The 5/19/2015 draft lottery

[Neurotic Guy]

Have to vent.  Lakers are the only team that moves up.  Of course.  Always, Always get what they need.  LAL will be back in the hunt within 3 years.  Always.  Makes me sick.

[LarBrd33]

Have to vent.  Lakers are the only team that moves up.  Of course.  Always, Always get what they need.  LAL will be back in the hunt within 3 years.  Always.  Makes me sick.

I agree.  It sucks.  Figures once a decade we have a shot at a star prospect (1997, 2007, 2014) and every time we end up missing out by a pick or two.  Meanwhile, the Lakers dip their feet into the tank waters and walk away with a franchise big. 

Seeing the kind of assets some of these teams now have is pretty frustrating as a Celtic fan.  We're still looking for our first legitimate starter while these teams are amassing superstar prospects.

[Eddie20]

Been posting here for years, so don't think I'm bragging (or humble bragging), but while I am thrilled out of my ass about the pick, no one knows how Okafor is going to turn out. Given the fact that there have been so many bigs who have ended up busts (Bennett, Darko, Oden, Thabeet, Marvin Williams, Bogut [last two being busts relative to their draft position]), there's a somewhat decent chance that he ends up as one of them.

Heh... Okafor will be Al Jefferson at the worse. 

Lakers have a lot going right for them right now.  Clarkson just made 1st Team Rookie over our own Marcus Smart.  Julius Randle is a killer prospect.  Okafor is a beast.  Those 3 alone made a nice trio to build around (though I don't blame anyone for not being sold on Clarkson).  Then you add Kobe plus a couple signings this summer with their roughly 30 mil in cap space (Rondo and Kevin Love, prob)... Freakin Lakers.

It's going to take a special level of incompetence for the Lakers to blow this.   It will be fairly easy for them to roll into next season with Rondo, Kobe, Randle, Kevin Love, Okafor, Clarkson... then sign another max dude the year after... then another two max dudes the year after when Kobe retires.

Freakin Lakers.

Meanwhile, our Celtics are a team without a legitimate starter, a prospect with star potential (unless you count marcus smart... which is a stretch), or a draft pick that is likely to add a star.  We do have enough cap space to sign 1 max player though... so here's hoping Ainge pulls somethin off.  At least our coach is great.  U Jelly of our sweet coach, Lakerfan?

It's pretty obvious Clarkson was rewarded for chucking up shots/putting up numbers on an awful team. If Kobe doesn't get injured, Clarkson doesn't sniff 1st or 2nd team. It's not like he's the youngest rookie around either. Bradley is only 2 years older than him.

Did Randle suddenly get better following his broken leg? Did he grow? Since he measured only 6-7 without shoes. Did he improve his perimeter game since that was an issue as well? Are the questions of him finishing inside over length, something he struggled with because his 7-0 wingspan isn't the greatest, suddenly erased?

Once again, you overrate other players for being on opposing teams, but underrate our own guys simply for wearing green. If  we had the Lakers entire coaching staff and roster you would say the following:

- Randle and Okafor can't co-exist. Neither plays defense, neither has can stretch the floor offensively, and neither is a good FT shooter. Those [dang] (insert lottery winner here)! Towns is the next (insert exaggerated HOF player reference here) and we're stuck with at best the next Big Al.

- Randle is injury prone!

- Clarkson is overrated. He put stats up because his team was bad. He's old, which hurts his upside and he's a shoot first player. Yeah, Kobe is going to love him.

- Free agents won't sign with us. Nobody wants to play with Kobe and he's clogging up our cap space anyway.

- Scott is the worst coach in the NBA, who's going to want to play for him?

- Our management has been a laughing stock since Dr. Buss died. Players are leaving us for other teams (Gasol and Howard) and we aren't even the best team in our own city. When players talk about playing in LA they no longer talk about playing for us.

- We'll be in the lottery again next year and we'll likely have to give up that pick because of that wonderful Nash trade. Great, just great!

[mef730]

Random thoughts...

I personally prefer Towns, but I am surprised by the absolute certainty that so many have in the Towns vs Okafor debate.  Anyone who thinks they know how it will turn out is kidding themself.  It's way too early.

