Why did we not go after Mosgov?

[gpap]

It took 2 first round picks to get Mozgov during a time when Denver is doing a fire sale.

The obession with "rim protectors" needs to stop. Our goal is to find top talent players, and our assets should be used to find those.

I don't understand what you're trying to say.

1.) The Celts need a legit center. You may refer to that as an obsession but it's the truth. This small ball crap never works. If we had a legit center like Mozgov this season, only lord knows how much better we could've been. I am not saying Mozgov is a world beater but even a semi-decent center can make a difference. Zeller is more of a back up than a starter.

2.)I agree our goal should be to find top talent players, but those players also shouldn't all be guards and forwards. Again, we need a presence in the paint to rebound, block and give some hell to the opposing team when they try to gain possession of the ball.

[gpap]

It took 2 first round picks to get Mozgov during a time when Denver is doing a fire sale.

The obession with "rim protectors" needs to stop. Our goal is to find top talent players, and our assets should be used to find those.

We need an athletes in the post to win would be more correct. WCS may be one of the best in a long time. You can play small if you have a guy like Dryamond Green. But is better to be able to go both ways if possible.

Let's pump the brakes on Willy Cauley Stein. We haven't seen him play a single NBA game yet.

[gpap]

Timofey Mozgov is a great example of the fact that you can put any 7-footer with Lebron and he'll look like a good basketball player.

Really?

What about Brendan Haywood. He's 7 feet and has been gathering dust sitting on the bench all year.

[gpap]

It's too bad we can't view an alternate reality and see how well Tyler Zeller would have done in the same circumstances. He's a different kind of player, but he may have done just as well on net.

Mozgov is a better rebounder and does a better job of carving out space in the paint.

[D.o.s.]

Timofey Mozgov is a great example of the fact that you can put any 7-footer with Lebron and he'll look like a good basketball player.

Like Kendrick Perkins?

Mozgov is just a really solid center, he's playing against a small ball lineup and is doing what he's supposed to do in that situation. And yes, James certainly helps his situation a bit. I'm glad to see Mozgov playing so well.

Mozgov has been pretty much the same player his entire career.  He saw a slight up tick in FG% once he joined the Cavs, but I'm sure that had as much to do with Kevin Love as it did with Lebron James.  In the finals it is more about the Cavs just not having anyone else and Golden State playing a 6'7" guy on him in the paint.  If you look at his rates though, he has been basically the same player his whole career and his last full season in Denver was his best overall season.

Exactly. The reason no one was clamoring for Mozgov is because Mozgov is not worth clamoring for.

[wayupnorth]

Because he still isn't a particularly great asset.

He shored up the Cavaliers tremendously, but this is a perfect example of a player in the right place at the right time.

Well yes, anyone is going to look better playing alongside Lebron James. But let's be clear, Mosgov has established himself in the playoffs as one of the top two way big men in the NBA.  He really plays hard, he is huge, he has a nice shooting touch, he makes his free throws, he rebounds, blocks shots. I would take him straight up over DeAndre Jordan.  Not sure which centers (excluding Anthony Davis, who is really a power forward) are better all around than Mosgov.

Wow. Top two way big men?

You are getting way ahead of yourself.

[clover]

Timofey Mozgov is a great example of the fact that you can put any 7-footer with Lebron and he'll look like a good basketball player.

Like Kendrick Perkins?

Mozgov is just a really solid center, he's playing against a small ball lineup and is doing what he's supposed to do in that situation. And yes, James certainly helps his situation a bit. I'm glad to see Mozgov playing so well.

Mozgov has been pretty much the same player his entire career.  He saw a slight up tick in FG% once he joined the Cavs, but I'm sure that had as much to do with Kevin Love as it did with Lebron James.  In the finals it is more about the Cavs just not having anyone else and Golden State playing a 6'7" guy on him in the paint.  If you look at his rates though, he has been basically the same player his whole career and his last full season in Denver was his best overall season.

Exactly. The reason no one was clamoring for Mozgov is because Mozgov is not worth clamoring for.

Mozgov's a comfortable double-double per 36 (14-10 for his career), also gets a couple pf blocks in and is decent at the FT line. Big body and good defender, a career PER over 15 and a career TS% of .577.

He's always been a decent player. NYK started high on him and then IMO soured on their rookie too quickly. But as a big man he's in his prime now.

[fairweatherfan]

Timofey Mozgov is a great example of the fact that you can put any 7-footer with Lebron and he'll look like a good basketball player.

Really?

What about Brendan Haywood. He's 7 feet and has been gathering dust sitting on the bench all year.

Or look a little farther up the bench at the ghost of Kendrick Perkins.

[gpap]

Timofey Mozgov is a great example of the fact that you can put any 7-footer with Lebron and he'll look like a good basketball player.

Like Kendrick Perkins?

Mozgov is just a really solid center, he's playing against a small ball lineup and is doing what he's supposed to do in that situation. And yes, James certainly helps his situation a bit. I'm glad to see Mozgov playing so well.

Mozgov has been pretty much the same player his entire career.  He saw a slight up tick in FG% once he joined the Cavs, but I'm sure that had as much to do with Kevin Love as it did with Lebron James.  In the finals it is more about the Cavs just not having anyone else and Golden State playing a 6'7" guy on him in the paint.  If you look at his rates though, he has been basically the same player his whole career and his last full season in Denver was his best overall season.

