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Question about Marcus Smart
« on: June 16, 2015, 12:21:25 PM »

Offline Maurice98

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I love this kid. I think his work ethic is spectacular, his intensity on the court is matched by few people, he's a winner, hustler and in the long-haul I really think that he will be one of the best contributor in the C's future.

However, I got one question. Why didn't he attacked the rim more last year (even though he showed flashes of it late in the season and during the playoffs)?

I got few answers but don't know if they apply to him:
  • He's too slow and has a below average first step for PGs, so he struggle to attack the rim, therefore he should shed some weight or play SG.
  • Brad told him to focus more on his 3pt shooting, so he has to develop a reliable 3pt shot before starting to attack the rim a lot more.
  • Lack of confidence in his ability to drive.
  • His ball-handling skills is really poor.
  • Ankle injuries bothered him a lot that he couldn't move  that well.
  • NBA speed is too fast for him.
  • His method to bully players to the rim isn't effective as it was in college.
  • Low usage, so lack of touches meaning that he couldn't drive as much as he wanted to and he was limited to spot ups.

He's an elite defender already and his offensive output is decent. His offensive ceiling is way higher because if his shooting remains more consistent and start to attack to the rim more while developing PG skills, I think he will be able to put it together and potential to be an All Star.

What do y'all think?

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #1 on: June 16, 2015, 12:29:20 PM »

Offline Evantime34

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I think it was a combination of #3 (although I would say more of a lack of confidence in his ability to finish drives), #4, #5 and #7.

I could also be talked into #2.

#1 is really the inflection point. If you believe it to be true his upside is limited, if you don't you think he can be a truly great player.
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Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #2 on: June 16, 2015, 12:36:34 PM »

Offline Ilikesports17

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I think all of these played a factor.

The big one for me would be 1,3,6 and 7 because I think they go hand in hand and are very similar and improveable.

Marcus doesnt have John Wall quickness, so he cant blow by people. His physical gifts are no longer to the point where he can just close his eyes and get to the hoop. However, there is a bright side.

As the game slows down for him and I think you saw it start to in the playoffs (where the game usually speed up) he will be able to use some savvy and intelligence in getting to the hoop.

Once he feels the game is going at his speed the confidence will rise rapidly and he will be able to more methodically get to the hoop, changing direction and using his body not to bowl through people but to put his very strong body between the ball and the defender making it difficult for defenders to stop him without fouling.

Im not sure how legit the ankle thing is but his handle will certainly improve over time, and once those things happen, brad will, I assume, trust him much more to play a more central role in the offense.

I am very excited to see Smart develop in this area.

The only thing I think you missed that contributed to his struggles is that he may have had some issues finishing at the rim which could probably be lumped in with the confidence thing. However, in the Cleveland series and the last few games of the year you saw him start to incorporate a nice floater into his game.

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #3 on: June 16, 2015, 12:40:20 PM »

Offline Maurice98

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I think it was a combination of #3 (although I would say more of a lack of confidence in his ability to finish drives), #4, #5 and #7.

I could also be talked into #2.

#1 is really the inflection point. If you believe it to be true his upside is limited, if you don't you think he can be a truly great player.

Really appreciate your opinion and I believe his upside is huge.

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #4 on: June 16, 2015, 12:53:56 PM »

Offline Evantime34

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I think it was a combination of #3 (although I would say more of a lack of confidence in his ability to finish drives), #4, #5 and #7.

I could also be talked into #2.

#1 is really the inflection point. If you believe it to be true his upside is limited, if you don't you think he can be a truly great player.

Really appreciate your opinion and I believe his upside is huge.
No problem. TP.

I also believe his upside is huge. I feel like he is going to outwork most people in the league which makes me very optimistic.
DKC:  Rockets
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Next 3 picks: 4.14, 4.15, 4.19

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #5 on: June 16, 2015, 12:55:20 PM »

Offline footey

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He showed flashes of being able to drive inside, and post up, during summer league, but never got the confidence to do it during regular season.

Ditto Olynyk, who was a lot more aggressive and relaxed during summer league play. I think for Ollie, he gets self conscious shooting too much, and upsetting the vets, which is not an issue during the summer play.

