Did the Celtics renounce their way to cap space?

[Robb]

Yes, they renounced everyone, going back years. Nenad Krstic, Shaq, Starbury...  Lots of guys came off the cap.

They renounced everyone?

[BudweiserCeltic]

Yes, they renounced everyone, going back years. Nenad Krstic, Shaq, Starbury...  Lots of guys came off the cap.

They renounced everyone?

Except Crowder & Jerebko.

[Robb]

Yes, they renounced everyone, going back years. Nenad Krstic, Shaq, Starbury...  Lots of guys came off the cap.

They renounced everyone?

Except Crowder & Jerebko.

I'm having a hard time finding an announcement of who exactly was renounced. Any help?

[Roy H.]

Yes, they renounced everyone, going back years. Nenad Krstic, Shaq, Starbury...  Lots of guys came off the cap.

They renounced everyone?

Except Crowder & Jerebko.

I'm having a hard time finding an announcement of who exactly was renounced. Any help?

Check out Eric Pincus' twitter, from around 2am.

https://mobile.twitter.com/EricPincus

[Robb]

Yes, they renounced everyone, going back years. Nenad Krstic, Shaq, Starbury...  Lots of guys came off the cap.

They renounced everyone?

Except Crowder & Jerebko.

I'm having a hard time finding an announcement of who exactly was renounced. Any help?

Check out Eric Pincus' twitter, from around 2am.

https://mobile.twitter.com/EricPincus

I'd seen that, thanks, but I thought they had more. Kevin O'Connor even mentions that they forgot Dana Barros who was my personal favorite.  Anyway, not that big of a deal.

[Celtics4ever]

Jonas and Amir's are one year with an option so we still have some wiggle room.

[bdm860]

Just pulling from the Celtics ShamSpors page, if they did renounce everyone the list would include (minus any players who actually played on the team last year):

Nenad Krstic
Roshown McLeod
Stephon Marbury
Carlos Arroyo
Dana Barros
P.J. Brown
Mark Bryant
Michael Finley
Grant Long
Michael Olowokandi
Shaquille O'Neal
Scot Pollard
Chris Wilcox

[hodgy03038]

Why would they wait until now to renounce? What benefit is it not to renounce? Do they think Shaq may be coming back to play? This is confusing.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Why would they wait until now to renounce? What benefit is it not to renounce? Do they think Shaq may be coming back to play? This is confusing.

Not that confusing when you see it from the other side... what's the harm of keeping their bird rights? Absolutely none, so you just don't.

[hodgy03038]

Why would they wait until now to renounce? What benefit is it not to renounce? Do they think Shaq may be coming back to play? This is confusing.

Not that confusing when you see it from the other side... what's the harm of keeping their bird rights? Absolutely none, so you just don't.

Isn't the harm that they still affect the salary cap? Why keep money affecting the salary cap on players that will never come back? I don't see the benefit.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Why would they wait until now to renounce? What benefit is it not to renounce? Do they think Shaq may be coming back to play? This is confusing.

Not that confusing when you see it from the other side... what's the harm of keeping their bird rights? Absolutely none, so you just don't.

Isn't the harm that they still affect the salary cap? Why keep money affecting the salary cap on players that will never come back? I don't see the benefit.

It doesn't affect the salary cap if you were going to be over the cap anyways. Really, this is such a non-issue on that front.

[Boris Badenov]

Why would they wait until now to renounce? What benefit is it not to renounce? Do they think Shaq may be coming back to play? This is confusing.

Not that confusing when you see it from the other side... what's the harm of keeping their bird rights? Absolutely none, so you just don't.

Isn't the harm that they still affect the salary cap? Why keep money affecting the salary cap on players that will never come back? I don't see the benefit.

I think there's a difference between a cap hold and actual salary money spent.

The cap hold affects whether we have room under the cap to sign someone.

Actual salary dollars spent affects luxury tax, etc.

These are cap holds:

A team's cap room (referred to simply as "room" in the CBA) refers to its ability to sign players to free agent contracts. If a team is above the cap, then its room is limited to the exceptions it possesses. If the team is below the cap, then its room is how far it is below the cap when all salaries and cap holds are included. Cap holds are "placeholders" for players the team is expected to sign in the future. For example, a team is expected to sign its unsigned first round draft pick, so an amount is reserved for this signing in the form of a cap hold. The following are included in team salary:

Salaries of all active and inactive players1, including likely bonuses.
The full season salary of any players the team acquires in midseason trades.
Salaries paid or payable to waived players, minus any set-off amounts2 and subject to the Stretch provision (see question number 66).
Any salary still being paid to retired players (see question number 63).
A cap hold for amounts paid or expected to be paid in conjunction with certain grievances.
A cap hold for salaries in contracts that have been agreed to but not yet executed (i.e., verbal agreements or agreements pending physicals).
A cap hold for a percentage of the previous salary of every unrenounced free agent

[hodgy03038]

Okay so.....

it's a good thing to not renounce because it's a good thing to stay over the cap unless you need to sign somebody

but it can be a good thing to renounce because you may be able to sign players and stay under the cap.

The NBA economics is ridiculous. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Thanks for your input guys. Obviously you understand it much better than I ever will.

[Boris Badenov]

Okay so.....

it's a good thing to not renounce because it's a good thing to stay over the cap unless you need to sign somebody

but it can be a good thing to renounce because you may be able to sign players and stay under the cap.

The NBA economics is ridiculous. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Thanks for your input guys. Obviously you understand it much better than I ever will.

There are a few people here (not me, BWC, saltlover and a few others come to mind) who are real experts. I have to go look things up half the time.

You're right though. It makes the tax code look like a model of simplicity. Lucky for us Danny has a firm grip on things, a great cap guru, and the persistence to squeeze every advantage out of the system. It's helped us a lot over the last few years.

[BudweiserCeltic]

Okay so.....

it's a good thing to not renounce because it's a good thing to stay over the cap unless you need to sign somebody

but it can be a good thing to renounce because you may be able to sign players and stay under the cap.

The NBA economics is ridiculous. It just doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

Thanks for your input guys. Obviously you understand it much better than I ever will.

Let me put it this way, renouncing bird rights if you need to use cap space is not a hurdle to overcome. It's a simple straightforward decision, it has no effect on your decision making or buying power when you have the opportunity to use cap space.

When it only matters is when you have active players, players you might be of value to you and you have to make a decision on them, whether to retain their rights or not.

But otherwise, having this cap hold on the books is pretty much a technicality of no real consequence or burden.