Exactly. The reason no one was clamoring for Mozgov is because Mozgov is not worth clamoring for.

Except for the Cavs who gave up 2 1st rounders to acquire him and are now in the finals.

[gpap]

Timofey Mozgov is a great example of the fact that you can put any 7-footer with Lebron and he'll look like a good basketball player.

Really?

What about Brendan Haywood. He's 7 feet and has been gathering dust sitting on the bench all year.

Or look a little farther up the bench at the ghost of Kendrick Perkins.

Yeah, only thing Perkins is good for now is being a thug and coming into games to save the hide of his new boyfriend Lebron.

[hwangjini_1]

Because he still isn't a particularly great asset.

He shored up the Cavaliers tremendously, but this is a perfect example of a player in the right place at the right time.

Well yes, anyone is going to look better playing alongside Lebron James. But let's be clear, Mosgov has established himself in the playoffs as one of the top two way big men in the NBA.  He really plays hard, he is huge, he has a nice shooting touch, he makes his free throws, he rebounds, blocks shots. I would take him straight up over DeAndre Jordan.  Not sure which centers (excluding Anthony Davis, who is really a power forward) are better all around than Mosgov.

seems a bit premature to anoint him as one of the top two way big men in the nba due to the playoffs. prior to arriving in cleveland he certainly didnt appear that way during the first 4 or so years of his career.

even in the regular season with cleveland he averaged 10.6 points and  6.9 rebounds a game. those are nice numbers, but nothing to rave about.

a quick check showed 17 other big men who averaged more points/game. he was 21st in rebounding in the league. (5 sf were ahead of him.) in terms of blocks, he ranks 8th, 5th among centers.

again, nice numbers. but to label him one of the "top two way" big men in the nba? i just dont see that. instead, i think i see hyperbole based upon being on a national stage. mozgov being in cleveland is ideal for him and his game.

[fairweatherfan]

Timofey Mozgov is a great example of the fact that you can put any 7-footer with Lebron and he'll look like a good basketball player.

Really?

What about Brendan Haywood. He's 7 feet and has been gathering dust sitting on the bench all year.

Or look a little farther up the bench at the ghost of Kendrick Perkins.

Yeah, only thing Perkins is good for now is being a thug and coming into games to save the hide of his new boyfriend Lebron.

Well that escalated quickly.

[BudweiserCeltic]

It took 2 first round picks to get Mozgov during a time when Denver is doing a fire sale.

The obession with "rim protectors" needs to stop. Our goal is to find top talent players, and our assets should be used to find those.

I don't understand what you're trying to say.

1.) The Celts need a legit center. You may refer to that as an obsession but it's the truth. This small ball crap never works. If we had a legit center like Mozgov this season, only lord knows how much better we could've been. I am not saying Mozgov is a world beater but even a semi-decent center can make a difference. Zeller is more of a back up than a starter.

2.)I agree our goal should be to find top talent players, but those players also shouldn't all be guards and forwards. Again, we need a presence in the paint to rebound, block and give some hell to the opposing team when they try to gain possession of the ball.

I think it's quite straight forward.

Before worrying about trading away valuable assets (first rounders) just to improve our team's marginal talent and better balance our roster, we should focus our valuable assets in going after top level talent AND THEN worry about filling the gaps left over in the roster.

Who said anything about guards/forward?

Is Mozgov top talent? No. If he were and brought the so called rim protection we need as well, then awesome, but the infatuation of going HARD after players simply because they offer rim protection, which we currently lack, is a misuse of resources.

Using valuable assets to go after a player particularly because of his rim protection skills is not the way to go. It's a hole you fill with lesser assets if any. If we were in a contention position and this were the missing piece, then that would be something else.

But our team is still quite a few steps away from being in that position, and using some of our most valuable assets (picks and cap space) on marginal talent is not the way to go.

Celtics needing a legit center (whatever that means) comes secondary to getting top talent on this team, whatever his position it may be. If it so happens that it's a center, then awesome.

But all this crying about we missing out on some rim protectors misses the goal completely.

[Who]

(1) Cleveland is a dreadful offensive team without K-Love and Kyrie.
(2) LeBron demands huge amounts of defensive attention from opposing team's team defense

.... which results in:

Mozgov on receiving end of far more opportunities to score than he would get anywhere else in the league and those opportunities are usually very good due to the attention LeBron gets as well as LeBron's passing ability.

Mozgov wouldn't be doing nearly as well in a different situation. On a team with real offensive firepower. Or on a team that lacked a star like LeBron who gets all that defensive attention and has the passing ability to expose gaps in opposing team's team defense.

Mozgov has some talent but the situation he is overstates that talent.

Edit: Good point about opposing team's often playing undersized centers. That matters too.

[BudweiserCeltic]

On Mozgov, keep in mind against whom he's being doing his damage.

Celtics - lacked big men
Atlanta - lacked big men
Golden State - Play small often (Draymond Green started at center last game!)

Look how well he played when he was faced with some big men who are capable defenders against Chicago. Not so good.

All's been roses for him so far, but he's had the match-up advantage in just about every series... from a physical perspective, going against teams who lacked big man who often used PFs as Centers or had centers that are defensive liabilities.

I'm not saying this because I'm down on Mozgov, I like him, but a bit of context and perspective here is required.

Golden State does have Bogut.... but I think Thompson at PF with Green also causes some problems there that makes it a bit difficult for them. But as I said, they go small often as well.