We are a mediocre team.  That's not meant as a criticism, since we are probably ahead of where anyone would have had us a couple of years ago.  We're probably on our way up, but it's not going to be pretty for a while and our best Celtics-specific draft pick likely topped out last year.  That's not sour grapes; I was firmly in the "anti-tank, pro-playoffs" camp, since I enjoyed watching them play, but that doesn't change the fact that we are still a borderline team in a lousy conference.

Next year, we will be the first team with three lottery picks in the same draft.  We'll be back in, Brooklyn will be in and Dallas will be in.  And, with any luck at all, Minnesota will be in.

And finally, I saw the following quotes:

"Kobe Bryant ?@kobebryant
We played like crap all season so it's only right we get the #2 pick HA #lakerluck #goodday
9:00 PM - 19 May 2015"

Coach Byron Scott, who represented the team at the lottery, said earning the No. 2 pick was "a little bit of a reward" after a difficult season.

Um, no, you don't "deserve" anything, particularly a reward.  We sucked, therefore you owe us?  Put another person in the camp for lottery reform.

Mike

[GC003332]

A side note of interest.
When the the lottery finished there was 65 votes in the poll, that increased by one later, someone was trying to go all Chad Fraud , I mean Chad Ford on here.

[Waew]

I don't regret we made the playoffs, but I don't understand people who are so anti-draft saying things like "it's a crapshoot" and all that. To an extent yes, because you don't always get superstars/all stars. Not every player turns out to be an MVP candidate. But high draft picks do give rebuilds a shot in the arm, whether as a player or as a trade chip.

I don't think any GM is drooling over KO or Sully, but Marcus Smart is the brightest spot on our roster and he's the product of a high draft pick. The Lakers, whom everyone had written off, is suddenly looking like they have a future with Randle and Okafor (most likely).

There were takers for Olynyk and Sullinger. At the same time the Pro tanking crowd keep saying that the Celtics are mediocre, they don't have a future! That can get annoying after a while.

But we are mediocre. And a top 9 draft pick could have helped us land someone like WCS or Stanley Johnson. Why does the truth get you upset? We would be sitting a lot better with that ninth pick right now.

The truth is that the Celtics went from lottery team to an eighth seeded team. To many people that's a young rising team. Mediocrity is where you have no draft picks and limited flexibility because you overpaid bad players.

we only seeded because the east is horrible. Were we even above .500? Doubt it.

[Who]

I wonder what the Lakers could get for Julius Randle on the open market.

I think it is still pretty similar to when he got drafted.

- A comparable lottery pick (6-9 range) or young prospect (Alex Len or Ben McLemore).
- A good young pro (say Harrison Barnes and maybe a low pick).
- A finisher article who is an average to slightly average starter (like Ty Lawson).

[Who]

Woj just tweeted that the Knicks pick will be available .

I still wonder what New York can get for the #4 in the trade market:

Atlanta -- not going to blow up a 60 win team
Boston - nothing to offer
Brooklyn - nothing to offer
Charlotte - nothing to offer
Chicago - Joakim Noah too old. Nothing else to offer. J.Butler a FA.
Cleveland - Kyrie Irving? Nope. Not going to blow up team.
Dallas - nothing to offer
Denver - Ty Lawson + Nurkic? Doubt that is enough either.
Detroit - Andre Drummond
Golden State - not going to blow up team
Houston - nothing to offer outside of Harden and Dwight.
Indiana - nothing to offer outside of Paul George
LA Clippers - not going to trade Blake Griffin
LA Lakers - nothing to offer
Memphis - nothing to offer. M.Gasol a FA.
Miami - Bosh? With his health problems and at his age? Nah.
Milwaukee - Giannis? Jabari Parker?
Minnesota - Nah
New Orleans - not enough to offer outside of A.Davis
OKC - nothing to offer
Orlando - Oladipo?
Philadelphia - Noel or Embiid?
Phoenix - not much to offer up
Portland - doubt they trade Lillard, doubt P.Jackson is high on Lillard. Aldridge a FA.
Sacramento - don't see them trading Cousins. Maybe a small trade down to #6 plus pick up an extra asset for their trouble. Kings add Mudiay or Russell to go with Cousins.
San Antonio - nothing to offer. Parker too old. Kawhi a FA.
Toronto - DeRozan? I think it would take something else on top of DeRozan. Maybe.
Utah - I can't see Utah splitting up Gobert-Favors. Hayward? Utah were really rolling in the 2nd of last season. Optimism very high for next season. Doubt they blow things up.
Washington - Bradley Beal? Doesn't look a Phil Jackson type of player to me. I think Washington will want to keep Beal + Wall together anyway to make a run at Durant in 2016 FA.


