C's Never Talked Sully Extension, Agent Wants Max

[saltlover]

People are reading his agent's comments wrong.  All Falk is saying that he tells his players to see what free agency offers instead of taking a rookie extension, unless that extension is the max (since then he can't do better in free agency).  And he's saying that since that's been his position for 20 years, Ainge knew not to make an offer.  He is NOT saying that he expects a max contract for Sully next season -- he wasn't saying anything about what he expects next summer at all.  But in general, getting offers from multiple teams will result in a higher salary for his client, so there's no reason to negotiate with one party, unless that offer is the max.

I'm not sure anyone expects Sully to get a max deal, unless he plays at the level he's currently playing for the next 74 games.  (And even that might not get him one.)

[BudweiserCeltic]

I don't see Sully getting the max.  And I imagine if the offer was 90% of the Max, it would have been taken.  But Ainge has been focused on keeping cap space clear for next summer, so it would have surprised me if any sort of agreeable number could have been found.  Sully's cap hold next summer will be about $5.5 million if memory serves me correctly -- any extension higher than that would cut into cap room, so Ainge would have had to think he was getting a steal to agree to one now. Next summer if the parties agree, they can wait til cap room has been used and then sign a new deal that goes over the cap, as happened with Crowder this summer.  Ainge and Falk have negotiated multiple contracts before -- I think they both know how each other think at this point.

Also something to point out is that it's one thing for the Agent to say that he wants a MAX for Sully and another to state that he's never agreed to a deal on a rookie extension that wasn't worth the MAX.

From the agents point of view, when discussing a rookie extension it's MAX or nothing, which is whole different discussion of what will be discussed when free-agency hits which is a different set of rules of course.

He may very well want a MAX for Sully, it's all guess work at this point, but I think it's important to recognize the two different circumstances... a MAX on a rookie extension and negotiation in free-agency (restricted or not).

[Tr1boy]

bye Sully. Celts are not giving him max

He has to either fire his agent or have his agent accept less than max (a first time)

Who does Falk think he is? lol

[Rosco917]

Max deal for Sully is crazy. Don't overpay for Sully, he's a decent backup center, that has back issues, and weight issues. It's too much work just keeping him anywhere near playing condition. One off season slip and he's 320 again.

Team friendly contract is ok.

Sullinger isn't a Center.

Because of his bulk, he covers the opposing teams center on D. He really can't cover many of the quicker PF in the league.

[Evantime34]

His agent said that he only will discuss an extension for a rookie if it's a max deal. He did not say that Sullinger was worth the max. I think Sullinger realistically is worth 12-14 MM a year.

However I would be worried that if we paid Sullinger that much for a coupe years he would put on weight then get hurt again.

[Celtics4ever]

An agent's job is to get the most for his client, that is how they get paid.  As for us never offering an extension this is well known, he had a bad camp, too.   Him having a good year, has to be taken with a grain of salt because of the contract year, and it is early.   Still having him maintain it, will improve his development or give him more value to us in a trade.   It is a win win.  The real question is can he maintain it and will he backslide, I hope not.

I think he is trying more this year, than in the past.  He has always had gifts but he has always had limitations which are sometimes glaring. 

I do not know think he is worth the max.   This one has him at C, he was 10th iN PER,   13th in rebounding, 18th in TS%, 17th in usage.  It has him under C and I could not find him PF.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/hollinger/statistics/_/position/c/sort/trueShootingPct

He is 15th in scoring at C, does not make the top forty in the NBA when one considers all positions.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/scoring-per-game/sort/avgPoints/year/2016/seasontype/2

11th in FG for C, 21 in NBA overall, which is a big improvement from past years.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/player/_/stat/field-goals/sort/fieldGoalPct/position/centers

Considering all these facts, I think giving him the  max is pretty debatable,  and I think, it is not merited.   But  if he plays like he is playing he deserves a fair wage, I think.  But is he a max player?   He is not top ten in any stat in the NBA, just PER for his position, so I say no. 

I would not do the extension if I was him either.