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #6 on: June 16, 2015, 01:01:19 PM »

Offline Csfan1984

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Response to answers via edit
  • He's fast enough to get angle but not enough to blow by. Much of the game is pick and roll though where Smart shows promise. His size helps him score if he only gets angle as well.
  • Brad told him to focus more on his role which was not to create but assist in moving the ball and spacing the floor, so he has to continue to develop in all those areas and more.
  • Lack of confidence and decision making has limited his drive attempts not the ability to drive.
  • His ball-handling skills are good if they were not teams would press him like they do AB. Pros respect his handles.
  • Ankle injuries bothered him a bit and made physical performance  inconsistent.
  • New offense and roles changing affected his scoring and ability to create .
  • His method to bully players to the rim isn't effective as it was in college. This is very true but he can still push most PGs back like Lowery does.
  • Low usage, constant bail out shots, playing with Turner and IT means that he couldn't drive as much as other PGs do. He will not be doing a lot of driving unless his role is upgraded.

He's an elite defender already and his offensive output is decent for a rookie. His offensive ceiling is still high because he is young and has has great work ethic to improve his shooting while developing PG skills. I think he will be able to put it together and has potential to be an All Star.

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #7 on: June 16, 2015, 01:13:54 PM »

Offline positivitize

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9. No one passed him the ball til 5 seconds are left in the shotclock.

Seriously. Go and watch ET and IT dribble/pick n roll with everyone out there for 30 seconds, 7/10 times they took the shot themselves. 3/10 they'd pass the ball to Smart for the bail out. Pressey never even LOOKED his way.

That'll change.
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Kanter, Semi, Theis, Poierier

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #8 on: June 16, 2015, 01:14:43 PM »

Offline manl_lui

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I think it was a combination of #3 (although I would say more of a lack of confidence in his ability to finish drives), #4, #5 and #7.

I could also be talked into #2.

#1 is really the inflection point. If you believe it to be true his upside is limited, if you don't you think he can be a truly great player.

Really appreciate your opinion and I believe his upside is huge.
No problem. TP.

I also believe his upside is huge. I feel like he is going to outwork most people in the league which makes me very optimistic.

I think it's a combination of 2, 3, 5, 6 and 8

I think his speed is just fine as he showed flashes getting to the rim from time to time. He did mention that his ankle injury played a role in him being not being as effective so I want to believe that. And also, he wasn't our first, second or even third option on offense, so 8 is definitely a factor. Not that I'm saying he should be our number 1 option, but I think as he gets the offseason to rest, he should be ready to go for the season and we shall judge what his offense really looks like then.

I love his work ethics, and wished KG was still here to mentor him. His intensity and just his mentality of "someone will always work harder than you" really reminds me of KG.

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #9 on: June 16, 2015, 01:29:14 PM »

Offline littleteapot

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#1 is true - Smart isn't as quick as most starting NBA point guards. I don't think this means he can't become a good driver at some point though. He's more athletic than Dragic and Dragic can get  to the rim.

You don't need all the skills to take advantage of your offensive talent, but Smart needs to work on several. Right now there's a combination of the fact that opponent's don't respect his jumper, he's not super quick, he doesn't really have any face up moves like a crossover, and he doesn't seem very smooth with the moves he does attempt.

He doesn't have to be good at all of this. He just needs to get better in some areas so he can use what he does have, which is a ton of strength.
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Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #10 on: June 16, 2015, 02:01:13 PM »

Offline Maurice98

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Response to answers via edit
  • He's fast enough to get angle but not enough to blow by. Much of the game is pick and roll though where Smart shows promise. His size helps him score if he only gets angle as well.
  • Brad told him to focus more on his role which was not to create but assist in moving the ball and spacing the floor, so he has to continue to develop in all those areas and more.
  • Lack of confidence and decision making has limited his drive attempts not the ability to drive.
  • His ball-handling skills are good if they were not teams would press him like they do AB. Pros respect his handles.
  • Ankle injuries bothered him a bit and made physical performance  inconsistent.
  • New offense and roles changing affected his scoring and ability to create .
  • His method to bully players to the rim isn't effective as it was in college. This is very true but he can still push most PGs back like Lowery does.
  • Low usage, constant bail out shots, playing with Turner and IT means that he couldn't drive as much as other PGs do. He will not be doing a lot of driving unless his role is upgraded.