The trade market sucks. Very little availability right now.

I don't think the Knicks are going to have many options in trading that pick. Too many key guys are FAs this summer. Too many settled teams. Very few stars available. Most of those guys mentioned above are youngsters still on rookie contracts. 

[mkogav]

Five thoughts in regards to last night's draft lottery.


5. I L.O.V.E. the potential Minnesota lineup of Rubio, LaVine, Wiggins, Towns, & Dieng. That's a long lean defensive machine... well except for LaVine who doesn't know how to play D yet. If Rubio and Towns can develop consistent 3pt shots, e.g. > 35% 3pt FG%, that team will be pretty amazing in a few seasons.

4. I don't love the potential Minnesota lineup of Rubio, LaVine, Wiggins, Dieng, and Okafor as much. It's possible that the middle won't be too clogged b/c Okafor can hit 12 ft jumper, but it is not as dynamic on offense or defense.

3. Slowly NBA fans and media are realizing that while some teams are playing checkers and other are playing chess, the Sixers are playing xiangqi.

2. It irritates me that the Celtics have no luck in the lottery and that Lakers do. What is even more irritating is that I don't trust Flip Saunders to take Towns given that he's an old school guy, Okafor is an old-school NBA big man, and Okafor & Wiggins are buddies.

After missing out on Duncan, Durant, etc..., if Towns falls to the Lakers and develops into AD 2.0, I may just lose it!!!!

1. Knicks fans are losing their minds. As a Celtics fan, I get it. However, I can 100% guarantee that a perennial NBA All Star will be available at #4 in this June's draft. If I were Knicks fans, I would more worry about Phil either selecting the wrong player b/c they may fit better in the triangle or trading the pick for a veteran to play along side Carmelo.

Mk

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

Been posting here for years, so don't think I'm bragging (or humble bragging), but while I am thrilled out of my ass about the pick, no one knows how Okafor is going to turn out. Given the fact that there have been so many bigs who have ended up busts (Bennett, Darko, Oden, Thabeet, Marvin Williams, Bogut [last two being busts relative to their draft position]), there's a somewhat decent chance that he ends up as one of them.

Heh... Okafor will be Al Jefferson at the worse. 

Lakers have a lot going right for them right now.  Clarkson just made 1st Team Rookie over our own Marcus Smart.  Julius Randle is a killer prospect.  Okafor is a beast.  Those 3 alone made a nice trio to build around (though I don't blame anyone for not being sold on Clarkson).  Then you add Kobe plus a couple signings this summer with their roughly 30 mil in cap space (Rondo and Kevin Love, prob)... Freakin Lakers.

It's going to take a special level of incompetence for the Lakers to blow this.   It will be fairly easy for them to roll into next season with Rondo, Kobe, Randle, Kevin Love, Okafor, Clarkson... then sign another max dude the year after... then another two max dudes the year after when Kobe retires.

Freakin Lakers.

Meanwhile, our Celtics are a team without a legitimate starter, a prospect with star potential (unless you count marcus smart... which is a stretch), or a draft pick that is likely to add a star.  We do have enough cap space to sign 1 max player though... so here's hoping Ainge pulls somethin off.  At least our coach is great.  U Jelly of our sweet coach, Lakerfan?

It's pretty obvious Clarkson was rewarded for chucking up shots/putting up numbers on an awful team. If Kobe doesn't get injured, Clarkson doesn't sniff 1st or 2nd team. It's not like he's the youngest rookie around either. Bradley is only 2 years older than him.

