, I'm sure Ainge would be willing to up the ante to make the deal happen.

How about we give Minny back their 1st round pick (likely to become 2 seconds). Also, we can add in a NON PHILLY 2nd round pick or two. So essentially three or four 2nd round picks--plus Olynyk and Young for Dieng & Muhammad.

That's 3 or 4 more opportunities to draft players who can make an impact for the future and potential become a steal (like getting Mickey at #33 will do for us). Not to mention there have been plenty of productive players found later in the 2nd round as well.

I know you think you're selling these deals but it's not working.  no way, no how would anybody go for that second trade.   The first trade, as others have mentioned, gets a couple of bench guys in exchange for a couple of our bench guys.  While I do like Dieng and wanted him over KO in the draft, if we're going to make trades, we should be making trades that make us appreciably better, not worse or lateral moves.

Trade 1 -- lateral move
Trade 2 -- makes us worse

[The Oracle]

  So you want to trade away all of the Celtics floor spacing for a bunch of junk and guys that are terrible defensively and can't shoot?  Dieng is awful in every way,  Nene serves no purpose and Muhammed no thanks.  After these trades would be completed Sully would be forced back to playing PF where he is much much less effective and the spacing would be unbelievably bad.  The C's struggle to score as is and if you put Dieng and Nene on the floor there would be next to no access to the hoop. An already poor jump shooting team would get way worse at doing so and forced at the same time to shoot many more jump shots.  How would I.T. ever be able to penetrate when Dieng and Nene's defenders would be standing there waiting for him at every turn?  This is a really bad trade idea!

Dieng and Muhammad are not junk. Crowder, Sully, Amir, & Mickey are bigs who can space the floor. Nene would play the least amount of minutes in the front court, which opens up more minutes for small ball with Crowder at PF...

Dieng would likely start at center. He can run the floor and get easy points because our team plays unselfish and moves the ball well. He's a good rebounder as well. Nene would get limited minutes behind Sully, Dieng, & Amir. And I'm sure Brad Stevens would NEVER insert Nene & Dieng into the same line up.

Stop making it seem like losing Olymyk and Jerebko will make our team hopeless and incapable of playing well. That is far from the truth. Olynyk is only averaging 18 mins this season. And Jerebko is barely playing at all.  God forbid we had to replace Olynyks 18 minutes of floor spacing/production...it would just ruin our team!

Btw Muhammad, Dieng, & Nene would be considered DEFENSIVE upgrades over Young, Olynyk, Lee, & Zeller. No more seeing Zeller get abused my dominant Centers.

Sully is naturally at PF, so playing at PF twould NOT make him less effective. He shoots 3s and can knock them down which creates space when he plays with Dieng...

  So you want the starting front court to be Dieng and Sully.  Contrary to popular belief Dieng is a terrible defensive center.  He is slow and his rotations are very bad.  He is 1 of the worst rim protectors in the league.  Sully when moved to the PF position would be a disaster defensively as it was last year.  So you have made this team much worse defensively then the current version we have.  As for the offense Dieng sucks and is nothing but a lane clogger in the half court.  Sully would be forced to the perimeter much more and people would be screaming for his head as they were last year.  Sullinger's rebounding #'s would suffer greatly because he would be away from the hoop more on both ends of the floor.  That starting unit would probably have a scoring differential equal to one of the worst teams in the league and would be a jump shooting nightmare to watch.

[Csfan1984]

So you want to use assets to improve the bench? The team needs starter upgrades not bench upgrades.

You're thinking short term. Think big picture. These trades can be made Dec. 15th. Nene could always be flipped to add a starter if this trade is made before the deadline. For example we could do Nene and picks for Gallinari, Harris, or Middleton at the deadline.

If Ainge wants to hold off on trading Lee to include him in a blockbuster deal at the deadline then that would be smart considering once you trade a player you can't re-trade him along with other players

You believe Nene would help get you those players?

[CsBanner18]

So you want to use assets to improve the bench? The team needs starter upgrades not bench upgrades.

You're thinking short term. Think big picture. These trades can be made Dec. 15th. Nene could always be flipped to add a starter if this trade is made before the deadline. For example we could do Nene and picks for Gallinari, Harris, or Middleton at the deadline.

If Ainge wants to hold off on trading Lee to include him in a blockbuster deal at the deadline then that would be smart considering once you trade a player you can't re-trade him along with other players

You believe Nene would help get you those players?

Nene AND picks...