He's an elite defender already and his offensive output is decent for a rookie. His offensive ceiling is still high because he is young and has has great work ethic to improve his shooting while developing PG skills. I think he will be able to put it together and has potential to be an All Star.

TP! All of the above is true.

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #11 on: June 16, 2015, 02:03:51 PM »

Offline manl_lui

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Response to answers via edit
  • He's fast enough to get angle but not enough to blow by. Much of the game is pick and roll though where Smart shows promise. His size helps him score if he only gets angle as well.
  • Brad told him to focus more on his role which was not to create but assist in moving the ball and spacing the floor, so he has to continue to develop in all those areas and more.
  • Lack of confidence and decision making has limited his drive attempts not the ability to drive.
  • His ball-handling skills are good if they were not teams would press him like they do AB. Pros respect his handles.
  • Ankle injuries bothered him a bit and made physical performance  inconsistent.
  • New offense and roles changing affected his scoring and ability to create .
  • His method to bully players to the rim isn't effective as it was in college. This is very true but he can still push most PGs back like Lowery does.
  • Low usage, constant bail out shots, playing with Turner and IT means that he couldn't drive as much as other PGs do. He will not be doing a lot of driving unless his role is upgraded.

He's an elite defender already and his offensive output is decent for a rookie. His offensive ceiling is still high because he is young and has has great work ethic to improve his shooting while developing PG skills. I think he will be able to put it together and has potential to be an All Star.

TP! All of the above is true.

beautifully put

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #12 on: June 16, 2015, 02:59:04 PM »

Offline BDeCosta26

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A simple question with a complex answer.

Even though Smart was a huge factor in our late season surge and played good minutes, he was really the 4th or 5th option on offense just about every time on the floor. The kid hardly even brought the ball up court much last year. Stevens knew early on with Smart that his elite-level defense was going to earn him significant PT, but his offensive skills weren't equally deserving. So, to offset, CBS parked him near the 3 point line and had him work on his jump shot.

Developing his jump shot will be the key to how successful he is in this league. We saw towards the end of the year that the ankle was a legit problem through the season and as it got better, he was considerably more explosive. He'll be able to drive to basket and generate FT's consistently in the NBA. He started doing it well towards the end of last year, and that will continue. What's gonna make the difference is how consistent that jumper becomes. If he becomes a 35-40 % 3-PT shooter and the rest of his game rounds out as it should, I think he can easily be an All-Star.

I don't think it even really matters if he stays at the 1 or moves to the 2. His passing skills and court vision were better than I expected last season. His basketball IQ and intangibles are sky-high and while his handle needs improvement, it's not awful. I think that versatility is good in the sense that he could play with a lot of other kinds of guards. If our roster forms in such a way that he moves to the 2, it's fine because with the improved shot he can play both on and off the ball pretty well.

Context matters when looking at Smart's rookie year. It's important to remember that of all rookies who saw big minutes last year, only us and Chicago (Mirotic), were really competing to win every game. When we traded Rondo and Green, I think people latched onto this idea that Smart, Young, Sully etc.. were gonna be playing 30 minutes a game and handed the keys to the offense so they could play through their mistakes but that just didn't happen. We made a playoff run, won some games and Marcus still managed to play a major role in that as a rookie. Some people just look at the stat line and think he had a mediocre year but that wasn't the case at all. It's really hard to score points when plays aren't really called for you. It's hard to get dimes when your not initiating the offense. He's was a rookie, if your trying to win games you can't center your offense around a guy that young.