Did Randle suddenly get better following his broken leg? Did he grow? Since he measured only 6-7 without shoes. Did he improve his perimeter game since that was an issue as well? Are the questions of him finishing inside over length, something he struggled with because his 7-0 wingspan isn't the greatest, suddenly erased?

Once again, you overrate other players for being on opposing teams, but underrate our own guys simply for wearing green. If  we had the Lakers entire coaching staff and roster you would say the following:

- Randle and Okafor can't co-exist. Neither plays defense, neither has can stretch the floor offensively, and neither is a good FT shooter. Those [dang] (insert lottery winner here)! Towns is the next (insert exaggerated HOF player reference here) and we're stuck with at best the next Big Al.

- Randle is injury prone!

- Clarkson is overrated. He put stats up because his team was bad. He's old, which hurts his upside and he's a shoot first player. Yeah, Kobe is going to love him.

- Free agents won't sign with us. Nobody wants to play with Kobe and he's clogging up our cap space anyway.

- Scott is the worst coach in the NBA, who's going to want to play for him?

- Our management has been a laughing stock since Dr. Buss died. Players are leaving us for other teams (Gasol and Howard) and we aren't even the best team in our own city. When players talk about playing in LA they no longer talk about playing for us.

- We'll be in the lottery again next year and we'll likely have to give up that pick because of that wonderful Nash trade. Great, just great!

I don't know if it's so much a matter of overrating players from other teams as it is about the fact that this is the Lakers, who seem to hardly ever have a bad year, and when they do, they seem to always turn it around quickly—they get lucky in the draft, they get franchise centers for peanuts, etc.

Sure, Byron Scott is a bad coach and Clarkson might be overrated.

Sure, the whole Kobe-Dwight-Nash experiment failed.

And sure, Kobe is aging.

But he's still dangerous. And they'll have the No. 2 pick (or trade it for an established young player such as Cousins). And they quite possibly could get Kevin Love. And they'll have cap space. And of course it's Hollywood, so nearly every player wants to play there.

I have hope for our young team, but (to play devil's advocate) I can see why some Celtics fans would be frustrated—because of how easily things could once again turn around quickly for the Lakers, and because despite how well Danny's done at positioning Boston with numerous assets, most of those assets aren't of the type that have teams knocking down our door, and none of our current players (including Smart) is projected to be a star.

So, if, as seems entirely possible, we can't get Cousins or Love (and forget pipe dreams like LeBron and Durant), how are we going to cash in all these assets? There's room for only so many rookies, and the odds are against any of these No. 13-, No. 16-, No. 18-type picks turning into anything special. I'm sure there's at least one pretty good player willing to take Boston's money (say, Greg Monroe), but are Stevens and a guy like Monroe going to be enough to attract a big-time free agent? And are Boston's best assets (Smart and, what, the Nets picks?) enough to entice a team to trade us a stud?

Boston had a much better season than the Lakers, but the Lakers could go zooming past us in just the next few months.

[GC003332]

Woj just tweeted that the Knicks pick will be available .

I still wonder what New York can get for the #4 in the trade market:

Atlanta -- not going to blow up a 60 win team
Boston - nothing to offer
Brooklyn - nothing to offer
Charlotte - nothing to offer
Chicago - Joakim Noah too old. Nothing else to offer. J.Butler a FA.
Cleveland - Kyrie Irving? Nope. Not going to blow up team.
Dallas - nothing to offer
Denver - Ty Lawson + Nurkic? Doubt that is enough either.
Detroit - Andre Drummond
Golden State - not going to blow up team
Houston - nothing to offer outside of Harden and Dwight.
Indiana - nothing to offer outside of Paul George
LA Clippers - not going to trade Blake Griffin
LA Lakers - nothing to offer
Memphis - nothing to offer. M.Gasol a FA.
Miami - Bosh? With his health problems and at his age? Nah.
Milwaukee - Giannis? Jabari Parker?
Minnesota - Nah
New Orleans - not enough to offer outside of A.Davis
OKC - nothing to offer
Orlando - Oladipo?
Philadelphia - Noel or Embiid?
Phoenix - not much to offer up
Portland - doubt they trade Lillard, doubt P.Jackson is high on Lillard. Aldridge a FA.
Sacramento - don't see them trading Cousins. Maybe a small trade down to #6 plus pick up an extra asset for their trouble. Kings add Mudiay or Russell to go with Cousins.
San Antonio - nothing to offer. Parker too old. Kawhi a FA.
Toronto - DeRozan? I think it would take something else on top of DeRozan. Maybe.
Utah - I can't see Utah splitting up Gobert-Favors. Hayward? Utah were really rolling in the 2nd of last season. Optimism very high for next season. Doubt they blow things up.
Washington - Bradley Beal? Doesn't look a Phil Jackson type of player to me. I think Washington will want to keep Beal + Wall together anyway to make a run at Durant in 2016 FA.