I think Sullinger realistically is worth 12-14 MM a year.

I think this is fair, but Ainge wants him to prove it this year and maintain it.   How many years has he started well and faltered?   

[LarBrd33]

A lot of people were writing off Sully before the season, but I kept pointing out that he actually looked really good right before his injury... and played fairly well in limited minutes during the playoffs.   Nothing about his early season success surprises me.   

Still, I wouldn't put money on him being here long term.   My spidey senses have been going off for a couple seasons.  My guess is there are more problems in-house than we are aware of.  You see signs of it with his inability to get in shape, him showing up late to practices, etc.   He seems like the kind of guy Ainge would sell high on.  But I think you'd get the most value out of him if you force-fed him 30+ minutes a night for a while to up his stats.   

[Snakehead]

Many are overreacting to the max part.  He just wants the market to set Sully's value and sure he'd love that to be max money if he can get it.  I think it's the right move as an agent.

So far Sully has probably been our second best player overall and actually is playing defense, which was my big issue with him last year.  But I still have worries that's because it is a contract year.  I do like Sully when he is giving defensive effort but I still am wary.

[thirstyboots18]

If Sully keeps improving and stays in shape, I can definitely see him getting a good contract.  It is his agent's job to ask for max, maybe settle for less, but he has to work for his client's (not the Celtic's) best interest.  That said, Sully has to increase his own worth in play, attitude, and conditioning.  Contracts should be in the best interest of Both parties.  (There have been times in the past when I thought Danny overpaid players...)

[crimson_stallion]

A lot of people were writing off Sully before the season, but I kept pointing out that he actually looked really good right before his injury... and played fairly well in limited minutes during the playoffs.   Nothing about his early season success surprises me.   

I think a big key factor here for Sully (which most seem to not recognise) is that he is playing the lowest minutes since his rookie year - I have no doubt that this probably has a huge impact on his stats improving, and it wouldn't surprise me if that's a strategic move by Ainge / Stevens.

If you look at his Per-36 numbers very little has actually changed.  His scoring, assists, fouls and turnovers per 36 are all dead on where they have been the past three years.

As far as shot attempts the breakdown is still similar - he's still taking almost as many field goal attempts from beyond the three point line (24.7%) as he is from inside 3 feet 27.3%).  He's still taking about 25% of his shots from long two range (from 10" to 3PT) and his free throw rate has dropped (now 3.9%) as it has every season in the league so far. 

The current free throw rate is horribly bad, and certainly must be one of the worst in the league for a starting big man - he has attempted only 3 free throws in 8 games played.

So his game hasn't really changed, the only differences from last year really are that his rebounding numbers, FG% and 3P% have increased in a really big way.

Honestly, I don't think the current rate in either category is sustainable and I think his FG% will eventually drop to around 45%-47%, his 3PT will eventually drop to about 34%-36%, and his rebounding Per-36 will eventually drop to around 11.

If his minuted played jumped back up to 27-28 MPG (where it's been the past two seasons) then I suspect conditioning will become a factor and those categories will drop back down (in a big way) to around what we saw last season.

Either way i'm not complaining - if playing him less minutes makes his stats improve to such a degree, it just increases his perceived value if a nice trade opportunity does come along.

For now though I like what he's doing out there.  I wouldn't be against signing him to a long term contract, but I think his minutes need to be restricted to no more than 25 a game in order for him to keep up the type of effectiveness he's had this year - and it's hard to offer big bucks to a guy who you can't play more than 6th man minutes.

[ahonui06]

Sully's just trusting himself. Risky but shows confidence.

[Kuberski33]

Falk has a good relationship with the Celtics.  He negotiated what turned out to be a player-friendly 4 year deal for Jeff Green, which at the time was considered a pretty good deal for all involved.  He's trying to do best by his client, which is what all good agents would do and Falk's reputation is pretty decent. I'm sure he will give Ainge every opportunity to bring Sully back.  That said there are so many stupid owners on this league, someone's bound to overpay for him.

Time will tell but it wouldn't surprise me if he's elsewhere next season.