We should be thrilled to have this kid. His defense is truly elite and as he grows into his game I think he'll have a legit shot at a DPOY of the year award or two and multiple All-NBA defensive teams. At the VERY least I think he can become a Tony Allen-like player with a better jump shot and a more well rounded offensive game. His ceiling is much, much higher than that. Something like a poor mans D-Wade with a better shot. And let's not forget, TA is one of the three most important players on a Memphis team that has competed for WC titles and who I'd like to think woulda at least made it to the final once if they were in the East. So if all Smart ever becomes is a better-on-offense version of TA, he could still be one of the key cogs in our next contender. But if he reaches his potential, he could be special. And I would put money on Smart putting in the work necessary to reach that level. His leadership, work ethic, tenacity, hustle and effort are nearly unparalleled from a rookie. When you combine that with his talent, the results could be spectacular.

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #13 on: June 16, 2015, 03:41:13 PM »

Offline GC003332

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9. No one passed him the ball til 5 seconds are left in the shotclock.

Seriously. Go and watch ET and IT dribble/pick n roll with everyone out there for 30 seconds, 7/10 times they took the shot themselves. 3/10 they'd pass the ball to Smart for the bail out. Pressey never even LOOKED his way.

That'll change.

Don't want him to steal anymore of their minutes than he already has.Pro ball baby 8)

Re: Question about Marcus Smart
« Reply #14 on: June 16, 2015, 03:55:56 PM »

Offline LGC88

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A simple question with a complex answer.

Even though Smart was a huge factor in our late season surge and played good minutes, he was really the 4th or 5th option on offense just about every time on the floor. The kid hardly even brought the ball up court much last year. Stevens knew early on with Smart that his elite-level defense was going to earn him significant PT, but his offensive skills weren't equally deserving. So, to offset, CBS parked him near the 3 point line and had him work on his jump shot.

Developing his jump shot will be the key to how successful he is in this league. We saw towards the end of the year that the ankle was a legit problem through the season and as it got better, he was considerably more explosive. He'll be able to drive to basket and generate FT's consistently in the NBA. He started doing it well towards the end of last year, and that will continue. What's gonna make the difference is how consistent that jumper becomes. If he becomes a 35-40 % 3-PT shooter and the rest of his game rounds out as it should, I think he can easily be an All-Star.

I don't think it even really matters if he stays at the 1 or moves to the 2. His passing skills and court vision were better than I expected last season. His basketball IQ and intangibles are sky-high and while his handle needs improvement, it's not awful. I think that versatility is good in the sense that he could play with a lot of other kinds of guards. If our roster forms in such a way that he moves to the 2, it's fine because with the improved shot he can play both on and off the ball pretty well.

Context matters when looking at Smart's rookie year. It's important to remember that of all rookies who saw big minutes last year, only us and Chicago (Mirotic), were really competing to win every game. When we traded Rondo and Green, I think people latched onto this idea that Smart, Young, Sully etc.. were gonna be playing 30 minutes a game and handed the keys to the offense so they could play through their mistakes but that just didn't happen. We made a playoff run, won some games and Marcus still managed to play a major role in that as a rookie. Some people just look at the stat line and think he had a mediocre year but that wasn't the case at all. It's really hard to score points when plays aren't really called for you. It's hard to get dimes when your not initiating the offense. He's was a rookie, if your trying to win games you can't center your offense around a guy that young.

We should be thrilled to have this kid. His defense is truly elite and as he grows into his game I think he'll have a legit shot at a DPOY of the year award or two and multiple All-NBA defensive teams. At the VERY least I think he can become a Tony Allen-like player with a better jump shot and a more well rounded offensive game. His ceiling is much, much higher than that. Something like a poor mans D-Wade with a better shot. And let's not forget, TA is one of the three most important players on a Memphis team that has competed for WC titles and who I'd like to think woulda at least made it to the final once if they were in the East. So if all Smart ever becomes is a better-on-offense version of TA, he could still be one of the key cogs in our next contender. But if he reaches his potential, he could be special. And I would put money on Smart putting in the work necessary to reach that level. His leadership, work ethic, tenacity, hustle and effort are nearly unparalleled from a rookie. When you combine that with his talent, the results could be spectacular.

TP
Also, Smart said he lost his explosive ability since he injured his ankle in early november. His ankle never fully recover and it was painful the entire season. I don't think Smart is the type of guy that will look for excuses, so I trust him saying the truth. In other word if you never enter the paint at nba level and your ankle handicap you, it is perfectly normal you don't even try. Am I wrong?