The trade market sucks. Very little availability right now.

I don't think the Knicks are going to have many options in trading that pick. Too many key guys are FAs this summer. Too many settled teams. Very few stars available. Most of those guys mentioned above are youngsters still on rookie contracts.

Presuming that Love stays in Cleveland, are they going to Max Thompson as well, lots of dollars invested in 4 guys.

[rocknrollforyoursoul]

Five thoughts in regards to last night's draft lottery.


5. I L.O.V.E. the potential Minnesota lineup of Rubio, LaVine, Wiggins, Towns, & Dieng. That's a long lean defensive machine... well except for LaVine who doesn't know how to play D yet. If Rubio and Towns can develop consistent 3pt shots, e.g. > 35% 3pt FG%, that team will be pretty amazing in a few seasons.

4. I don't love the potential Minnesota lineup of Rubio, LaVine, Wiggins, Dieng, and Okafor as much. It's possible that the middle won't be too clogged b/c Okafor can hit 12 ft jumper, but it is not as dynamic on offense or defense.

3. Slowly NBA fans and media are realizing that while some teams are playing checkers and other are playing chess, the Sixers are playing xiangqi.

2. It irritates me that the Celtics have no luck in the lottery and that Lakers do. What is even more irritating is that I don't trust Flip Saunders to take Towns given that he's an old school guy, Okafor is an old-school NBA big man, and Okafor & Wiggins are buddies.

After missing out on Duncan, Durant, etc..., if Towns falls to the Lakers and develops into AD 2.0, I may just lose it!!!!

1. Knicks fans are losing their minds. As a Celtics fan, I get it. However, I can 100% guarantee that a perennial NBA All Star will be available at #4 in this June's draft. If I were Knicks fans, I would more worry about Phil either selecting the wrong player b/c they may fit better in the triangle or trading the pick for a veteran to play along side Carmelo.

Mk

Knicks fans needn't get worked up about their bad luck last night—it's the Big Apple, so everyone and his brother wants to play there.

[spikelovetheCelts]

Have to vent.  Lakers are the only team that moves up.  Of course.  Always, Always get what they need.  LAL will be back in the hunt within 3 years.  Always.  Makes me sick.

They did not Get Chris Paul. I hate them but there is no bias.

[RMO]

I know it really means nothing but I looked up previous drafts.  I found it interesting that in the past 25 years only three players drafted in the top 5 have won championships with the teams that drafted them:  Tim Duncan, Darko Milcic and Dwyane Wade.  I'll admit this was some hasty research.

Lets not hand the championship to the lakers just yet.  Rebuilding takes a lot of time and some luck.  Anthony Davis is projected to be the next top player in the league and there's not a lot of talk about New Orleans winning the championship anytime soon. 

[SparzWizard]

I know it really means nothing but I looked up previous drafts.  I found it interesting that in the past 25 years only three players drafted in the top 5 have won championships with the teams that drafted them:  Tim Duncan, Darko Milcic and Dwyane Wade.  I'll admit this was some hasty research.

Lets not hand the championship to the lakers just yet.  Rebuilding takes a lot of time and some luck.  Anthony Davis is projected to be the next top player in the league and there's not a lot of talk about New Orleans winning the championship anytime soon.

That is because Golden State, Houston, Clippers, and Memphis are in their way for title contention. When OKC gets Westbrook, Durant, and Ibaka together again they'll be a force to reckon with in the West as well.

Once those teams are overdue...Pelicans and Lakers will be running the West again. Sigh.